AuthorTopic: For AG. Just A Reminder of Days Gone By  (Read 331 times)

Online Eddie

  • Administrator
  • Master Chef
  • *****
  • Posts: 14342
    • View Profile
For AG. Just A Reminder of Days Gone By
« on: May 25, 2018, 12:23:57 PM »
My youngest brother, the rich(er) one, is now partners in a King Air. My other brother, the one who has the auto shop, has now decided he wants a plane too. Part of this is the decadent wish they both have to fly to Alabama on Fridays now to tailgate before my nephew's college games. I know, I know. But they're from Texas, and Alabama is the Numero Uno college team in the US.

The mechanic brother is very technically competent and is thinking about building some fast four-seater experimental from a kit. But since he's been looking at planes, I've been looking too, not that I ever plan to fly anything. The missus has a very low opinion of general aviation aircraft, and she talked me out of it many years ago now. (We once knew somebody who crashed and killed himself and one of his kids.)

But I saw this the other day and thought of you.



I also wanted to tell you that when we landed at Beef Island last month I counted an even dozen boats still derelict on the beach over near the ferry dock. Seven months later.

What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

Offline agelbert

  • Global Moderator
  • Master Chef
  • *****
  • Posts: 11391
    • View Profile
    • Renewable Rervolution
Re: For AG. Just A Reminder of Days Gone By
« Reply #1 on: May 25, 2018, 06:42:36 PM »
My youngest brother, the rich(er) one, is now partners in a King Air. My other brother, the one who has the auto shop, has now decided he wants a plane too. Part of this is the decadent wish they both have to fly to Alabama on Fridays now to tailgate before my nephew's college games. I know, I know. But they're from Texas, and Alabama is the Numero Uno college team in the US.

The mechanic brother is very technically competent and is thinking about building some fast four-seater experimental from a kit. But since he's been looking at planes, I've been looking too, not that I ever plan to fly anything. The missus has a very low opinion of general aviation aircraft, and she talked me out of it many years ago now. (We once knew somebody who crashed and killed himself and one of his kids.)

But I saw this the other day and thought of you.


I also wanted to tell you that when we landed at Beef Island last month I counted an even dozen boats still derelict on the beach over near the ferry dock. Seven months later.

Thanks for the info about Beef island. 

Yep, that's a Piper Colt (flying brick) with the 108 horsepower engine. You know, some of them were modified to use flaps. They originally did not have them. The purpose of flaps is not what the non-pilot thinks they are for. Most people think flaps are on a plane to help it fly slower for landing. That is true for fast jet aircraft. BUT, for general aviation aircraft, the purpose of flaps is to steepen the glide path without increasing the airspeed. On a Piper Colt, which has the glide path of a rock  ;D, flaps are not needed.

As to your agreement with your wife not to learn to fly because of the death of a person you knew and his kid, the Wright Brothers once said that the properly designed aircraft would "glide gently to the ground in the event of a power failure".

It didn't quite work out that way but light aircraft are really much safer than cars, especially in Texas!

Consider that in Texas, where you and/or your brother will do most of their flying, ANY power failure will result in a a power off glide at about 75 mph and 700 feet per minute rate of descent. That is what you do every time you land one of those babies.

Unlike Vermont, Texas is pretty flat and has miles and miles of nothing but miles and miles with LOTS of roads. As long as you don't hit a cow, a power transmission tower or a wind turbine, you should walk away from any forced landing.

What gets people killed in light aircraft is mostly an inadvertent stall near the ground (I am talking about an aerodynamic condition called a stall, not an engine failure type stall). What happens is that they are near the ground and they make a skidding turn (pushing he rudder too hard because they don't want to bank the wings steeply in a coordinated, rudder plus aileron - like you are supposed to ALWAYS do, way). The inside wing loses its abilty to fly (stalls) while the oustide (of the turn) wing keeps flying.

This results in the inside wing dropping hard down (remember this pilot is near the ground and is standing on the rudder (toward the inside wing, making the drop more severe) too much already in that turn.

The plane enters a spin at about 500 feet above the ground (You cannot recover from a spin in less than 1000 feet above the ground). The aircraft strikes the ground at a high angle and usually the pilot is killed the same way a person is killed if they drive into a wall above 50 mph.

I understand your reticence and caution. Just tell your bro that if he has to make a forced landing, DON'T try to keep from dinging he aircraft by turning to reach a road when all the terrain is mostly flat or rolling hills. Just set up a normal glide STRAIGHT AHEAD (into the wind if possible).

When he is almost at ground level, round out (pull back slightly on the stick) to stop the descent and then flair out (pull back on the stick all the way when the plane no longer wants to fly). This ensures that he will make ground contact with the bushes or whatever at the slowest possible speed (about 50 to 60 mph).

If he is going into a forest, put the plane between two trees. The wings get ripped off and you slow quite quickly. I've flown over Texas. Yeah, you've got all kinds of terrain and East Texas is quite different from West Texas. BUT, trees are not an issue there 99% of the time.  ;D

One more thing: The Beechcraft King Air is an unforgiving (due to the high performance type wing) aircraft. You stay in the proper aircaft envelope or you are toast.
« Last Edit: May 25, 2018, 07:01:02 PM by agelbert »
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
Faith,
if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

Online Eddie

  • Administrator
  • Master Chef
  • *****
  • Posts: 14342
    • View Profile
Re: For AG. Just A Reminder of Days Gone By
« Reply #2 on: May 26, 2018, 09:00:34 AM »
My youngest brother, the rich(er) one, is now partners in a King Air. My other brother, the one who has the auto shop, has now decided he wants a plane too. Part of this is the decadent wish they both have to fly to Alabama on Fridays now to tailgate before my nephew's college games. I know, I know. But they're from Texas, and Alabama is the Numero Uno college team in the US.

The mechanic brother is very technically competent and is thinking about building some fast four-seater experimental from a kit. But since he's been looking at planes, I've been looking too, not that I ever plan to fly anything. The missus has a very low opinion of general aviation aircraft, and she talked me out of it many years ago now. (We once knew somebody who crashed and killed himself and one of his kids.)

But I saw this the other day and thought of you.


I also wanted to tell you that when we landed at Beef Island last month I counted an even dozen boats still derelict on the beach over near the ferry dock. Seven months later.

Thanks for the info about Beef island. 

Yep, that's a Piper Colt (flying brick) with the 108 horsepower engine. You know, some of them were modified to use flaps. They originally did not have them. The purpose of flaps is not what the non-pilot thinks they are for. Most people think flaps are on a plane to help it fly slower for landing. That is true for fast jet aircraft. BUT, for general aviation aircraft, the purpose of flaps is to steepen the glide path without increasing the airspeed. On a Piper Colt, which has the glide path of a rock  ;D, flaps are not needed.

As to your agreement with your wife not to learn to fly because of the death of a person you knew and his kid, the Wright Brothers once said that the properly designed aircraft would "glide gently to the ground in the event of a power failure".

It didn't quite work out that way but light aircraft are really much safer than cars, especially in Texas!

Consider that in Texas, where you and/or your brother will do most of their flying, ANY power failure will result in a a power off glide at about 75 mph and 700 feet per minute rate of descent. That is what you do every time you land one of those babies.

Unlike Vermont, Texas is pretty flat and has miles and miles of nothing but miles and miles with LOTS of roads. As long as you don't hit a cow, a power transmission tower or a wind turbine, you should walk away from any forced landing.

What gets people killed in light aircraft is mostly an inadvertent stall near the ground (I am talking about an aerodynamic condition called a stall, not an engine failure type stall). What happens is that they are near the ground and they make a skidding turn (pushing he rudder too hard because they don't want to bank the wings steeply in a coordinated, rudder plus aileron - like you are supposed to ALWAYS do, way). The inside wing loses its abilty to fly (stalls) while the oustide (of the turn) wing keeps flying.

This results in the inside wing dropping hard down (remember this pilot is near the ground and is standing on the rudder (toward the inside wing, making the drop more severe) too much already in that turn.

The plane enters a spin at about 500 feet above the ground (You cannot recover from a spin in less than 1000 feet above the ground). The aircraft strikes the ground at a high angle and usually the pilot is killed the same way a person is killed if they drive into a wall above 50 mph.

I understand your reticence and caution. Just tell your bro that if he has to make a forced landing, DON'T try to keep from dinging he aircraft by turning to reach a road when all the terrain is mostly flat or rolling hills. Just set up a normal glide STRAIGHT AHEAD (into the wind if possible).

When he is almost at ground level, round out (pull back slightly on the stick) to stop the descent and then flair out (pull back on the stick all the way when the plane no longer wants to fly). This ensures that he will make ground contact with the bushes or whatever at the slowest possible speed (about 50 to 60 mph).

If he is going into a forest, put the plane between two trees. The wings get ripped off and you slow quite quickly. I've flown over Texas. Yeah, you've got all kinds of terrain and East Texas is quite different from West Texas. BUT, trees are not an issue there 99% of the time.  ;D

One more thing: The Beechcraft King Air is an unforgiving (due to the high performance type wing) aircraft. You stay in the proper aircaft envelope or you are toast.

My bro did say that his teachers have told him that landing in trees in an emergency is not a bad plan. In Deep East Texas there aren't many of the wider open spaces we have here. There are some where the land has been cleared for pasture. It once was a temperate rain forest with lots of old growth timber. Before my time.

When I was a kid the only thing left of the lumber boom was abandoned sawmill ponds...and sawdust, which apparently can last for a long, long time if the piles are big enough. Now it's all tangled up 2nd growth you can't walk through easily. But not quite as bad as the Caribbean.

Thanks for the primer on stalls. I had heard of stalls, of course, but you explained it better than I've heard it explained before. Now I want to find a utoob vid, maybe an animation that shows what you described. It sounds like a typical rookie mistake. Like sailing.

But in a boat, rookie mistakes are less likely to kill you.

My oldest younger bro will be a decent pilot, probably. I didn't even know the youngest was a pilot. Not sure on him, as far as how much I'd trust his instincts. I didn't know about the King Air until the older one mentioned it. They flew to all the Alabama home football games last fall. I love 'em both, but don't get up there much since Mom passed. They're quite a bit younger than I. Eight and ten years younger.

I walked at least half the roads in Virgin Gorda and we rented a car one day and saw the rest. I'm glad we did. We were staying by the Baths, which is pretty convenient to walk to Spanish Town, but not to the far north end. That part, where most of the rich people live (like Leverick Bay) was beset by tornados, and the damage was worse than the typical roof-blown-off situation I saw in most other areas. There, houses were randomly chosen for complete demolition by mother nature.

It was the first time I've been in the Caribbean right after a major hurricane. What struck me was the extreme random nature of the damage, where one house is intact and the next one is totally destroyed. Makes me glad I got out before it hit. I still want to write a blog about it. I took a ton of photos. My dear partner didn't understand why I'm more interested in documenting  storm damage than I am in taking pics of batholiths and beaches.  LOL..
« Last Edit: May 26, 2018, 09:35:29 AM by Eddie »
What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

Offline agelbert

  • Global Moderator
  • Master Chef
  • *****
  • Posts: 11391
    • View Profile
    • Renewable Rervolution
Re: For AG. Just A Reminder of Days Gone By
« Reply #3 on: May 27, 2018, 10:54:26 AM »
My youngest brother, the rich(er) one, is now partners in a King Air. My other brother, the one who has the auto shop, has now decided he wants a plane too. Part of this is the decadent wish they both have to fly to Alabama on Fridays now to tailgate before my nephew's college games. I know, I know. But they're from Texas, and Alabama is the Numero Uno college team in the US.

The mechanic brother is very technically competent and is thinking about building some fast four-seater experimental from a kit. But since he's been looking at planes, I've been looking too, not that I ever plan to fly anything. The missus has a very low opinion of general aviation aircraft, and she talked me out of it many years ago now. (We once knew somebody who crashed and killed himself and one of his kids.)

But I saw this the other day and thought of you.


I also wanted to tell you that when we landed at Beef Island last month I counted an even dozen boats still derelict on the beach over near the ferry dock. Seven months later.

Thanks for the info about Beef island. 

Yep, that's a Piper Colt (flying brick) with the 108 horsepower engine. You know, some of them were modified to use flaps. They originally did not have them. The purpose of flaps is not what the non-pilot thinks they are for. Most people think flaps are on a plane to help it fly slower for landing. That is true for fast jet aircraft. BUT, for general aviation aircraft, the purpose of flaps is to steepen the glide path without increasing the airspeed. On a Piper Colt, which has the glide path of a rock  ;D, flaps are not needed.

As to your agreement with your wife not to learn to fly because of the death of a person you knew and his kid, the Wright Brothers once said that the properly designed aircraft would "glide gently to the ground in the event of a power failure".

It didn't quite work out that way but light aircraft are really much safer than cars, especially in Texas!

Consider that in Texas, where you and/or your brother will do most of their flying, ANY power failure will result in a a power off glide at about 75 mph and 700 feet per minute rate of descent. That is what you do every time you land one of those babies.

Unlike Vermont, Texas is pretty flat and has miles and miles of nothing but miles and miles with LOTS of roads. As long as you don't hit a cow, a power transmission tower or a wind turbine, you should walk away from any forced landing.

What gets people killed in light aircraft is mostly an inadvertent stall near the ground (I am talking about an aerodynamic condition called a stall, not an engine failure type stall). What happens is that they are near the ground and they make a skidding turn (pushing he rudder too hard because they don't want to bank the wings steeply in a coordinated, rudder plus aileron - like you are supposed to ALWAYS do, way). The inside wing loses its abilty to fly (stalls) while the oustide (of the turn) wing keeps flying.

This results in the inside wing dropping hard down (remember this pilot is near the ground and is standing on the rudder (toward the inside wing, making the drop more severe) too much already in that turn.

The plane enters a spin at about 500 feet above the ground (You cannot recover from a spin in less than 1000 feet above the ground). The aircraft strikes the ground at a high angle and usually the pilot is killed the same way a person is killed if they drive into a wall above 50 mph.

I understand your reticence and caution. Just tell your bro that if he has to make a forced landing, DON'T try to keep from dinging he aircraft by turning to reach a road when all the terrain is mostly flat or rolling hills. Just set up a normal glide STRAIGHT AHEAD (into the wind if possible).

When he is almost at ground level, round out (pull back slightly on the stick) to stop the descent and then flair out (pull back on the stick all the way when the plane no longer wants to fly). This ensures that he will make ground contact with the bushes or whatever at the slowest possible speed (about 50 to 60 mph).

If he is going into a forest, put the plane between two trees. The wings get ripped off and you slow quite quickly. I've flown over Texas. Yeah, you've got all kinds of terrain and East Texas is quite different from West Texas. BUT, trees are not an issue there 99% of the time.  ;D

One more thing: The Beechcraft King Air is an unforgiving (due to the high performance type wing) aircraft. You stay in the proper aircraft envelope or you are toast.

My bro did say that his teachers have told him that landing in trees in an emergency is not a bad plan. In Deep East Texas there aren't many of the wider open spaces we have here. There are some where the land has been cleared for pasture. It once was a temperate rain forest with lots of old growth timber. Before my time.

When I was a kid the only thing left of the lumber boom was abandoned sawmill ponds...and sawdust, which apparently can last for a long, long time if the piles are big enough. Now it's all tangled up 2nd growth you can't walk through easily. But not quite as bad as the Caribbean.

Thanks for the primer on stalls. I had heard of stalls, of course, but you explained it better than I've heard it explained before. Now I want to find a utoob vid, maybe an animation that shows what you described. It sounds like a typical rookie mistake. Like sailing.

But in a boat, rookie mistakes are less likely to kill you.

My oldest younger bro will be a decent pilot, probably. I didn't even know the youngest was a pilot. Not sure on him, as far as how much I'd trust his instincts. I didn't know about the King Air until the older one mentioned it. They flew to all the Alabama home football games last fall. I love 'em both, but don't get up there much since Mom passed. They're quite a bit younger than I. Eight and ten years younger.

I walked at least half the roads in Virgin Gorda and we rented a car one day and saw the rest. I'm glad we did. We were staying by the Baths, which is pretty convenient to walk to Spanish Town, but not to the far north end. That part, where most of the rich people live (like Leverick Bay) was beset by tornados, and the damage was worse than the typical roof-blown-off situation I saw in most other areas. There, houses were randomly chosen for complete demolition by mother nature.

It was the first time I've been in the Caribbean right after a major hurricane. What struck me was the extreme random nature of the damage, where one house is intact and the next one is totally destroyed. Makes me glad I got out before it hit. I still want to write a blog about it. I took a ton of photos. My dear partner didn't understand why I'm more interested in documenting  storm damage than I am in taking pics of batholiths and beaches.  LOL..


Yes, hurricanes are weird. I was in Puerto Rico when Hurricane Hugo hit. There was a lot of strange stuff to see. some farmers had seen cows flying during the high wind conditions. The tropical rain forest at El Yunque looked like God had given it a crew cut. It's even worse now after Maria. And like you said, it's these little tornadoes in the event that give the uneven damage effects. It will get worse, I'm sure. All those rich folks down there need underground shelters well above sea level from now on. 

Back to the stall business, the whole physics thing with an aerodynamic stall is normally that the laminar flow pattern of high speed air passing over the top of the wing (which creates a lower pressure - See Bernouilli - above the wing than below it, where the air is moving a tad slower, so you have lift and the wing is "sucked" up into the sky) is disturbed by the burble point (the point where the high speed air meets the low speed air at the trailing edge of the wing)  moving all the way to the top of the wing. At that point, the sucking (i.e. lift) stops because there is no more speed differential between the top and the bottom of the wing. Down goes da plane.

I hope that was clear as mud.  ;D There are lots of animations on u-tube so I'm sure you can watch this phenomenon at work.

But the deal with the low altitude skidding turn causing a stall on the inside wing is a bit more complicated.

The normal stall I described above occurs when you keep pulling the nose of the aircraft up so the angle of attack of the wing is too great for the burble point to stay behind the wing where it belongs. It rapidly moves up the wing surface and the stall "breaks", in pilot parlance. At that point the nose suddenly drops despite your back pressure on the stick. The recovery procedure is to lower the nose below the horizon while applying full power.

If your engine has quit, the recovery procedure is to lower the nose to what is call "glide pitch". That is the nose point below the horizon at which the aircraft will reach it's ideal glide speed (the speed where you can control the aircraft AND cover as much forward motion as possible over the ground in order to reach the place you will make ground contact).

But to make a short story long  ;D, the skidding turn ain't like that. In the skidding turn the aircraft is in a cross control situation. That is the proper way  :P to enter a spin if you want to enter a spin (flight instructors are taught this and we are also taught to exit the spin after three turns - about 3000 feet down seconds later on an assigned heading).

But, of course, you do not want to enter a spin at low altitude unless you have a death wish. If you are in a skidding left turn (e.g. you are abeam the runway going the opposite way you are going to land and, when you turn towards the runway, can't get lined up with the runway in the turn with a shallow bank coordinated turn), what you are doing is applying a too much left rudder AND, to keep that bank shallow, you are using RIGHT (not left) aileron against he rudder. Remember that you are forcing the outside wing to go faster. That outside wing is creating more lift. It wants to go UP (steepening the bank to the left). You have to fight it or it will put the aircraft into a steeper bank.

The thing that happens next, while you are busy trying to line up the nose with the runway, is that the speed of the inside wing gets so much "fuselage wash" (the body of the aircraft is wiping out the airflow pattern over the left inside wing surface near the fuselage = no lift there!).

Now it gets really good  :evil4:. The left wing still has SOME lift (there is no high angle of attack condition here so the wing has smooth air beyond the fuselage wash area) but it begins to sink gradually. The pilot then applies MORE right aileron (the worst possible thing he can do simply because the aileraon on the left wing effectively increases the angle of attack which moves the burble point towards the stall condition). The fuselage washout increases and the pressure differential is so slight on the flying part of the inside wing that it just falls out of the sky. All of a sudden the plane is in a steep left turn entering a spin.

The pilot panics and applies full right airelon and reverses the left rudder to full right rudder. The only way that can work is IF you lower the nose well below the horizon, something that you, of course, cannot do when you are 400 to 600 feet about the ground. The panicked pilot tries to keep the nose up as the ground rushes up. That is a BAD, BAD move.

If I get into a cross control stall spin entry close to the ground, I lmust lower the nose as much as I can while coordinating the controls INTO the bank, not out of it. When an aircraft stalls the controls are unresponsive. I need speed to get responsive controls. I NEED to control the aircraft in the seconds I have before gorund contact.

SO, I point at the ground to pick up speed and try a last ditch round out and flair out about 50 feet above the ground. As I said before, if the spin entry from the cross control condition is established, you do not have enough altitude to recover.

I had a similar situation occur from very different conditions. There was no cross control stall or a turning situtation, BUT, it was a severe stall only 70 feet above the ground (runway).

I was teaching landings to a Air Force ROTC student. It was silly to see these kids come to train in a Piper Cherokee 140 in a flight suit, but that's the Air Force fer ya.  ::)

This student was rather nervous. I did my best to keep him relaxed and get him to succesfully make his first landing in order to increase his self confidence. We are lined up with the runway on final approach. He is flying the plane and my hands are on my knees close to the controls.

I coach him to keep the nose pitch (position below the horizon) just right so he doesn't have to watch his airspeed indicator and can concentrate on the approaching runway.

He did fine until the flair out. We gotover the runway at about 20 feet with the round out (pulling the nose slightly back to stop the descent). At that point the aircraft gets into a condition known as ground effect. It is floating on a cushion of air between it and the runway.

You have to wait a few seconds for the aircraft to slow and begin to sink before gradually pull all the way back (flair out) and gently make ground contact with the main wheels.

He didn't do that. He yanked the stick all the way back.  :o The aircraft popped out of ground effect at an angle of about 45 degrees climbing like a homesick angel into a full stall condition. I yelled, "I GOT IT" (the signal for him to let go of he controls). There I was, about 70 feet above the runway, in a full stall condition. :P  I applied full power as I, as smoothlly and gradually as possible 😓, point the nose of the plane over 60 degrees down. I NEEDED flying airspeed. This is one case where the flaps can help you because you can get lift built up quicker at a slower speed with flaps. I applied full flaps. The engine power came up as the ground rushed up.

At the last second, without decreasing the power, I pulled back all th way on the stick. SLAM! The main wheels AND the nose gear hit so hard I thought we might have broken something (I didn't - a testament to the weel designed oleo-struts on the main gear  :emthup: they don't call them trainer aircraft for nothing.  :icon_mrgreen:). I cut the power, raised the flaps, looked at my student and said, "What are you trying to do, kill me?".

I guess I shouldn't have said that but we had a long talk afterwards and he said his dad wanted him to be an Air Force pilot and he hated airplanes and really did not want to fly. I told him he could still learn but he used the hard landing as an excuse to leave the program.  I'm glad he did what he thought was best for him.   
« Last Edit: May 27, 2018, 11:02:37 AM by agelbert »
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
Faith,
if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

Offline agelbert

  • Global Moderator
  • Master Chef
  • *****
  • Posts: 11391
    • View Profile
    • Renewable Rervolution
Re: For AG. Just A Reminder of Days Gone By
« Reply #4 on: May 27, 2018, 02:52:02 PM »
Eddie,
Here's a couple of videos that are educational. The first has both a skidding and a slipping turn type situation explained. The slipping turn is usually less of a problem because the aircraft rolls over the top instead of down. But of course, that one can kill you too.

Quote
Jan 30, 2014 | 16,022 views | by BruceAirFlying
Here's a video that demonstrates the classic base-to-final skidding stall that departs into an incipient spin. The video also shows a stall from a slipping turn.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/zfwLglHEYvQ" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/zfwLglHEYvQ</a>


This video is good too. The base leg is the one right after the downwind (abeam the runway) leg. The base leg is 90 degrees to the runway.
Quote
Dec 20, 2015 | 41,676 views | by Gene Benson
Arguably, the deadliest turn in aviation is the one from base leg to final approach. This brief video explains the common scenario that can lead to a stall/spin .

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/3gKx2eh0urg" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/3gKx2eh0urg</a>
« Last Edit: May 27, 2018, 02:58:18 PM by agelbert »
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
Faith,
if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

 

Related Topics

  Subject / Started by Replies Last post
43 Replies
8626 Views
Last post June 14, 2015, 02:02:01 AM
by RE
3 Replies
720 Views
Last post August 08, 2016, 03:58:06 AM
by azozeo
4 Replies
226 Views
Last post April 17, 2018, 06:34:36 PM
by azozeo