PE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd"> This Hand-Coded Collapse Blog – Built with Open Source Software and on The World's Worst Blogging Platform™ – is Being Shut Down

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Offline Allan Stromfeldt Christensen

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I think it is article/comment software only on his site but forum threads should be able to be added.  I'm just about to start exploring it all now that I have the distasteful bullshit above taken care of.

Yes, exactly -- kinda. It's forum software, but which has only been configured for an article/comment setup.

And you can see your faux account here if you'd like :)
https://discourse.fromfilmerstofarmers.com/u/k-dog_old-system

Offline K-Dog

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Quote from: KD
My page is totally hand coded.  I had the idea of making my own platform but I'm finding that the demands of work are going to prevent me from coming up with the hours I need to finish the job.  I  built all the little pieces to make my own platform( with comments) work but getting it all together is just as much work and time.  My original reason for doing it my way is because at the time I first wanted to do it I had found homeland security had been authoring halt the comments on Kunstler's Clusterfuck Nation and they controlled his software.

Well you have a whole different situation, and I recall your story. I didn't mean to disparage hand-coding, just to note that it seems impossibly hard to me. During the years here I've learned just enough Wordpress and SMF to be dangerous, but there is a world of difference between a truck driver and a truck mechanic.

As far as response to your comment, you are good to carry the good fight to the racists that JHK likes to cosset, coddle, and cultivate, but you're a better man than me. I'd usher them to the airlock.

As it turns out Kunstler did not remove the offensive link.  He only removed my comment.  No doubt about it, he is one of the pigs.

The link is to a photo and we freely post photos here.  However I won't be posting this photo but I will post the link so the curious can see what is so offensive.

   

    malthuss November 7, 2017 at 9:41 pm #

    from link

    media.fotki.com/2v29gvr3NxQKds.jpg

    Reply   


Can you post pics on JHKs forum now?

How did he react to this pic?

RE

No, it was just a link.  I cut and pasted it here and then enabled the link like it was on his site.  Links are used there more frequently now.  Once I was the only one.  Really.  For instance, some history about me in the comment stream this week.

http://kunstler.com/clusterfuck-nation/what-could-go-wrong/#comment-325558

That will take you to a short branch where I posted a few paragraphs about a tornado I went through as a child.  In the thread I have a link to a photo and also one to a newspaper article.

I used to always use anchor tags.  It only takes 13 keystrokes to make an anchor tag.

So far looking at the discourse Software, it is a geeky solution.  You have to play with virtual machines and deployment tools to get it going though there are instructions to get it going as your first 'Ruby on Rails' Project.  Still just starting to check it out.  Tess, a Cardigan Corgi is visiting and we went for a walk.

Tess is short for Tesla.



Home alone dog-sitting.


Offline RE

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Nothing in my Inbox and nothing in Spam.

I don't see anything resembling a Forum on the site.  Where do I start a thread?

RE

Huh, don't ask me then. I went ahead and just manually verified your account if that's the case. Try leaving a comment if you'd like!

In regards to starting a thread I don't know the specifics (yet) about which level a user has to be at in order to start one, but regardless I won't be allowing that on FF2F. That would imply that FF2F was to be a forum (or at least also be a forum), and I wouldn't want to oversee something like that, so that certainly ain't gonna happen.

I am just the opposite.  I wouldn't run a blog without a forum.  When Peter proposed we start the Diner, one of my requirements was to have a forum beyond WP, because there is no continuity to that.  I like to try and keep commentary on a given topic organized and together.  It's much easier to find old posts that way.

I also prefer the dialogue on a forum to the expository writing of a blog.  I like to bat ideas back and forth with people rather than just pontificate on my own, although I can do that too of course. lol.

Do you know of any other website running Ghost that has a forum I could check out?

RE
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Offline Allan Stromfeldt Christensen

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I am just the opposite.  I wouldn't run a blog without a forum.  When Peter proposed we start the Diner, one of my requirements was to have a forum beyond WP, because there is no continuity to that.  I like to try and keep commentary on a given topic organized and together.  It's much easier to find old posts that way.

I also prefer the dialogue on a forum to the expository writing of a blog.  I like to bat ideas back and forth with people rather than just pontificate on my own, although I can do that too of course. lol.

Yeah, I totally see your point, but as I don't need to tell you it's a massive undertaking and not something I'd want to have to oversee.

Do you know of any other website running Ghost that has a forum I could check out?

RE

Interesting question, the notion of a blog tied into a forum, or in this case Ghost tied into Discourse but not just for blog comments. There are some big names that use Discourse, and more than once have I come across a customer service area of a company/website that uses Discourse. That being said, even though Ghost has a page on their site about how to integrate Discourse into a Ghost blog, not once have I ever seen a Ghost blog using Discourse. Of the dozens and dozens of Ghost blogs I've seen, 100% of them have used Disqus, if anything. I'm sure there's others besides FF2F, I've just never seen them. There is however one exception coming from the other direction, that being Discourse's founder using Ghost for his blog:

https://blog.codinghorror.com

That'd be Jeff Atwood's blog, the guy who started up Stack Exchange of which led to Stack Overflow, the 38th highest ranking site in the US (according to Alexa). This guy knows what he's doing, meaning you can expect Discourse to be some top-notch software.

Anyway, I just took a look at his blog and then jumped over to his commenting forum, which looks a tad different from mine I now see. That is, he has a section called "category", 99% of which are "Blog" but is where one could categorize any kind of "thread", what Discourse calls a "topic."

You can check out Discourse's customers page for examples of non-blog usages of Discourse.

Having said all that, and if I'm not mistaken, I don't think there'd be anything extra you'd have to do besides what I've done to create something like the Diner's WordPress/SMF setup but with Ghost and Discourse instead. Set up a Ghost blog, integrate Discourse, each blog post automatically creates a "topic", and then allow whichever users you want to be able to create "topics" to have those permissions.

Offline RE

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Having said all that, and if I'm not mistaken, I don't think there'd be anything extra you'd have to do besides what I've done to create something like the Diner's WordPress/SMF setup but with Ghost and Discourse instead. Set up a Ghost blog, integrate Discourse, each blog post automatically creates a "topic", and then allow whichever users you want to be able to create "topics" to have those permissions.

I don't WANT another setup like the Diner using Ghost/Discourse substituting for WP/SMF.  That is a kludge Peter used to get me a forum along with a blog.  It has tons of deficiencies and problems.

Mainly, there needs to be seamless integration to posts made to the Blog and forum, either way.  So if somebody posts a comment on an article on the forum, it also shows up in the commentary on the blog for that article.  And vica versa of course.

Sounds like this is not the solution I am looking for.  Ghost doesn't have the native functionality to do it.

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Offline Allan Stromfeldt Christensen

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Mainly, there needs to be seamless integration to posts made to the Blog and forum, either way.  So if somebody posts a comment on an article on the forum, it also shows up in the commentary on the blog for that article.  And vica versa of course.

Sounds like this is not the solution I am looking for.  Ghost doesn't have the native functionality to do it.

RE

Actually, it kind of sounds like it could do what you're after. Kind of. Because one thing that Discourse doesn't, and wont't, allow for is for comments to be left on the page of the actual blog post. I didn't like that at first, but after I learned of the reasoning it kind of made sense. That is, the only way that leaving comments on the blog post page could be done was via a JavaScript embed, and that would apparently seriously degrade the capabilities of Discourse. Hence you can see the comments on the blog post page, but you have to click through to the forum to leave a comment/response. Otherwise, yes, commments left on the forum appear directly on the blog post page.

Offline RE

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Mainly, there needs to be seamless integration to posts made to the Blog and forum, either way.  So if somebody posts a comment on an article on the forum, it also shows up in the commentary on the blog for that article.  And vica versa of course.

Sounds like this is not the solution I am looking for.  Ghost doesn't have the native functionality to do it.

RE

Actually, it kind of sounds like it could do what you're after. Kind of. Because one thing that Discourse doesn't, and wont't, allow for is for comments to be left on the page of the actual blog post. I didn't like that at first, but after I learned of the reasoning it kind of made sense. That is, the only way that leaving comments on the blog post page could be done was via a JavaScript embed, and that would apparently seriously degrade the capabilities of Discourse. Hence you can see the comments on the blog post page, but you have to click through to the forum to leave a comment/response. Otherwise, yes, commments left on the forum appear directly on the blog post page.

It doesn't sound capable of it to me.  If you can find an example of someone doing it, let me know.

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Offline K-Dog

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Whoooooooooooooaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhh

Hot Doggie

Hot Doggie
Hot Doggie

Reading this https://blog.discourse.org/2013/04/discourse-as-your-first-rails-app/ I was able to get Discourse up an running on a hard disk.  I had to install Virtual Machine and Vagrant software and clone the Git repository to get it going.  The server is running as a virtual machine and I connect to it via my localhost.

This took forever to get going, an hour and more of downloading, but the article steps through things nicely.  Be patient if you install Discourse as sometimes things don't happen right away in this massive but well guided auto-install.  Apparently what is running on an Ubuntu Virtual Machine server is a full Ruby on Rails development environment.  Ruby on Rails auto-installs in your VM in the process.  Expect more than a couple of hours if your hardware is not top notch.  The computer I installed it on is almost virtual reality ready, it has a 4 GHz processor but even so my install went out into the weeds for significant moments here and there.  If you get an error message wait before you do anything.  Errors will auto correct because the virtual machine was debugged and working before the vagrant file was released.

If the words in the above description do not make sense to you they will soon enough if you get into the install and start reading up on things.

Like what is a Virtual Machine, Vagrant, Ruby on Rails, and on and on and on...

I'm going to be busy.

Offline RE

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Whoooooooooooooaaaaaaaaaaaaahhhhhhhhhhhh

Hot Doggie

Reading this https://blog.discourse.org/2013/04/discourse-as-your-first-rails-app/ I was able to get Discourse up an running on a hard disk.  I had to install Virtual Machine and Vagrant software and clone the Git repository to get it going.  The server is running as a virtual machine and I connect to it via my localhost.

This took forever to get going, an hour and more of downloading, but the article steps through things nicely.  Be patient if you install Discourse as sometimes things don't happen right away in this massive but well guided auto-install.  Apparently what is running on an Ubuntu Virtual Machine server is a full Ruby on Rails development environment.  Ruby on Rails auto-installs in your VM in the process.  Expect more than a couple of hours if your hardware is not top notch.  The computer I installed it on is almost virtual reality ready, it has a 4 GHz processor but even so my install went out into the weeds for significant moments here and there.  If you get an error message wait before you do anything.  Errors will auto correct because the virtual machine was debugged and working before the vagrant file was released.

If the words in the above description do not make sense to you they will soon enough if you get into the install and start reading up on things.

Like what is a Virtual Machine, Vagrant, Ruby on Rails, and on and on and on...

I'm going to be busy.

The Dog has a new Bone to chew on.  ::)


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Offline K-Dog

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It will be useless to me if I can't get at the innards.

The link takes you to a hello world web page.  Hosted by a company that gives free use while you go through a tutorial.

(update:  That was true but now the link takes you to a place where the application has been deployed.  You won't see any changes as none were made.)
« Last Edit: November 12, 2017, 12:24:46 PM by K-Dog »

Offline Allan Stromfeldt Christensen

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It doesn't sound capable of it to me.  If you can find an example of someone doing it, let me know.

RE

Is this what you're looking for? Here's the (Discourse-using) forum for Levels Up Labs

http://discourse.leveluplabs.com

And here's the (Ghost-using) blog for Fortress of Doors, whose commentary is a subset of Levels Up Labs' Discourse forum

http://www.fortressofdoors.com

You can see the blog category (and write-up) for Fortress of Doors on Levels Up Labs' Discourse forum here

http://discourse.leveluplabs.com/c/blog

Offline RE

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It doesn't sound capable of it to me.  If you can find an example of someone doing it, let me know.

RE

Is this what you're looking for? Here's the (Discourse-using) forum for Levels Up Labs

http://discourse.leveluplabs.com

And here's the (Ghost-using) blog for Fortress of Doors, whose commentary is a subset of Levels Up Labs' Discourse forum

http://www.fortressofdoors.com

You can see the blog category (and write-up) for Fortress of Doors on Levels Up Labs' Discourse forum here

http://discourse.leveluplabs.com/c/blog

Nope, that ain't it.  I don't see how users create their own threads, and I don't see how you can categorize commentary into folders by topic rather than by blog article.

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Offline K-Dog

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Ohhhh it is capable but you have to learn how to integrate the pieces yourself to get what you want.

https://radiant-badlands-60099.herokuapp.com/

I have a long way to go.

I wrote the code in the link.  Promoting the tutorial author was the result of putting some supplied HTML in the right place.  The content of the HTML is not important right now in the tutorial.

Thank you Alan for the demo links.
« Last Edit: November 13, 2017, 10:11:29 PM by K-Dog »

Offline RE

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Ohhhh it is capable but you have to learn how to integrate the pieces yourself to get what you want.

Well, sure.  If you are a good enough Code Jockey this is possible with almost any packages.

Harry added  a Plug-In to WP that automatically transfered Blog articles to the Forum.  However, the commentary on blog and that on the SMF remain separate.  Some of the automation that is supposed to categorize the article doesn't work right either and has to be done manually.

I'll be interested to see if you can set up Ghost/Discourse to do what I want.  Even if you can though, the next problem is migrating the databases off WP/SMF to Ghost/Discourse and retaining their searchability, or really hopefully enhancing it.  Right now you can't drill down either DB through multiple fields, only one.  I'd like to be able to drill down through author, date, topic, text string etc.  Also, I would like to be able to list the WHOLE Forum DB chronologically, not just the last 100 posts.  You could do that on the old Peak Oil forum.

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A Collapse Blogger's Search For the Most Collapse-Proof Blogging Platform
« Reply #29 on: December 05, 2017, 02:09:36 AM »


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Published on From Filmers to Farmers on October 24th, 2017



Discuss this article at the Science & Technology Table inside the Diner


 





Desperate times call for desperate measures (Jeb Bush photo by Michael Vadon)


With just seven days left before this blog moves away from The World's Worst Blogging Platform™ I created and over to an actual blogging platform, I will nonetheless point out that I've been rather content for the past three years or so with this "platform" of mine, and not once have I been jealous or envious of the actual platforms used by the blogs I myself read.



Because while shortly after starting up this hand-coded blog of mine, in late-2014 I did actually take a look at the back-ends of several platforms out there to see what I might add to mine, but the more I delved into them the more I realized I had no interest in them in the slightest. That all changed however in October of 2016 when author John Michael Greer announced on The Archdruid Report his desire to move away from his current blogging platform and that he was open to suggestions. I in turn conducted an updated-by-two-years search, the results being mostly – mostly, but not quite – the same.



If you're at least vaguely familiar with the blogging "scene" then you're probably aware of the three main platforms out there – Blogger, WordPress and Medium – to which can be added the mostly forgotten Typepad, the convoluted-for-blogging Drupal and Joomla (the former being what The Oil Drum ran on), the teeny-bopper oriented Tumblr (purchased by Yahoo!), the Super bowl-advertising Weebly, Wix and Squarespace, not to mention the array of which are in some cases here-today gone-tomorrow platforms like Svbtle, Posthaven, Postach.io, Jux, Postagon, Wardrobe, Jekyll, Anchor, Bolt, Hexo, Silvrback, Roon, Scriptogram, Pen.io, Dropplets, and on and on and on.



Coming from the vantage point of a writer blogging on what can be broadly described as the collapse of industrial civilisation (and the renewal of culture) I am of course wary of using a platform that is itself prone to collapse. Not to say that I'm after something than could somehow survive industrial civilisation's collapse of course, but rather something that can survive its own shortcomings.



With Typepad and those mentioned afterwards being a write-off due to either their hokeyness and/or lack of dependability, that pretty much leaves the Big Three to choose from.



The oldest of these is Blogger (what Greer was looking to get away from, and which many collapse bloggers currently use), a platform launched back in 1999 and sold to Google in 2003 for an undisclosed sum of money. This platform is so archaic though that it's a complete joke. I'm by no means a technophile, but that doesn't mean I'm going to break out my very first computer (a VIC-20 which I was gifted at 4-years-old and somewhat learned to program on) to do my word processing on, any more than I'd want to use Blogger to do blogging on. Moreover, and putting aside Google's propensity for shutting down various services it offers, placing the entire edifice of one's Blogger blog at the mercy of Google is not something I'd be interested in partaking in.



Next up is pretty much the opposite of Blogger, that being WordPress (also used by many collapse bloggers). What we have here is an open source platform, one in which you can either have a certain branch of the WordPress organisation host your blog for you on their servers (that's a whole other story which I won't go into) or, being open sourced, you can freely download the software and host it yourself wherever you please. What this freedom implies is that you retain full ownership and control over your content, a boon for collapse-oriented writers who can tend to have a bit of a rugged individualist streak to them and don't like being too dependant on third-party services.



But upon giving WordPress a look back in late-2014 it didn't take a minute before I was turned off by the whole thing, what with it looking extremely clunky and representative of what I now understand to be "bloatware". Because although it did start off as a platform committed solely to blogging, it's since branched out to becoming more of a generalized application platform. As stated by WordPress' former (2009 – 2011) Deputy Head of the User Interface Group, John O'Nolan,




What is WordPress for? For years WordPress has flipped and flopped without consciously pivoting or focusing. At various points over the last 5 years it has tried directly and indirectly to compete with Drupal, Facebook, Tumblr, SquareSpace, Shopify, Wix and Medium. All without ever focusing for long enough to succeed at one before moving on to the next. The only constant has been following, rather than leading, at each stage…





We all know that WordPress could do just about anything but, maybe it’s time to stop and ask whether it actually should. What we can say with relative certainty is that WordPress cannot become the best publishing platform, website builder, ecommerce store, social network, rss reader and application platform – all at the same time. Stephen Covey once said: The main thing is to keep the main thing the main thing. So what is WordPress’ main thing?






What are the chances that one of WordPress' army of Auttomaticians (otherwise known as "employees") is named Waldo/Wally?


To give it credit, by not having a "main thing" WordPress has however managed to become the Internet's version of Spandex, a one-size-fits-all platform that astoundingly runs 28% of the Internet's websites (so it claims). Problem here though is that it can't possibly build everything into the system in order to please everybody at the same time lest it become a lumbering behemoth. In effect, users are required to install an array of plugins to accomplish what they're after.



Problem with plugins is that while there's literally tens of thousands of them out there allowing users to customize their Spandex, what this also means is that poorly constructed plugins, failed-to-be-updated plugins, and conflicting plugins can not only crash your entire WordPress system (as I witnessed happen to The Doomstead Diner a couple of years ago – Diner Hell Week: The Crash Story), but has led to WordPress being utterly vulnerable to hacking, one recent claim stating that WordPress sites account for 78% of the Internet's hacked sites.



But even with all those bloatware and vulnerability aspects taken into consideration, WordPress is nonetheless a more than half-decent platform, it is open source, and if in 2014 I had to choose a blogging platform to go with rather than The World's Worst Blogging Platform™, yes, I would have gone with WordPress. Because no, I wouldn't have gone with Medium.



Medium's the latest Big Kid on the Block (used only by Nafeez Ahmed as far as I know, a quasi-collapse blogger at that), it having been designed by Evan Williams, a co-founder of Twitter. Twitter however isn't the original source of funding from which Williams was able to start up Medium though, Williams actually being a co-creator of Blogger which was rumoured to have been sold for $20 million (to Google, as mentioned). That being said, Williams didn't just use his Blogger-cum-Twitter booty to start up Medium, relying on an array of venture capitalists that have thrown in more than $174 million of their own funding.



In other words, although Williams is supposedly "not that interested in revenue", but is interested in, as he claims, "building our understanding… deepening our understanding of the world", the fact of the matter is that Medium is at the mercy of "shareholders" whose foremost concern is to see the platform turn a profit, thus requiring it to come up with a business model that can be successfully shown to siphon money over to said shareholders, since running "a billionaire's vanity project" (as Medium was once described) can only last for so long. Needless to say, this can become quite problematic for users of the platform who think that it might provide some stability for them and their writing.



Another problem for writers using Medium is that they don't actually own or control the platform in any way whatsoever, and while Medium can sell, reproduce, or publish a writer's material in any way it wants, regardless of what writers think it can also tear up any agreement or system as it sees fit in order to introduce a whole new business model, relegating the whole thing to being a kind of digital sharecropping.



This isn't mere hyperbole though, since in early-2017 a third of Medium's staff (about 45 people) walked into work only to find out that their jobs no longer existed. Williams and company had decided to embark on yet another business model, this being Medium's third since it was founded in 2012. Because while it first started off with the idea of being a publication itself via hiring its own writers and editors, it then moved on to an ad-driven model whereby it would attract writers who would be given a portion of the dividends. What was this latest epiphany that Williams had in store?



Before I get to that, before Williams got to it himself, and after the recent election in the US, president of the United States Donald Trump stated (specifically in regards to Twitter) that "I doubt I would be here if it weren’t for social media, to be honest with you." Williams did state that




It's a very bad thing, Twitter's role in that. If it's true that he wouldn't be president if it weren't for Twitter, then yeah, I'm sorry.




Williams' shame may be a bit questionable though due to another statement of his where he pointed out that




I don't think Twitter is the worst case of this,




"this" being




a media ecosystem that… thrives on attention [and which is] making us dumber and not smarter.




Damage control? Maybe. Or maybe it's actually damage control + marketing spin. Because as Williams continued,




It is the ad-driven media that churns stuff out on a minute-by-minute basis and their only measure is whether or not someone clicks on it.




And what do you know, but it turns out that Medium's latest incarnation is one where it does away with ads. And how is it, you may ask, that Williams is spinning it now?




Ad-driven systems can only reward attention. They can’t reward the right answer. Consumer-paid systems can. They can reward value. The inevitable solution: People will have to pay for quality content.




In other words, Williams and Medium are going to be the gatekeepers of "quality content" now. And to get access to this "quality content" – which you'll want because you're so intelligent and don't settle for anything less than quality – you'll have to funnel money to Williams and on to his shareholders via the newly introduced subscription-based model, what used to be simply known as a paywall.



Williams may not be a fan of Trump, but if Williams' media brilliance has been to package and sell us the problem (attention-destroying Twitter) and then turn around and also sell us the "solution", then I can't help but think that despite Williams' aversion to Trump that Trump would nonetheless be proud – and a fan – of Williams.





Can Evan Williams save us from Evan Williams? (photo by Christopher Michel)


If that wasn't enough, the method by which Williams and Medium are going to operate this system is so ridiculous that one writer has even go so far as to call it "the gonorrhea of blogging".



That may be a bit of a harsh description, somewhat understandable though when one realizes that Williams' and Medium's new method to save its shareholders journalism is to do away with the "unsatisfying" heart button and replace it with "Claps". So instead of the oh-so-yesterday notion of the single-click recommend – clicking on the like/heart/upvote/favourite button – the idea now is to click – and keep clicking! – on the clap button to show your appreciation. And the more clap(s) you get, the more you get paid.





Oh, but the clap hurts, it hurts!


Anyway, it was once said by somebody that




The state of tech blogs is atrocious. It's utter crap. They create a culture that is superficial and fetishizing and rewarding the wrong things and reinforcing values that are self-destructive and unsustainable.




Yes, the person who said that – and who continued by pointing that he was "pessimistic about the state of media, and that's why I want to work on this problem" – was none other that Williams himself.



I will agree that the state of blogging is atrocious, but if the only option is the dickbar-waving Medium – with its enticing audience of 60 million unique visitors per month but which From Filmers to Farmers would certainly be at the bottom of the curating pile for – then I'd be more than happy to keep running From Filmers to Farmers on The World's Worst Blogging Platform™.



Fortunately though my John Michael Greer-induced late-2016 updated perusal of the blogging platforms out there revealed that one of those here-today gone-tomorrow platforms that I'd noticed back in late-2014 was not only still around, but had also progressed leaps and bounds since, so much so that it was now head and shoulders above the entire competition, and in every way imagineable (for a collapse blogger).



I'll fortunately be revealing what that blogging platform is on the last day of this month, because although I'm grateful for it having gotten me to where I am now, at long last I'll finally be putting this World's Worst Blogging Platform™ to rest while I relaunch From Filmers to Farmers on what may very well qualify as the world's greatest blogging platform.



See you on the 31st!



 



p.s. In order to accommodate the transition and make sure that the DNS records propagate throughout the Internets in time (good for you if you don't know what I'm talking about), starting on the 29th of this month you'll be seeing the front page of this blog switch over to what you see in the image below, followed by the password protection page being lifted as From Filmers to Farmers once again goes live on the 31st – but in its new incarnation.



p.p.s. Sneak peak for anybody who can guess what the password is, which will be revealed below once the blog switches over.



Update 31/10/2017: __________.



 






 

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