AuthorTopic: The Religion of Libertarianism  (Read 886 times)

Offline Surly1

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The Religion of Libertarianism
« on: September 13, 2018, 11:51:36 AM »
The Religion of Libertarianism

We'll just put this right here. Enjoy.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/ycu8Rlu7TBY" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/ycu8Rlu7TBY</a>
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline cernunnos5

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #1 on: September 13, 2018, 01:23:45 PM »
Today was a day of facing mistakes on the wind tower build. The guide lines did not go smooth... and after some yelling....I buckled down to the fact that I will just have to drop another hundred bucks and another 4-5 days of hard graft into it.

So I have hit the beer and am ready to talk politics. What can possibly go wrong.

First, someone needs to explain to amerikans, that libertarianism, in Europe and throughout history, has been a socialist movement....and amerikans just stole the name without understanding its meaning. There is a bit of Idiocracy going on there.

Next issue. Its a non issue to me. Medicare, grannycare, garbage pickup, edumacation.... roads....That is all about to disappear anyhow. Amerikan libertarians are about to have that thrown at them and we will see how they like it when they get there... but they will blame socialists for it all. Im not sure how libertarian preppers miss the incongruous fact that the collapse they warn people about is the exact world they want.

I definitely am on board with the "Lets stop funding roads", though. I figure, if we really get behind that, most of the worlds problems will sort themselves out rather quickly. Think it through.

Offline Surly1

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #2 on: September 13, 2018, 01:49:37 PM »
Today was a day of facing mistakes on the wind tower build. The guide lines did not go smooth... and after some yelling....I buckled down to the fact that I will just have to drop another hundred bucks and another 4-5 days of hard graft into it.

So I have hit the beer and am ready to talk politics. What can possibly go wrong.

First, someone needs to explain to amerikans, that libertarianism, in Europe and throughout history, has been a socialist movement....and amerikans just stole the name without understanding its meaning. There is a bit of Idiocracy going on there.

Next issue. Its a non issue to me. Medicare, grannycare, garbage pickup, edumacation.... roads....That is all about to disappear anyhow. Amerikan libertarians are about to have that thrown at them and we will see how they like it when they get there... but they will blame socialists for it all. Im not sure how libertarian preppers miss the incongruous fact that the collapse they warn people about is the exact world they want.

I definitely am on board with the "Lets stop funding roads", though. I figure, if we really get behind that, most of the worlds problems will sort themselves out rather quickly. Think it through.

You're quite correct.

It's the same reason Morris Berman offers for the assertion is that Trump is the best President possible is you're forecasting collapse. He's been observing American decline for decades, and he thinks Trump is the perfect accelerant for the coming bonfire.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline Eddie

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #3 on: September 13, 2018, 02:15:25 PM »
First, someone needs to explain to amerikans, that libertarianism, in Europe and throughout history, has been a socialist movement....and amerikans just stole the name without understanding its meaning. There is a bit of Idiocracy going on there.

To me, true libertarianism means the freedom to do whatever the fuck you want AS LONG AS you aren't doing something negative that impacts other people. For that kind of world to function, people have to be damned responsible and aware, and think very long term, like the native tribes did.

American Libertarianism (Koch sucking) means freedom to loot the commons, and freedom to socialize the environmental costs of all the dirty,extractive industries, while privatizing all the profits and funneling them to the elites at the top.

I'm not sure how these two radically different things can go by the same name.

Words don't seem to really mean much anymore. And people, generally, are not too smart.

I'm on root canal numero dos, and have one more after this one. I am jealous of the beer part. I haven't been drinking lately, and it makes me very thirsty sometimes.
What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

Offline cernunnos5

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #4 on: September 13, 2018, 03:03:27 PM »
As they say, "The only thing amerikans ever really invented was advertising". Every thing else was stolen from other peoples good ideas. Like the Constitution they took from the Iroquois confederacy.

I do remember a T-shirt on a lesbian with a short mohawk  due, that said, "Fiscally Conservative. Socially Liberal. Sexually Libertarian!". In discordian nature, I thought to myself with a chuckle, "I can get behind that. That describes me  and I think it describes a lot  of GenXers.

I think amerikans just get sucked into the advertising because it has "Liberty" in the title. With great liberty comes great responsibility. People dont want the responsibility part though.

If you want to cut through the shit, just ask a libertarian to house a mentally ill homeless person in their home. To be fair and balanced,  Both MrsC5 and myself have said that to people that identify as  "socialist". And, independently, we have both watched "good people" suddenly go full exorcist, vomit spewing. demon possessed. Confronted with actual, virtuous, social responsibility.... people dont do so well.

Offline RE

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #5 on: September 13, 2018, 04:28:01 PM »
"Libertarian" is just another word for "Retard".

RE
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Offline cernunnos5

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #6 on: September 13, 2018, 05:25:43 PM »
As I mentioned... C5 drinking.

It has been a long, strange path for me. The better part of me once used to house homeless people. That ended badly.It seemed god wasnt interested in fulfilling his obligations. That dark place taught me not to judge others because we all face the dark place of our own hypocrisies and weakness. One more hit and I eventually went full Dark Side. I eventually hit "Fuck all ya all". That nearly killed me. I had to come back to some semblance of light. There is a quote of Solomon, "Neither be too good nor too evil. Why destroy yourself".

Through it all, I learned the complexity of moral judgement.

And that leads to this. Youtube suggested I might like This. I went, "Fuck, Yah. Its awesome."

No, Really. I just revealed my soul to strangers simply because I found a cool song.... but that is me.... drinking

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8zfYO9sZjrE

Its a very unusual cover of one of my favorite "Angry" songs, when I am angry about other peoples hypocrisy. Its the original song I was listening to when hooked up with 3 bisexual chicks. That may sound awesome but it was one of the worst experiences of my life. They were pretty judgy.... especially when they were high.

I just told you all this personal stuff.... because that is one awesome cover. Go listen.

Not quite as good as this one. My favorite cover of all time. The song I think of when thinking about MrsC5.


   https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P_NpxTWbovE

Offline g

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #7 on: September 13, 2018, 11:08:50 PM »
Here is just one of those Retards Bright Boy.

The founder of Wikileaks, responsible for millions of documents detailing the crimes of governments and corporations around the world, says that the current libertarian strain of political thought in the Republican Party was the "the only hope" for American electoral politics. Assange has commended the libertarian ideal of "non-violence" on issues like foreign wars, the draft, tax collection and privacy. Assange also loves markets and is hugely influenced by American libertarianism.

At a forum hosted by the transparency organization OurSay.org, Assange said that " am a big admirer of Ron Paul and Rand Paul for their very principled positions in the U.S. Congress on a number of issues.They have been the strongest supporters of the fight against the U.S. attack on WikiLeaks and on me in the U.S. Congress. Similarly, they have been the strongest opponents of drone warfare and extrajudicial executions."

                             

Offline Agent Graves

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #8 on: September 14, 2018, 12:43:29 AM »
Like keeping guns? Dont like paying lotsa tax? dont like a standing army? dont like police state? Then u should like limited govt.
Junior  Operative, FBI Counter-Doomsdaycult Taskforce

Offline Surly1

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #9 on: September 14, 2018, 03:59:54 AM »
Here is just one of those Retards Bright Boy.

The founder of Wikileaks, responsible for millions of documents detailing the crimes of governments and corporations around the world, says that the current libertarian strain of political thought in the Republican Party was the "the only hope" for American electoral politics. Assange has commended the libertarian ideal of "non-violence" on issues like foreign wars, the draft, tax collection and privacy. Assange also loves markets and is hugely influenced by American libertarianism.

At a forum hosted by the transparency organization OurSay.org, Assange said that " am a big admirer of Ron Paul and Rand Paul for their very principled positions in the U.S. Congress on a number of issues.They have been the strongest supporters of the fight against the U.S. attack on WikiLeaks and on me in the U.S. Congress. Similarly, they have been the strongest opponents of drone warfare and extrajudicial executions."
     

Yeah, yeah, yeah, heard it all before. He's paid in rubles.
Not backed by gold.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline Surly1

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #10 on: September 14, 2018, 04:10:33 AM »
As they say, "The only thing amerikans ever really invented was advertising". Every thing else was stolen from other peoples good ideas. Like the Constitution they took from the Iroquois confederacy.

I do remember a T-shirt on a lesbian with a short mohawk  due, that said, "Fiscally Conservative. Socially Liberal. Sexually Libertarian!". In discordian nature, I thought to myself with a chuckle, "I can get behind that. That describes me  and I think it describes a lot  of GenXers.

I think amerikans just get sucked into the advertising because it has "Liberty" in the title. With great liberty comes great responsibility. People dont want the responsibility part though.

If you want to cut through the shit, just ask a libertarian to house a mentally ill homeless person in their home. To be fair and balanced,  Both MrsC5 and myself have said that to people that identify as  "socialist". And, independently, we have both watched "good people" suddenly go full exorcist, vomit spewing. demon possessed. Confronted with actual, virtuous, social responsibility.... people dont do so well.

Lot of truth here, IMO.

My wife and I have both worked with homeless people. For short engagements. Fed homeless also through Food not Bombs, and during Occupy. It's a thankless job, and those who can do it long terms are truly saints among us.

I sure couldn't do it.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline g

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #11 on: September 14, 2018, 04:32:58 AM »
Here is just one of those Retards Bright Boy.

The founder of Wikileaks, responsible for millions of documents detailing the crimes of governments and corporations around the world, says that the current libertarian strain of political thought in the Republican Party was the "the only hope" for American electoral politics. Assange has commended the libertarian ideal of "non-violence" on issues like foreign wars, the draft, tax collection and privacy. Assange also loves markets and is hugely influenced by American libertarianism.

At a forum hosted by the transparency organization OurSay.org, Assange said that " am a big admirer of Ron Paul and Rand Paul for their very principled positions in the U.S. Congress on a number of issues.They have been the strongest supporters of the fight against the U.S. attack on WikiLeaks and on me in the U.S. Congress. Similarly, they have been the strongest opponents of drone warfare and extrajudicial executions."
     

Yeah, yeah, yeah, heard it all before. He's paid in rubles.
Not backed by gold.
Here is just one of those Retards Bright Boy.

The founder of Wikileaks, responsible for millions of documents detailing the crimes of governments and corporations around the world, says that the current libertarian strain of political thought in the Republican Party was the "the only hope" for American electoral politics. Assange has commended the libertarian ideal of "non-violence" on issues like foreign wars, the draft, tax collection and privacy. Assange also loves markets and is hugely influenced by American libertarianism.

At a forum hosted by the transparency organization OurSay.org, Assange said that " am a big admirer of Ron Paul and Rand Paul for their very principled positions in the U.S. Congress on a number of issues.They have been the strongest supporters of the fight against the U.S. attack on WikiLeaks and on me in the U.S. Congress. Similarly, they have been the strongest opponents of drone warfare and extrajudicial executions."

                             

Yes, and they sneak him out to Moscow once a week where he parties with the whores alongside Donald as they count the loot together and guzzle vodka and caviar. 

Offline g

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #12 on: September 14, 2018, 04:53:42 AM »
As they say, "The only thing amerikans ever really invented was advertising". Every thing else was stolen from other peoples good ideas. Like the Constitution they took from the Iroquois confederacy.

I do remember a T-shirt on a lesbian with a short mohawk  due, that said, "Fiscally Conservative. Socially Liberal. Sexually Libertarian!". In discordian nature, I thought to myself with a chuckle, "I can get behind that. That describes me  and I think it describes a lot  of GenXers.

I think amerikans just get sucked into the advertising because it has "Liberty" in the title. With great liberty comes great responsibility. People dont want the responsibility part though.

If you want to cut through the shit, just ask a libertarian to house a mentally ill homeless person in their home. To be fair and balanced,  Both MrsC5 and myself have said that to people that identify as  "socialist". And, independently, we have both watched "good people" suddenly go full exorcist, vomit spewing. demon possessed. Confronted with actual, virtuous, social responsibility.... people dont do so well.

Lot of truth here, IMO.

My wife and I have both worked with homeless people. For short engagements. Fed homeless also through Food not Bombs, and during Occupy. It's a thankless job, and those who can do it long terms are truly saints among us.

I sure couldn't do it.

Nor could I, bringing them into my home would also be unthinkable for me.

I did befriend one once, a panhandler that used to wait for me every morning in the financial district. He was a master at his art and it was real hard to pass him up, as he would greet me in the nicest manner and tell me what a great day I had ahead of me.

Sort of got to know him a bit in that brief encounter every morning and got him a decent job at a Greek friends coffee shop in the area. He only lasted a week unfortunately. He was a hopeless alcoholic, most of them are in my very limited experience with them, and my friend told me he had to let him go as he couldn't get past 10 in the morning without sipping on the old jug. Shame how some folks seem to just be fucked in life for one reason or another. We don't often realize how fortunate and lucky we are.

"There but for the Grace of God Go I"

                           


                     

Offline RE

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #13 on: September 14, 2018, 07:03:01 AM »
As they say, "The only thing amerikans ever really invented was advertising". Every thing else was stolen from other peoples good ideas. Like the Constitution they took from the Iroquois confederacy.

I do remember a T-shirt on a lesbian with a short mohawk  due, that said, "Fiscally Conservative. Socially Liberal. Sexually Libertarian!". In discordian nature, I thought to myself with a chuckle, "I can get behind that. That describes me  and I think it describes a lot  of GenXers.

I think amerikans just get sucked into the advertising because it has "Liberty" in the title. With great liberty comes great responsibility. People dont want the responsibility part though.

If you want to cut through the shit, just ask a libertarian to house a mentally ill homeless person in their home. To be fair and balanced,  Both MrsC5 and myself have said that to people that identify as  "socialist". And, independently, we have both watched "good people" suddenly go full exorcist, vomit spewing. demon possessed. Confronted with actual, virtuous, social responsibility.... people dont do so well.

Lot of truth here, IMO.

My wife and I have both worked with homeless people. For short engagements. Fed homeless also through Food not Bombs, and during Occupy. It's a thankless job, and those who can do it long terms are truly saints among us.

I sure couldn't do it.

They don't do it because they are Saints.  They do it because it is a good way to make a living.  I have experience with this.  Homeless people are like Cripples, nobody likes to help them for free.  If you pay them though, they are very nice to you and respectful.  If it is Volunteer work, they get tired of you and pissed off at having to help you all the time.  Money makes a big difference here, it turns normal people into Saints.

RE
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Offline g

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Re: The Religion of Libertarianism
« Reply #14 on: September 14, 2018, 07:25:30 AM »
As they say, "The only thing amerikans ever really invented was advertising". Every thing else was stolen from other peoples good ideas. Like the Constitution they took from the Iroquois confederacy.

I do remember a T-shirt on a lesbian with a short mohawk  due, that said, "Fiscally Conservative. Socially Liberal. Sexually Libertarian!". In discordian nature, I thought to myself with a chuckle, "I can get behind that. That describes me  and I think it describes a lot  of GenXers.

I think amerikans just get sucked into the advertising because it has "Liberty" in the title. With great liberty comes great responsibility. People dont want the responsibility part though.

If you want to cut through the shit, just ask a libertarian to house a mentally ill homeless person in their home. To be fair and balanced,  Both MrsC5 and myself have said that to people that identify as  "socialist". And, independently, we have both watched "good people" suddenly go full exorcist, vomit spewing. demon possessed. Confronted with actual, virtuous, social responsibility.... people dont do so well.

Lot of truth here, IMO.

My wife and I have both worked with homeless people. For short engagements. Fed homeless also through Food not Bombs, and during Occupy. It's a thankless job, and those who can do it long terms are truly saints among us.

I sure couldn't do it.

They don't do it because they are Saints.  They do it because it is a good way to make a living.  I have experience with this.  Homeless people are like Cripples, nobody likes to help them for free.  If you pay them though, they are very nice to you and respectful.  If it is Volunteer work, they get tired of you and pissed off at having to help you all the time.  Money makes a big difference here, it turns normal people into Saints.

RE

Yes, An unpleasant truth as they say.

Another that I always found interesting was the lack of the religious community present amongst these folks in very accessible areas like Boston Common where many dwell.

They collect money for charities all over the undeveloped world, yet seem to pay scant attention to these people. It's as if they blame them for their plight.

Shouldn't be criticizing since I do zero for them myself but then again I'm hardly a man of the cloth or nun.

Probably they think if they gave up the booze all would be well, but there again I have my doubts.

World and it's differing folks sure is a complicated topic.  :dontknow:

 

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