AuthorTopic: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)  (Read 8954 times)

Offline agelbert

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Exactly Right, Surly! ✨
« Reply #90 on: November 01, 2018, 04:23:21 PM »
Peterson's grant wasn't denied because of political reasons;

Sorry, but I don't see any evidence that this is true. You don't even know the identities of the people who made the decision, unless you know them personally. It isn't public knowledge, to the best of my ability to investigate.

To assume that it  isn't political, just because "Julia Gualtieri — a spokesman for the Social Sciences and Humanities Research Council of Canada "  said so, is extremely naive and makes me think you don't know too much about academic bureaucracies. I'd like to see your proof. I know you're busy right now.

You might notice, I'm just demanding proof. I think you're wrong, but I'm prepared to eat some crow if you're right. Let's get to the truth.

I think the burden is on you and AG anybody else who wants to make this case on Peterson.  You are making claims that I think are misplaced. I want some evidence. Good evidence. So far that is not forthcoming from either of you.


I don't know any of the involved personally.  These grants are generally paneled. The panelists rated them poorly.

Peterson, with an axe to grind, says it was "political." Of course he did.

And the great swarm of Peterson fanbois rush in to nod furiously in bobbleheaded enthusiasm. Bottom line: the U said it wasn't political, Peterson says it was. And then the nazis held a bake sale to fund him.

Another case of "he said, she said." As I recall last time we had one of these you came down hard for the accused.

I was hoping not to get sucked into this Peterson bullshit, and to have to do a careful vivisection of his body of work, because frankly, I have a life. And I prefer to not drink from sewers. But for some reason I ascribe to weakness, RE has given Ashvin the run of the place to add nothing, contribute nothing but to make a case for his new Messiah. I'll take that shit up with RE when he's up to it, and I'll deal with Peterson's oeuvre when I have more time. Which i don't now.

Peterson is a Youtube star with a distinct following amount the angy, young, white, and otherwise without agency crowd. Very big with the incels, so they tell me.

Whenever someone's critique starts with, "radical left," that is a tell and they have given the game away. There is no radical left in this country except from the viewpoiint of the far edge of the reactionary right. Thus does a vile insect like Ashvin class anyone as "ideologue" anyone who does not sup uncritically at the table of Petersonism.

Peterson asserts that postmodern philosophers and sociologists since the 1960s[ have insinuated core tenets of Marxism and communism into academe. which is what you say when things aren't going your way and you can't get what you want.He echoes Kunstler's bleats of "cultural Maoists," which so thrill the Ayn Rand company sucks still hiding in the corners around here, but which offend people able to observe the world as it is and think. He says academe was infected with an influence of postmodernism thought that migrated from France to the US via Jacques Derrida and others. We also know how the French fuck up everything. Order up some freedom fries with your pitcher of Blue Ribbon.

As a YouTube star, he offers up plenty for his fanbois to chew on. Conservative views on religion, trans issues, and on feminism. From what I have seen, much of what he says is incoherent and ambiguous. So his acolytes dismiss any criticism as mere misrepresentations of his views. See, if you don't agree, then clearly you don't understand. Or are an unmitigated ideologue.

The same fucking technique of manipulation we've seen in evidence here. Lather, rinse, repeat.



I will add one bit of advice that I will now take in regard to those, like Eddie and Ashvin, who have shown their true colors with some rather stomach turning insults directed at me.

Surly, you will recall the PM discourse I had with you some months back. You will recall my feelings about the base vulgarity of the discourse here on threads I was not even posting on, that had nothing to do with me or my POV.

I came back here now because I knew the Right Wing Propagandists were going to make a push here to help the Republican FASCISTS stay in power so that the full Fascist Trump "Paradise" can be ushered in. I came just to counter them as best I could. I knew it would get hot and heavy very quickly. These fuckers are hell bent (AND hellbound too!) to destroy this country long before Climate Change does. THAT has a LOT to do with why you see them so angry and so much in an arrogant huff about one of their pet High IQ "credentialed" Apologists.

They get the fact that Social Security and Medicare  ELIMINATION, a stated Republican goal, is something they have to counter with lots of LIES and arm waving, doing everything they can to discredit anyone who has the temerity to call BULLSHIT on their claims that Trump et al and bought and paid assholes like Jordan Peterson aren't part of that empathy deficit disordered EVIL. They are all full of mendacious, puke inspired malice and aforethought SHIT. They cannot do anything but wallow in, defend and celebrate, their Right Wing Authoritarian, money loving, money chasing modus vivendi, no matter how damaging to the country AND/OR to the environment. They do not have the remotest idea of what logic and comon sense is. They cannot see beyond their bank accounts. These people are wells without water. They cannot be reasoned with.

So, I will now take Gillum's advice when Trumo called him a liar. 

Gillum posted: “I heard @realDonaldTrump ran home to @FoxNews to lie about me. But as my grandmother told me—never wrestle with a pig. You both get dirty, but the pig likes it.”


😀
« Last Edit: November 01, 2018, 04:44:56 PM by agelbert »
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
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if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

Offline Eddie

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #91 on: November 01, 2018, 04:37:04 PM »
Get off this thread, you lying old douchebag.

I gave you a chance to back up your  character assassination piece de resistance, and you came up short.

So shoo! Get out!

I didn't have the PRIVILEGE of attending one of the most prestigious universities in the world, or flying my own plane, like you did when you were young. I started with exactly nothing.

You know, I do have a small inheritance that I share with my younger brothers. What remains of my grandfather's farm..I wrote it into my will, to give it to them. I never needed it.

Chicken little, I'm looking out at a big beautiful Texas sky, and if you don't go to bed, I'm going to let it fall on you. And if that doesn't work, I'm going to smack the shit out you with it.




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What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

Offline RE

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #92 on: November 01, 2018, 05:36:42 PM »

I was hoping not to get sucked into this Peterson bullshit, and to have to do a careful vivisection of his body of work, because frankly, I have a life. And I prefer to not drink from sewers. But for some reason I ascribe to weakness, RE has given Ashvin the run of the place to add nothing, contribute nothing but to make a case for his new Messiah. I'll take that shit up with RE when he's up to it, and I'll deal with Peterson's oeuvre when I have more time. Which i don't now.
.

My weakness?  I turned over moderation of the forum to you and Eddie quite some time back.  If you want Watson gone, axe him permanently.  I've given him 2 trips to the cooler already.


RE
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Offline Surly1

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #93 on: November 01, 2018, 06:00:48 PM »
I believe people have to do what they can with what they have, where they are. I know money greases the wheels in this world. I believe in saving money and making investments. It beats the shit out of starving in your old age. If that makes me conservative, well then, I'll own it.

I literally hate the Rush Limbaughs and Glenn Becks of the world. I hate the Trumps and the Paul Ryans and the Greg Abbotts.

So it sort of chaps my buns to be called conservative, frankly.
Sorry Eddie,
I don't think you are a conservative, just a little more conservative than I am (you're still living in Texas  ;) a place that was way too right wing for me). And I think I called myself a liberal?? I also have voted almost always democratic (holding my nose the whole time).
I don't think I have any money other than through luck (luck at being white, luck by virtue of where I lived, luck by marrying someone who made a horrendous income, luck, luck, luck) - and maybe a little to do to with being conservative with money I lucked into. I agree you have to do what you can with what you have. I don't think that is liberal or conservative, just smart.
I hate the  same people you do. I just wish there was truly progressive taxation to soak the rich to the benefit of those who did not have the luck I did. But all that is water under the bridge as we wait for Collapse.

Ashvin, I doubt Surly or RE would condemn me for using my brain with the money I had.

AJ

In that last, you are correct.

I don't condemn Eddie in any way, either. RE likes to chap Eddie's balls about being "rich," whatever that is, whereas he's a professional who worked his ass off, made decent bank, invested in a variety things and raised a family of attractive, successful people. That's a hell of a legacy for anyone.

He is most often very common sense, and contributes here in a number of topics and threads aside from this one. We differ on what he terms "identity politics, " and has his reasons. Whereas I think the very notion of a complaint about lefty "identity politics" is ludicrous when right wing blood-and-soil identity politics is steadily amassing a body count. So we argue. Part of why we're here.

"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline Surly1

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #94 on: November 01, 2018, 06:30:17 PM »
But for some reason I ascribe to weakness, RE has given Ashvin the run of the place to add nothing, contribute nothing but to make a case for his new Messiah. I'll take that shit up with RE when he's up to it, and I'll deal with Peterson's oeuvre when I have more time. Which i don't now.

It sounds like you are campaigning to have me banned permanently. So I'll also ascribe to some weakness and tone my language back a notch. I haven't personally insulted anyone since my last temporary ban, but I won't even refer to anyone as an "idelogue" anymore. I just want everything to be perfectly transparent to anyone paying attention when it happens.

I would have never reinstated you. For reasons I have already adduced somewhere above, also "perfectly transparently:" You only comment here on one topic and one topic alone, preach the gospel of your new false Messiah, to sow discord and pit people against one another. It remains to be seen how successful this tiny, localized version of "divide and conquer" will be. You are a troll, and are here to troll.  You have even disabused yourself of the very premises of this board: you asked RE to take down your contributions as you tried to scrub your online identity because you no longer believe any of the things you wrote some years ago. Or so you have said.

You contribute nothing to any threads.

I'd also request that a poll be run before, since you accuse me of adding/contributing nothing - let's see what the rest of the Diners think. I'm sure I don't have the privileges to put one up myself.

If you go to someone's home and get in an argument with the owner, do you take a poll before he throws you out? Now that's funny.

No, you are here only to sow discord and be so provocative and obnoxious that RE has no option but to ban you. Saw this act before with MKing, with GO nuzzling his hindquarters at the time as well.

So I'll put it to you straight, counselor: if, since you have renounced your prior body of work relating to collapse and doom, why traffic an out of the way website like the Doomstead Diner? Or, put another way, if we're such assholes, why are you still here?
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline Ashvin

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #95 on: November 01, 2018, 07:43:57 PM »
So I'll put it to you straight, counselor: if, since you have renounced your prior body of work relating to collapse and doom, why traffic an out of the way website like the Doomstead Diner? Or, put another way, if we're such assholes, why are you still here?

Here's a straight answer - I come here to share what I think are very interesting discussions that are being had in public intellectual circles. Look at the name of this thread that I started. Does the fact that I post videos of Jordan Peterson, who Eddie has also gone to great lengths to defend, equate to me "shitting in your house"? Apparently it does in your mind, because you are the one who responded to a video I posted with an article equating Peterson to someone who would have stopped the Civil Rights marches if he could have - and you are the one who called him a "neofascist". Eddie was the first one to call that nonsense out.

What does my support of Peterson have to do with Collapse, exactly? I am not undermining that narrative at all, even though I don't necessarily agree with it. Clearly people here are interested in Peterson and people voicing similar concerns as him - I am not the first one to bring him up and Eddie, who you say is "most often very common sense", is a huge fan of his as well. Do you think that's some small part of his brain that has malfunctioned, or been manipulated by me? Come on, give the guy more credit than that.

We all know why don't want to run the poll I suggested. You won't like the results. Feel free to continue bashing my contributions here, I don't really care - I'm done responding to you and RE and AG (who is quite clearly the worst violator of the CoC rules than anyone else). I'll just post the videos and let you guys do the character assassinations - I don't think anyone else here is buying it anymore.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2018, 07:46:24 PM by Ashvin »

Offline Ashvin

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #96 on: November 01, 2018, 07:53:31 PM »
My favorite example of Peterson taking an ideologue interviewer to task:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/7QRQjrsFnR4" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/7QRQjrsFnR4</a>

On another thread, I mentioned that I've been reading the blog of a guy who has written a lot about money and exchange, over the years. His politics do not align with mine, but he's a smart guy. He invented Mastercard, way back in 1967.

 He takes the  false narrative of the liberals to task too. That part I'm good with...the rest I read to understand why a really smart guy might like Trump, because he does. Certain smart people do, like Scott Adams the cartoonist, who is still writing a lot about him.

I see the other side too well, and I view the guy (Trump I mean) as a dangerous loose cannon. But FYI. You might get something out of reading Michael Phillips. His latest blog post attempts to shed some light on how the left got to here. He says it started way back.

https://phillips.blogs.com/

I finally remembered this and got around to checking it out. I like what I am reading so far. His latest post touching on the issue of immigration/mass migration ends with this - "No one has an answer, that I know of." That's for damn sure!

Offline RE

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #97 on: November 01, 2018, 08:05:18 PM »
So I'll put it to you straight, counselor: if, since you have renounced your prior body of work relating to collapse and doom, why traffic an out of the way website like the Doomstead Diner? Or, put another way, if we're such assholes, why are you still here?

Here's a straight answer - I come here to share what I think are very interesting discussions that are being had in public intellectual circles. Look at the name of this thread that I started. Does the fact that I post videos of Jordan Peterson, who Eddie has also gone to great lengths to defend, equate to me "shitting in your house"? Apparently it does in your mind, because you are the one who responded to a video I posted with an article equating Peterson to someone who would have stopped the Civil Rights marches if he could have - and you are the one who called him a "neofascist". Eddie was the first one to call that nonsense out.

What does my support of Peterson have to do with Collapse, exactly? I am not undermining that narrative at all, even though I don't necessarily agree with it. Clearly people here are interested in Peterson and people voicing similar concerns as him - I am not the first one to bring him up and Eddie, who you say is "most often very common sense", is a huge fan of his as well. Do you think that's some small part of his brain that has malfunctioned, or been manipulated by me? Come on, give the guy more credit than that.

We all know why don't want to run the poll I suggested. You won't like the results. Feel free to continue bashing my contributions here, I don't really care - I'm done responding to you and RE and AG (who is quite clearly the worst violator of the CoC rules than anyone else). I'll just post the videos and let you guys do the character assassinations - I don't think anyone else here is buying it anymore.

OK, we get it, you think JP is the greatest political philosopher to hit video since William F Buckley Jr's Firing Line went off the air.  Now, try moving on to another topic with a more direct connection to collapse, like say climate change.  This website is not a promotional platform for a pseuointellectual hoser academic who appeals to Fascist readers looking for self-justification.

RE

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Offline Ashvin

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #98 on: November 01, 2018, 08:37:24 PM »
So I'll put it to you straight, counselor: if, since you have renounced your prior body of work relating to collapse and doom, why traffic an out of the way website like the Doomstead Diner? Or, put another way, if we're such assholes, why are you still here?

Here's a straight answer - I come here to share what I think are very interesting discussions that are being had in public intellectual circles. Look at the name of this thread that I started. Does the fact that I post videos of Jordan Peterson, who Eddie has also gone to great lengths to defend, equate to me "shitting in your house"? Apparently it does in your mind, because you are the one who responded to a video I posted with an article equating Peterson to someone who would have stopped the Civil Rights marches if he could have - and you are the one who called him a "neofascist". Eddie was the first one to call that nonsense out.

What does my support of Peterson have to do with Collapse, exactly? I am not undermining that narrative at all, even though I don't necessarily agree with it. Clearly people here are interested in Peterson and people voicing similar concerns as him - I am not the first one to bring him up and Eddie, who you say is "most often very common sense", is a huge fan of his as well. Do you think that's some small part of his brain that has malfunctioned, or been manipulated by me? Come on, give the guy more credit than that.

We all know why don't want to run the poll I suggested. You won't like the results. Feel free to continue bashing my contributions here, I don't really care - I'm done responding to you and RE and AG (who is quite clearly the worst violator of the CoC rules than anyone else). I'll just post the videos and let you guys do the character assassinations - I don't think anyone else here is buying it anymore.

OK, we get it, you think JP is the greatest political philosopher to hit video since William F Buckley Jr's Firing Line went off the air.  Now, try moving on to another topic with a more direct connection to collapse, like say climate change.  This website is not a promotional platform for a pseuointellectual hoser academic who appeals to Fascist readers looking for self-justification.

RE

I'm not moving off the IDW topic any time soon. This website used to have a place for philosophical, theological and spiritual discussions. As I have said before, but I'm sure went unnoticed, is that I am most fascinated by Peterson's philosophical and theological perspectives, not his "political philosopher" perspectives.

The guy has an entire lecture series of 30+hours on the book of Genesis - yes, that's right, just the book of Genesis. He plans on tackling Exodus pretty soon. There's nothing political or "fascist" about any of that.

All of his YouTube content is free, which include videos which basically serve as audio books for the two best selling books he wrote - Maps of Meaning and 12 Rules for Life. Again, not even a hint of fascism.
« Last Edit: November 01, 2018, 08:39:42 PM by Ashvin »

Offline RE

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #99 on: November 01, 2018, 09:20:50 PM »

I'm not moving off the IDW topic any time soon. This website used to have a place for philosophical, theological and spiritual discussions. As I have said before, but I'm sure went unnoticed, is that I am most fascinated by Peterson's philosophical and theological perspectives, not his "political philosopher" perspectives.

That is unfortunate, since it is now a Violation of the CoC to post in only one thread or focus on one author or topic to the exclusion of all others.  You  have reached your limit on JP.  If you want to post more fan mail, I suggest you start a JP Ass Kissers Website.


RE
« Last Edit: November 02, 2018, 04:33:06 AM by RE »
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Offline K-Dog

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #100 on: November 02, 2018, 12:52:06 AM »
Newbies to doom think 'the problems' can be fixed if we all come together.

C'mon people now
Smile on your brother
Ev'rybody get together
Try to love one another right now


Yeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaa,
not.

After the freshness of doom fades the newbie finds out that in general people really don't give a shit if humanity survives or not and there are people who will actively engage in activities that will hasten doom if it is in there best interest to so act.  Realizing this will eventually cause one to conclude that we are fucked but the idea will be resisted for a very long time.

But in that Camelot utopian newbie dream,

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/1orcZAf6v4E?ecver=1" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/1orcZAf6v4E?ecver=1</a>

If you hear the song we sing
You will understand listen
You hold the key to love and fear
All in your trembling hand
Just one key unlocks them both
It's there at your command


we imagine everyone coming together and doing the right thing.  Everyone being responsible together.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/_uuRtx_BCjQ?ecver=1" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/_uuRtx_BCjQ?ecver=1</a>

Here JP speaks to having meaning in life by being responsible.  Do something difficult and heroic he says.

Like mitigate collapse!


Because some success is better than none.
« Last Edit: November 02, 2018, 01:07:28 AM by K-Dog »
Under ideal conditions of temperature and pressure the organism will grow without limit.

Offline Surly1

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #101 on: November 02, 2018, 04:15:11 AM »
Quote
Newbies to doom think 'the problems' can be fixed if we all come together.

And to whom exactly on this thread does the straw man "newbies to doom" apply?
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline g

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #102 on: November 02, 2018, 05:38:45 AM »
Quote
Newbies to doom think 'the problems' can be fixed if we all come together.

And to whom exactly on this thread does the straw man "newbies to doom" apply?

I took it to mean a reference to everyone in the world Surly, not directed at just the Diner population.

Of course we all read and interpret postings differently but in this case I feel strongly you are far adrift from the intended audience.

Found myself thinking quite a bit about this posting, it caused me much thought and quite frankly it depressed the hell out of me.

Quite often I ask myself, "What's the Use",  many people just don't give a shit, as K-Dog correctly points out, and the world obviously needs a joint effort with everyone participating.    :dontknow:

Offline Eddie

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #103 on: November 02, 2018, 05:54:00 AM »
Newbies to doom think 'the problems' can be fixed if we all come together.

C'mon people now
Smile on your brother
Ev'rybody get together
Try to love one another right now


Yeeeeeeeeeaaaaaaaaaaaa,
not.

After the freshness of doom fades the newbie finds out that in general people really don't give a shit if humanity survives or not and there are people who will actively engage in activities that will hasten doom if it is in there best interest to so act.  Realizing this will eventually cause one to conclude that we are fucked but the idea will be resisted for a very long time.

But in that Camelot utopian newbie dream,

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/1orcZAf6v4E?ecver=1" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/1orcZAf6v4E?ecver=1</a>

If you hear the song we sing
You will understand listen
You hold the key to love and fear
All in your trembling hand
Just one key unlocks them both
It's there at your command


we imagine everyone coming together and doing the right thing.  Everyone being responsible together.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/_uuRtx_BCjQ?ecver=1" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/_uuRtx_BCjQ?ecver=1</a>

Here JP speaks to having meaning in life by being responsible.  Do something difficult and heroic he says.

Like mitigate collapse!


Because some success is better than none.

A worthy goal. but it's also a worth goal to try to help young men deal with the difficult task of taking responsibility for their own lives, which is what JP is really about. Not about politics at all. If the silly academic PC police had not come for him, I don't think he'd have become such a lightning rod.  I repeat....He is not about politics. He's about mentoring young males, who badly need someone like him.

I get what you're saying about newbies...but that isn't quite exactly right, imho. Not so much newbies, but people who have a mistaken idea about how collapse manifests. As you have stated eloquently on other threads, it isn't a simple process.

For Rome it took 300 years. It won't take us that long, but people do need to understand that collapse is a long process in terms of our short human lives. We see it ongoing. We will not see the end, those of us alive now.

People want to make collapse into a simple meme they can grasp, so they latch on to a lot of false messages being offered by people who are merchants of fear and financial predators.

Some notable false memes:

The USD dollar is going  to become worthless within a few years.

One day all the gas stations will close at once, and never re-open.

It's a good idea to emigrate to some foreign country.

Your'e a bad guy if you don't drop out and move to an off-grid doomstead.

Saving for your future is stupid because there is no future.

BAU is an inherently evil process that can be and needs to be ended by a revolution.

Economic crashes are good, because they hasten the process.

Once BAU ends, we can begin an idyllic way of neo-Victorian living with horses and carriages


I believe in collapse. But I also believe collapse is not a single event. It is a multifactoral, long, drawn out process that can be successfully denied or ignored until something happens to you personally that changes your life. Most people will never be aware of it.




« Last Edit: November 02, 2018, 05:56:48 AM by Eddie »
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Offline Ashvin

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Re: The Intellectual Dark Web (IDW)
« Reply #104 on: November 02, 2018, 06:22:15 AM »
I believe in collapse. But I also believe collapse is not a single event. It is a multifactoral, long, drawn out process that can be successfully denied or ignored until something happens to you personally that changes your life. Most people will never be aware of it.

That's a very good observation. Everyone will experience a personal collapse (or a few) during their lifetimes, regardless of what is happening in the broader society. If the broader society is undergoing collapse as well, i.e. a financial collapse in this case, it will magnify the experience of a personal collapse. This is why people need to become resilient no matter what they believe about the future.

On the other hand, given the rapid technological developments in society, especially in communication networks, there is also the possibility that ONE person's decisions to take on maximal responsibility for themselves, their family and their community could ripple out into society and have vastly outsized effects. The odds get even better with a few people or a few groups of people making such decisions. I believe this is where you can find some optimism, GO, and perhaps an answer to the question of "what's the use?"

It's a fool's game IMO to try and predict any of this stuff with anything approximating certainty, though. The individual level of analysis is the only one that makes sense to me anymore. For example, I have been following debates about the dangers/benefits of Artificial Intelligence systems. You have people like Elon Musk who really believe the dangers are immense and not far off, and then you have people like this guy Lex Fridman who are not so sure:

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/j5FOumrXyww" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/j5FOumrXyww</a>

It's a fascinating discussion to me, but in the end I'm not sure anyone can predict what will happen with these AI systems with any useful degree of certainty.

 

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