AuthorTopic: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer  (Read 4374 times)

Offline g

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #15 on: March 08, 2018, 03:40:42 PM »
They are all on the net, obviously, and have found /r/collapse/, why haven't they found all the good collapse sites/videos?  That can't be because of the way they were taught in school.  Who isn't interested in war and revolution? Wouldn't someone notice that the US hasn't WON a war in their lifetime?  And no one can win WW3?  Investigating (searching on Google) any of those questions would lead them into the US Empire, Peak Energy, ecological collapse, financial collapse, class war.

Spending too much time on Facebook and Twitter and porn sites I reckon.

For sure Palloy, and my five grandchildren are addicted to smartphone texting and games on them.

I got pissed off the last time I took them out to eat and made them put them away while we were eating and they acted like I was a cruel child abuser.

Frightens the shit out of me. Trying to get the oldest to read Moby Dick and he thinks I'm soft in the head.

The schools in Maine gave my two grand kids there school electronic notepads to do their work on. :icon_scratch:

There gonna read Moby Dick or Huck Finn on them allright,  better chance of finding a pot of gold in my back yard.  :-\

 

Offline g

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #16 on: March 08, 2018, 04:29:53 PM »
no mostly they are preparing for the collapse of industrial civilization. That is why it's called  R collapse



You miss the point RE. It's not my point either, it's Palloys.

There on a fucking collapse blog planning for their retirement and saving up for their IRA bennies 40 years from now.

Collapse to them is not having enough dough to go golfing in Florida for the rest of their days upon reaching 65.

Doesn't that sound a bit fucked up to you?? It's not the collapse we discuss here, at least I don't think so, but who knows anything anymore. Eddie and me watch the stock market all day and you post gourment meals throughout the day and dog races.

Something tells me there is a very good possibility we are all stark raving mad. Soft as sneakers full of shit as the old saying goes.  :icon_scratch: :dontknow: :dontknow:

                                       

RE missing the point? By RE's own logic, he should be demoted and any further posts on this thread censored.

I'm not sure if anyone could see my last post on the topic he locked. It's actually ON TOPIC to this AS WELL, so I'll post a portion here:



Criticisms of collapse narratives are also relevant to the topic of collapse. How could they not be??

A specific criticism mentioned was that many here, including myself, have been predicting a market collapse, run on the banks, hyperdeflation or hyperinflation, peak oil and the resulting effects on the industrial economy, etc. We have been doing it consistently for many years now. Although we may not have put a specific date on these events, we have frequently acted like the probability of it happening in the next 2,3,4,5 years is very high (that was 8 years ago). So we were wrong, plain and simple.



Now I would like to ask Palloy, GO, Surly and others who are NOT missing the point and who are staying on topic - do you believe putting at least some portion of your income into a retirement investment vehicle is such a horrible idea? I mean, I know we have all been chanting the mantra of sudden (partially predictable?) collapse and asking "how stupid can you be to trust the government and banksters with your pension?". But, couldn't it also be a bit stupid to leave it all in cash or gold or collapse preps?

 Most Definitely No Ashvin, it's a must IMO.

 First we could be wrong. A distinct possibility.

 Second you are going to save something anyway if your preparing for bad times, so a portion of it may as well be in a tax sheltered retirement plan. If we have a real collapse, what's the difference?

 Thirdly your capital always grows quickest with sound corporate blue chip stocks that are generating good growth and cash flows internally, constantly raising dividends and advancing into new markets in this wonderful modern global economy. If you decide on Bonds instead or a mixture the interest or dividends will compound tax free thus enhancing their yields considerably as well as boosting the magical mathematical effects of compound interest. 

You can always close out an IRA or retirement plan with a minor 10% penalty which also 100% tax deductible if you sense you have made an error and wish to go back to cash.

It is also possible to invest now in tangible assets as well in these various plans. Gold, Silver, grains, copper, land, baskets of commodities, etc.

Diversification but not over diversification is always wise as long as you are not locked into an investment. Many of the plans allow you to sell everything and park in a federally insured savings account instantly if you desire with no tax or penalty as long as the money stays within the plan.

You also have the ability to trade securities, any kind, and pay no tax at all on the gains, and advantage few realize. You will pay a tax only when you withdraw the money which you would do anyway.

At your age a Roth IRA is desirable if you qualify. There are no taxes to pay when withdrawing your money, state laws should be checked however.

Cash, Gold, Silver, IRA, owning your own domicile and three to six months of food, water, medicine, some wine and lots of canned fish, meat, beans, potatoes, and boxes of pasta,  are the proper mix in my view, in percentages and amounts that suit your views.

I'm of the lite doom slow steady collapse school of thought but am in no way certain so this works for me. Good Luck, it's all a gamble now, nothing is certain.  My hope for the sake of my grandchildren is that the folks who laugh at doomers and think hi tech will save us all are correct, but too cynical to believe it.   :dontknow: :dontknow:


Offline luciddreams

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #17 on: March 08, 2018, 04:33:47 PM »
I haven't gone to r/collpase reddit.  Well I've been there once before, a year ago, lasted a few comments and couldn't stomach the wild west "collapse" retard show.  Got out and haven't been back nor will I.

Most of the younger iphone, tweeter, swampbook, hypster barristas are actually waiting for the singularity like Ashvin is waiting for Jesus. 

Either way, their "future" is fucked and they know it in a collective unconscious sort of way.  I don't think most can actually consciously connect dots, although there's a small majority whom can. 

it still seems that understanding that infinite growth on a finite planet is not possible is still a rarity.  It also seems that most have no idea that Murika is Diesel powered, that petroleum is limited, and that there is a very big universe of ramifications based on these simple facts. 

However, economics, as George Carlin would have informed us, "is all bullshit and it's bad for you."  That is, economics is nothing more then limited digibits which fuels the infinite growth on a finite planet delusion.  Digibits are infinite and are not subject to any laws outside of the laws thermodynamics (and that only because eventually coal/nuclear powered grid power goes away and with them goes digibits).  Maybe then gold will matter.   :icon_scratch:

As long as Murika is diesel powered then one might as well assume that digibits are diesel powered.  Digibits go away with petrolem...as does...everything...else...

Offline monsta666

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #18 on: March 08, 2018, 04:39:08 PM »
Now I would like to ask Palloy, GO, Surly and others who are NOT missing the point and who are staying on topic - do you believe putting at least some portion of your income into a retirement investment vehicle is such a horrible idea? I mean, I know we have all been chanting the mantra of sudden (partially predictable?) collapse and asking "how stupid can you be to trust the government and banksters with your pension?". But, couldn't it also be a bit stupid to leave it all in cash or gold or collapse preps?

It is a question I have thought about and this is how I see it; assuming the official retirement is not postponed further (a rather big if) then my planned retirement age would be 2052. I have to ask myself would the financial system and business as usual still be present at that time? To me the probability of that is highly unlikely i.e. less than 5% so investing even modest sums (like several thousand pounds) seems like a poor proposition considering I am unlikely to see a return on the principal of my investment nevermind any actual rate of returns.

Perhaps you will ask the follow-up question as to why I am so pessimistic and assign such a low figure? My answer to that lies with limits to growth and the fact our modern economic system is built on perpetual growth. We are consuming non-renewable resources, energy plus generating excess waste. These trends are unsustainable and it is my feeling we will reach a limiting factor in one of those three areas that will stop further economic growth. When that happens then the financial system will take a tailspin which will instigate a collapse of other systems such as the economic, political and social systems we enjoy today. Now it is surprising things have not gone south already (at least not in a big way) but I still would not take a lack of collapse today as a sign it will never happen. Timelines are a difficult thing to predict but then the underlying logic that economies cannot grow indefinitely and we cannot continue to increase consumption till the end of time is such a strong argument due to the fact it covers such a basic logic it is hard to argue that time will not come. To think we can continue to 2050s without a collapse is to make the argument that limits don't exist which is something I cannot do.

Offline RE

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #19 on: March 08, 2018, 05:16:55 PM »
RE missing the point? By RE's own logic, he should be demoted and any further posts on this thread censored.

MORE RE complaints?  ::) Yeesh.  Don't you have something better to do with your time?  Play online Poker maybe?  The topic here in this thread FYI is what millenials think about collapse.

RE
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Offline RE

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #20 on: March 08, 2018, 05:24:57 PM »
Most of the r/collapse redditors don't have retirement accounts, because they don't make enough money to have enough to save in a retirement account.  There are a few who have good paying jobs, usually in IT and they tend to lord this over all the poor ones.  Same dynamic there as with LLPOH on TBP.

Most of them don't think the financial system will last long enough for them to retire.  In fact a significant percentage don't think they'll even be alive, there are many believer in NTHE on r/collapse.

RE
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Offline Palloy2

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #21 on: March 08, 2018, 05:33:54 PM »
Quote
there are many believer in NTHE on r/collapse.

Really?  Funny that no one mentioned it in that long thread.  Climate Change they were aware of, but not of how it would affect their lives directly.
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Offline RE

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #22 on: March 08, 2018, 05:39:06 PM »
Quote
there are many believer in NTHE on r/collapse.

Really?  Funny that no one mentioned it in that long thread.  Climate Change they were aware of, but not of how it would affect their lives directly.

The thread wasn't about extinction.  It was about how much money Millenials do or do not save.

RE
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Offline Palloy2

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #23 on: March 08, 2018, 05:49:53 PM »
"Funny that no one mentioned it [NTHE]", in amongst all those comments about 401k which are direct opposite of NTHE.
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Offline RE

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #24 on: March 08, 2018, 05:54:58 PM »
"Funny that no one mentioned it [NTHE]", in amongst all those comments about 401k which are direct opposite of NTHE.

It's not a direct opposite.  The retirement thread is an economic thread.  It attracts the people concerned about a monetary system crash.  NTHE people hang out mostly in the climate and pollution threads.

RE
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Offline Surly1

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #25 on: March 08, 2018, 06:04:05 PM »
Most of the r/collapse redditors don't have retirement accounts, because they don't make enough money to have enough to save in a retirement account.  There are a few who have good paying jobs, usually in IT and they tend to lord this over all the poor ones.  Same dynamic there as with LLPOH on TBP.

Most of them don't think the financial system will last long enough for them to retire.  In fact a significant percentage don't think they'll even be alive, there are many believer in NTHE on r/collapse.

RE

Yup. Actually pretty depressing to read.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline Surly1

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #26 on: March 08, 2018, 06:23:56 PM »

Now I would like to ask Palloy, GO, Surly and others who are NOT missing the point and who are staying on topic - do you believe putting at least some portion of your income into a retirement investment vehicle is such a horrible idea? I mean, I know we have all been chanting the mantra of sudden (partially predictable?) collapse and asking "how stupid can you be to trust the government and banksters with your pension?". But, couldn't it also be a bit stupid to leave it all in cash or gold or collapse preps?

Have been saving for retirement my entire life. Not enough, because nothing is ever enough. And actually worried about the effects of inflation on a fixed income when I retire. Not too many years of incremental 2-3% inflation before it's cat food and crackers. My own plans are simple and straightforward. Only a portion of my $$$ would come from SS. The truth of the matter is while I believe the wheels will come off the wagon at some point, I'm not sure I will live to see it. So my bet is on BAU TFN.

In terms of preps, my wife and I talked about this at some length before we got married. At our age, we are far more fragile than 10 years ago, and are dependent on city life, city health care and city services. I read the story Palloy posted up from Two Ice Floes a couple days ago with keen interest. Ten years ago, that could have been us. AN expensive lesson they learned, and a cautionary tale for all of us.

But if we have a debt fueled financial collapse and the money goes to shit, I'm fucked along with everyone else. Will be living like the average Croatian, scratching in a garden and drinking wine with my wife. There are worse fates. And if the Russians shoot off their nukes and miss Mar-a-Lago and hit Norfolk, well, I've had a good run.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline RE

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #27 on: March 08, 2018, 06:33:13 PM »

Now I would like to ask Palloy, GO, Surly and others who are NOT missing the point and who are staying on topic - do you believe putting at least some portion of your income into a retirement investment vehicle is such a horrible idea? I mean, I know we have all been chanting the mantra of sudden (partially predictable?) collapse and asking "how stupid can you be to trust the government and banksters with your pension?". But, couldn't it also be a bit stupid to leave it all in cash or gold or collapse preps?

Have been saving for retirement my entire life. Not enough, because nothing is ever enough. And actually worried about the effects of inflation on a fixed income when I retire. Not too many years of incremental 2-3% inflation before it's cat food and crackers. My own plans are simple and straightforward. Only a portion of my $$$ would come from SS. The truth of the matter is while I believe the wheels will come off the wagon at some point, I'm not sure I will live to see it. So my bet is on BAU TFN.

In terms of preps, my wife and I talked about this at some length before we got married. At our age, we are far more fragile than 10 years ago, and are dependent on city life, city health care and city services. I read the story Palloy posted up from Two Ice Floes a couple days ago with keen interest. Ten years ago, that could have been us. AN expensive lesson they learned, and a cautionary tale for all of us.

But if we have a debt fueled financial collapse and the money goes to shit, I'm fucked along with everyone else. Will be living like the average Croatian, scratching in a garden and drinking wine with my wife. There are worse fates. And if the Russians shoot off their nukes and miss Mar-a-Lago and hit Norfolk, well, I've had a good run.

I get along fine on SS and a small Pension, in fact I save money every month to supplement my winnings in the Workman's Comp case and my savings from prior years which carried me through the 7 months with no income and prevented me from becoming a Homeless Cripple Freezing to Death on the streets of Palmer Alaska.  Burned up a decent amount of FRNs over that 7 months, but could have lasted about 2-3 years before being bankrupt, longer if I cut my expenses to the bone and went to Van Dwelling.

@2-3%/year inflation, it would take at least a decade to get me down to cat food and crackers.  I am unlikely to live that long anyhow.

As I said also, the fixed location Doomstead is not a good plan unless you have a fairly large group of people doing it, 20-30 I would say is minimum, Dunbar's Number of 150 much better.  If I was in better health, I would either run the Stealth Van/Cargo Trailer option or the Sailboat option for myself alone, or even for a family of four.

RE
« Last Edit: March 08, 2018, 06:37:59 PM by RE »
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Offline Palloy2

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #28 on: March 08, 2018, 06:55:48 PM »
Quote
Ashvin;
Now I would like to ask Palloy, GO, Surly and others who are NOT missing the point and who are staying on topic - do you believe putting at least some portion of your income into a retirement investment vehicle is such a horrible idea? I mean, I know we have all been chanting the mantra of sudden (partially predictable?) collapse and asking "how stupid can you be to trust the government and banksters with your pension?". But, couldn't it also be a bit stupid to leave it all in cash or gold or collapse preps?

Putting your hard-earned money into a pension for the Government to look after is like throwing it the rubbish bin.  If you don't like gold and cash, then put it in preps - getting out of debt, land (lease), tools, fuel, water tanks, pipe, tarps, rope, PV panels, batteries, whiskey, coffee, cigarettes.  Useful/tradable physical stuff, not promises to repay in the future by a major debtor.
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Offline Eddie

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Re: A Window into the Thinking & Experience of the Millenial Doomer
« Reply #29 on: March 08, 2018, 08:32:08 PM »
Now I would like to ask Palloy, GO, Surly and others who are NOT missing the point and who are staying on topic - do you believe putting at least some portion of your income into a retirement investment vehicle is such a horrible idea? I mean, I know we have all been chanting the mantra of sudden (partially predictable?) collapse and asking "how stupid can you be to trust the government and banksters with your pension?". But, couldn't it also be a bit stupid to leave it all in cash or gold or collapse preps?



You should make some provision for your old age, and more importantly for your spouse if and when you get married. If you want to have a family, you should be thinking of providing educations for your children. To think that just because a collapse is coming, that trying to save for your personal future is a bad idea , is bad thinking.  Alternative investments that might be outside the normal finance sector might be worth considering. But even a 401K or the like is okay. Just manage it yourself and and turn it into cash ahead of the next crash.

It is my opinion that as long as BAU persists, and you make taxable income,  tax reduction is a good strategy. A retirement account is one of the best tax reduction strategies.

I like tangible assets, but the pot stocks helped me last year. I made 50K trading, and used it to pay down debt.
What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

 

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