Geotectonic Ocean Heat Transfer Theory Revisited

Off the Keyboard of RE

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I had a terrific discussion of Geotectonic Ocean Heat Transfer Theory with Gail Tverberg of Our Finite World in the Commentary of her recent article Reaching financial limits–What kinds of solutions are available?

It remains very important to consider the possibility/likelihood that the Global Climate Change we see occurring may not be Anthropogenic in origin. Many of the Policy Decisions and Economic decisions being made now are based on the idea that Cliimate Change is Anthropogenic, and that by pursuing Strategies like Carbon Tax Credits we might be able to alter the Climactic System enough to prevent further damage to the Ocean and Atmospheric systems currently being affected.

If it is true that the Earth is undergoing a Geological Phase Shift that is producing the effects, then it really does not pay to try and stop that, we won’t be able to do it.  Rather what we have to do is figure out means by which to live in a World vastly changed in Climate from what it is now. This could include such adaptations as shifting the locations where most people live to areas which might be more survivable, growing more food through Hydroponics in areas being DRENCHED with extensive Rainfall and moving food Production AWAY from areas experiencing Extreme Drought and perhaps even developing more Underground living arrangements to Ride Out the Storms, so to speak, until hopefully the situation reverts again once this cycle is done with.  If it does not revert,there really is not much to do about it, we are TOAST when the Phytoplankton Collapse.

Anyhow, below follows my discussion with Gail which clarifies many of these issues.  I suggest you read this and the original Geotectonic Ocean Heat Transfer Theory article here on the Diner before drawing the conclusion that Climate Change is necessarily Anthropogenic in Origin.





    Any more news on your theory about heat coming from the center of the earth, rather than atmospheric warming?



    • reverseengineerre says:



      The Good Newz would be that it appears we reached Peak Quakes in terms of frequency between 2004-2007 maxing out at a little over 30,000 Quakes/year of any magnitude globally. The Bad Newz would be that the largest magnitude quakes greater than Mag 5 are still showing significant and steady increase, with concomitant high energy releases far greater than thousands of Hiroshima Bombs dropped each year. These along with numerous 7+ quakes releasing energies which dwarf the Tsar Bomba, the largest thermonuclear device ever detonated.

      You can do the calculations yourself Gail, you’re an Actuary.  The increased Energy Release coming from the Earth over the last 20 years dwarfs the Heat Content of all the Oil and Coal burned since the beginning of the Industrial Revolution by several Orders of Magnitude. No contest between Mother Earth and Homo Sapiens as to who can ramp up Energy Release more.  Its like the Dallas Cowbows taking on the Pop Warner Fotball Team from Timbuktu.  If you know any Physics at all, you know by Conservation of Energy it has to go somewhere.  What is the Biggest Heat Sink on the surface of Planet Earth Gail?

      You want to check this for yourself, go visit Dlindquist’s website and the USGS Earthquake stats.






      I think I mentioned earlier that when I went to an actuarial meeting last year, one of the topics being discussed was the rise in large magnitude earthquakes, and the fact that it was of concern to insurers. So I wasn’t surprised at what you were showing.

      My physics is pretty limited. I’m afraid I don’t know how to compare earth movement to other types of energy. (I do know the energy has to go somewhere.)



    • reverseengineerre says:



      The Law of Conservation of Energy states, “Energy is neither Created nor Destroyed, only transformed from one form to another.”

      In the case of Fossil Fuels, the potential energy stored as chemical energy in the Bonds between the Carbon atoms.  When burned with Oxygen, said energy is released as Heat.  In the case of Nuclear Energy, the stored energy is inside the Nucleus and is far greater, and when Fission or Fusion occur, again you get energy released as Heat, along with High Energy radiation in the form of Gamma Rays and X-rays.  In Earthquakes, you have the potential energy stored mechanically, and the movement of large masses in the end is transformed into vibrations which transform to Heat.

      ALL of them are measured in the same units, Joules,Calories, BTUs whatever.  There is no fundamental difference between them all.  In any event, when a Quake goes off, unlike a Nuclear reaction it cannot change any of its mechanical energy into high energy radiation, it all has to go out as Heat.On the surface of the Earth, all this Heat really has one mainHeat Sink, and that is the Ocean which constitutes about 75%of the surface material, and Water has the second highest Heat Capacity of any known compound, the only greater one is Ammonia which does not exist in anywhere near the quantity water does on Earth.

      The only place for the Energy released by Quakes is into the World Oceans, and from there it gets radiated out into the Atmosphere in a variety of ways.  Many by increased Evaporationof the Water, driving more of it up into the atmosphere.  Thus you get the kind of extreme rainfall situation you see now in the Manila and in Shanghai, where apparently if you BELIEVE  Chinese Stats they relocated 1.5 MILLION People.

      There are other synergistic effects to consider from the changing gas mix in the atmosphere, but overall albedo effects tend to offset greenhouse effects so overall atmospheric temperature is not rising that rapidly.The primary source of the increased energy input here though?  Not the Sun, not the burned Fossil fuels either.  Its coming from deep down inside the Core of the Earth.  for whatever the reason, the Earth is dissipating at least one order of magnitude if not 2 greater energy now than 20 years ago.  That is  LOT of energy to transform to Heat.







      It had never occurred to me that the energy of the greater number / strength of earthquakes would be stored in the earth’s ocean as heat, or that the magnitude of the stored heat would be as high as you say. (Of course, my physics background is mostly what I have “picked up” here and there.)

      I remember that you posted a graph of the higher ocean temperature. Also a description of where you were able to calculate this from.

      You have also shown links to the rise in earthquakes, which seems to have tailed off a bit recently. Have you done an actual calculation of the amount of energy that would be stored from the increase in earthquakes to connect the two?

      Is this all in one post, or multiple places? I am not as good using your search engine as you are, and I sometimes forget what I have read where.



    • reverseengineerre says:



      The original article I wrote is actually a compilation of stuff I wrote together with a Geology buff named Stormbringer who I met on the Peak Oil message board. Together we ran one of the longest running threads on the board which went hundreds of pages deep during the Yellowstone Quake Swarm. I put it together in an article on the Diner

      In terms of total energy, the increase in Heat Content of the Oceans is greater than the summation of all the energies of the Quakes alone.  However, quakes are not the only method by which the Earth dissipates Heat, Vulcanism on the sea floor is extensive around the subduction zones and there is direct thermal radiation through the crust as well below the sea bed where it is the thinnest.  Sort of like a pot of water on a Hot Plate.

      The best way to see the correlation between the two is to overlay the graphs of the Quakes with the graph of the increasing Heat Content of the Oceans over the 20 year time span, they match in lock step.

      The most frightening correlation is one I came upon later, which is the rapidly decreasing pH or acidification that is resulting from this.  It probably comes from two places, increasing Sulfur emissions from subsea volcanoes and melting Clathrates releasing gobs of CO2 from the ocean floor and bubbling it straight up through the water.  This produces Sulfuric, Sulfurous and Carbonic Acid. At current rates of acidification, it probably takes no more than 30-50 years before the Ocean is too acidic to support any shell based sea life like Coral Reefs.  How long the phytoplankton can last is a more difficult question, because they probably can adapt to higher acidity to an extent.  If the phytoplankton collapse, we are of course all dead, Oxygen percentage in the atmosphere will drop rapidly after that and all higher animal life will go to the Great Beyond in short order.

      One can take a certain amount of HOPE looking at the now decreasing frequency of quakes that this will level off before it collapses the phytoplankton.  However, the energy dissipation is still quite large because the most powerful quakes are still on the increase. Only Time will tell on that one..






      Thanks! I see that the ocean heat content graph is actually one from a NOAA web site you link to.  No one can complain that you misinterpreted NOAA data.

      My chemistry background is only a little better than my physics background. I was presuming that the ocean acidification problems were coming only because of too much CO2 in the atmosphere. If the exposure is really form the bottom as well, this would increase the speed of acidification.

      If there is a different avenue of ocean/climate disturbance that is taking place, it seems like it would be worthwhile for someone with suitable background to write an article for an academic journal on the issue. Or perhaps post some comments on a blog that discusses more climate issues, where other climate modelers “hang out”.



    • reverseengineerre says:



      That would be me except I have the same opinion of Academic Journals I do for MSM outlets like Bizness Insider and Financial Sense.  In terms of discussing this on one of the Climate websites, that would be a bit like a Marxist arguing for Communism on Zero Hedge.  The Anthropogenic Group Think would swamp you in no time.  Discussing it with Guy McPherson for instance is like talking to a brick wall.


Born on the 4th of July

In our first of the new Diner Voices series, Diner and Blogger William Hunter Duncan  checks in with poignant musings from his Blog, Off the Grid in Minneapolis.


Discuss this article in the Epicurean Delights Parlor of the Diner


by William Hunter Duncan

I was reading about 9/11 this week. I know I'm a little behind the times, in that regard. I guess I always kind of knew, but maybe I didn't really want to know. An hour reading was all it took, to convince me, there is only one player on this planet truly capable of knocking down those three buildings in that way, and attacking the Pentagon in the way it was attacked, and that is my government. Or more accurately, the military/industrial complex. And the blame, while widespread, clearly rests with Dick Cheney and Donald Rumsfeld. They were maybe following orders from someone or some others, but they were the hands on de-architects, no doubt.

I'm returning to this because of all the chatter on the Internet about a potential false flag operation planned for the London Olympics this summer. Some people think it will be a faked alien invasion, others think a small nuclear or “dirty” bomb. Many are tying it into the so-called Illuminati and their goal of the new Zion, or total world domination. That weird ass emblem has an uncanny resemblance.

It shouldn't take a genius to figure out something is being planned. Barack “hegemon” Obama hasn't eviscerated the Constitution for nothing. Many are afraid the elite of the world are preparing to exterminate the majority of us. Did you hear the Department of Homeland Security purchased 450 million rounds of hollow point bullets recently? Why are international elite special forces running drills on the waterfront of Tampa Bay? Why are American soldiers running drills on the streets of St Louis? One might argue, the government is afraid of riots, should the global economy go into recession, and they want to be ready to restore calm. What's that they say, about the road to hell being paved with good intentions? Conversely, how can an elite military/industrial leadership capable of something on the scale of 9/11, have anything resembling good intentions? Forty caliber hollow point bullets for crowd control?

Meanwhile, word is out that phytoplankton are going the way of the dinosaurs. Phytoplankton. I know we humans like to think of ourselves as the center of the proverbial universe, but phytoplankton are the primordial foundation of the existing ocean food chain. Not only that, they provide an estimated 50% of the oxygen we breath. Why are they declining? Because we are toxifying the oceans with our burning of fossil fuels and our chemical making. If the phytoplankton are lost, the food chain of the ocean collapses, the ocean dies, the air is no longer breathable, we all die. Get it?

This is old news (that should be on the news every day, every minute, every second, what we are doing about it.) The new news is (which isn't reported either, except to say everything is fine), conventional oil supplies are on the decline, but wouldn't you know it, they've gone and saved the day by figuring out how to drill for oil in super deep ocean waters, dredging it out of the ground like coal, and fracking for it; the later two methods compromising our already polluted and strained fresh water supplies, the former threatening an already strained and polluted ocean (they can figure out these funky new extraction methods but not how to efficiently use the renewable power of the sun, sea and wind to generate power?) But don't just blame the oil industry. The chemical industry is pouring more than 100,000 different chemicals and chemical compounds into the air and water, daily. Of course, humans breathe air and drink water.  But that's ok, that they are polluting so wantonly, because we need economic growth more than we need breathable air and drinkable water, and really one of the few sectors where economic growth is even possible anymore, other than making weapons and bombs, is Health Care.


But clearly I do not know what I am talking about, and everything I'm saying is delusional, because if it were true, it would be reported in the mainstream media. Unless of course the mainstream media were simply appendages of the military/industrial complex. (Fuck you, Anderson Cooper, I don't care if you're gay or straight, you're no different than your high dollar cronies on the other end of the dial, Hannity, Limbaugh, et al – you're a well compensated shill for monsters.)

If you have the courage to put the pieces together, the reality is inescapable. Not only is humanity on a course of mass suicide, by way of mass global extinction, our elite global leadership may very well be conspiring to preempt such an outcome by killing off most of humanity. And if you think they aren't capable of that kind of logic, it doesn't matter, because if you're an American at least, there are 1.5 DHS hollow point bullets with your fate embedded in the lead. Whatever false flag operation there is planned, and the foil looks to be Iran, or Syria, it is merely an excuse to institute martial law, total global control, and probably elite managed mass death for the useless eaters and undesirables, basically, the non-militant and not-willing-to-be-a-slave sets.

So what has to happen? I'll tell you what I think needs to happen, assuming our leadership doesn't reverse course and start telling us the truth (acknowledging that just because I think this is what needs to happen doesn't make it a good idea, or even plausible. Think of it as me venting.) Fence off the DC beltway with concertina wire, let no one from Congress, the Pentagon, or K-street escape alive, empty out the executive suites and board rooms of the Fed, Wall Street and all the major banks and corporations, the major players in all the major family empires, the various billionaires, and basically the entire political class and their shill major media talking heads, and add them to the DC mix, and then leave them to cannibalize each other. Or just cut off their heads and be done with it. You know that fence surrounding the White House? The head of Dick Cheney on a spike right out front, with his new heart spiked to his forehead. Donald Rumsfeld on a spike next to him, with GW Bush on one side, and Barack Obama on the other. Ring the rest of it with the rest of Congress, and whatever other major players, and then toss the remaining on the grounds. There'd be heads overflowing, from the roof of the White House to the peak of the fence, yet hardly a percentage of all the sick fuck who have poisoned this earth and turned it, and us, into their private ATM.

But what am I saying? That's so awful! Well, if you think that, you haven't been paying attention.

Of course, all those elite monsters who are driving this military/industrial/technological/financial machine, are also in control of the mainstream media, which is actively engaged in perpetuating the mythology of progress and growth, war mongering, lionizing elite etc, encouraging the demonization of the right or the left among the people, of the poor generally, and otherwise titillating the senses ad nauseum unto blind obedience and abject stupidity. No one gets time on the MSM unless the Machine approves of the message. (Isn't it astounding, how much the military/industrial/technological machine has come to resemble the great beast of the book of Revelations, and yet here in America there are hardly any more fervent supporters of that great beast, than Christians.)

What am I prepared to do? Not much. I have no military training or fighting skills, nor any keen desire to kill or even hurt anybody. I haven't even struck someone in anger since I was sixteen, and then I had a hockey glove on, and he had a face mask (he was also my teammate and he slashed me on the wrists with his hockey stick, in a team practice scrimmage, the prick.) What I want really, is a quiet, ascetic kind of life, to build my own house off the grid, studying plants, gardening, hunting and fishing, with some friends and companions, who appreciate dancing and singing. That's it. But what is that, when the path of humanity is so clearly engaged in making that very simple thing impossible for anybody? When the economic system we take for granted is so inherently hostile to life, so geared to depriving us of true health and general welfare, so clearly destined to generate death on a grand scale here-to-fore unseen? These people who rule over us are not American, in the pure sense of what that was supposed to mean. They are scarcely human, with their desires and their actions, having so closely come to resemble a machine. It's no wonder people get to thinking they aren't human, reptile aliens in disguise (there is not a greater charlatan than David Icke.)

I'm down to my last few dollars. My house is on the verge of being condemned for failure to pay my utility bills. I am estranged from most of my family and my friends. Today, July 04, Independence Day in America, is my 39th birthday. My name is William Hunter Duncan, and I used to be afraid, but I'm not afraid anymore.

You might want to consult another voice for this kind of thinking, without the recital of explicit violence, and something more in the way of doable sollutions…here

Knarf plays the Doomer Blues

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