AuthorTopic: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey  (Read 17577 times)

Offline Eddie

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #30 on: January 06, 2019, 01:12:14 PM »
For the most part in my Guesstimation, these are the upper middle class and moderately rich people who take several vacations every year to Snorkel in places like the Virgin Islands and to Ski the Deep Powder in the Rockies.  These people are now starting to burn some serious amounts of Jet Fuel.

And maybe trips to visit a sick friend? Does that count, comrade? Piss on you, motherfucker.

I don't remember my answer. I think I only flew 4 times in 2018, but if I'm involved in a longer course of training, or in doomer education (and I have flown several times just for that), sometimes it's much more, maybe 10 trips.

WTF cares, the VAST majority of flights are by salesmen and business people. Your class envy is showing again.
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Offline RE

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #31 on: January 06, 2019, 01:43:32 PM »
Given the disasters of 3 Mile Island, Chernobyl and Fukushima, it's hard for me to understand how anyone can be in favor of Nuclear Energy

When I called the survey wacky, part of what I meant was that you make it very likely to get certain answers when you world the questions in  a certain way. This is a good example.

I can't remember how I voted actually but the two best choices, which got the most answers, leave a huge gap for a lot of people, who might fall in the middle somewhere.

For instance, I don't believe nukes will fail and end life on earth. I believe nukes will fail and make life on earth a lot more dangerous, more or less into perpetuity. But that was not one of the choices.

On the other hand, I don't believe nukes are necessary.

None of those answers describes my POV very well, and I suspect that many other people feel the same way.

There was a choice in there if the other ones didn't satisfy you, it was labelled "Other".  13% of the respondents took that choice and wrote in pretty much what you said.  The survey was not "wacky".

Besides that, I offered you the opportunity to help construct the survey, you did not take it.  Now you just emanate Negative Waves and criticize me.  You don't have the right to be critical if you don't help when offered that opportunity.

RE
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Offline AJ

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #32 on: January 06, 2019, 01:52:59 PM »

It means something, this level of educational attainment. It just means something entirely different than whether someone is "dumb" or "smart". It's only tangentially related to that.

What it does mean is that people with Dr. in front of their names are capable of sustained focus, and were willing to hang in with the educational system (which largely does suck) in order to get some kind of credential. It means they are people who can work a plan to completion.

That was great Eddie.
I think you hit the nail on the head. Long before Law School I started building a house in Tahoe on the weekends. Soon after starting I KNEW I was in way over my head (I had done construction as a teenager). BUT I convinced myself I could do it if I just did one thing at a time and then moved on to the next. Same with Law School years latter. At the start it looked so long to do 3 years then study for the Bar. One step at a time focus got me there. (Even got me to the top of my class (too bad it was a no-name law school :laugh:)). I think I have met more dumb lawyers than anyone (also some pretty evil ones too). So, I don't take credentials to mean intelligence (or only a certain amount of focused intelligence) just persistence toward a goal.
AJ

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Offline azozeo

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #33 on: January 06, 2019, 02:01:20 PM »

It means something, this level of educational attainment. It just means something entirely different than whether someone is "dumb" or "smart". It's only tangentially related to that.

What it does mean is that people with Dr. in front of their names are capable of sustained focus, and were willing to hang in with the educational system (which largely does suck) in order to get some kind of credential. It means they are people who can work a plan to completion.

That was great Eddie.
I think you hit the nail on the head. Long before Law School I started building a house in Tahoe on the weekends. Soon after starting I KNEW I was in way over my head (I had done construction as a teenager). BUT I convinced myself I could do it if I just did one thing at a time and then moved on to the next. Same with Law School years latter. At the start it looked so long to do 3 years then study for the Bar. One step at a time focus got me there. (Even got me to the top of my class (too bad it was a no-name law school :laugh:)). I think I have met more dumb lawyers than anyone (also some pretty evil ones too). So, I don't take credentials to mean intelligence (or only a certain amount of focused intelligence) just persistence toward a goal.
AJ


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Offline RE

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #34 on: January 06, 2019, 02:07:38 PM »
For the most part in my Guesstimation, these are the upper middle class and moderately rich people who take several vacations every year to Snorkel in places like the Virgin Islands and to Ski the Deep Powder in the Rockies.  These people are now starting to burn some serious amounts of Jet Fuel.

And maybe trips to visit a sick friend? Does that count, comrade? Piss on you, motherfucker.

Just doing a little needling. lol.

Yea, the trips to visit sick friends count.  Especially if you get a vacation Whale Watching and Hiking the Glaciers out of it.

Quote
I don't remember my answer. I think I only flew 4 times in 2018, but if I'm involved in a longer course of training, or in doomer education (and I have flown several times just for that), sometimes it's much more, maybe 10 trips.

I flew once in 2018 I think.  My Tombstone Adventure.  The only time I flew more often than 1-2 times/year was in the early years after the divorce when my hated father was living in other countries and I got flown to visit with him.  Once I flew on a 747 that was virtually empty.  Qantas Airlines in the 70s, not a real well run airline at the time.

Quote
WTF cares, the VAST majority of flights are by salesmen and business people.

Definitely not true of flights from Anchorage to Honolulu.  That is all tourists.  Definitely true that it's all "bizness" on flights from Anchorage to the Slope though.  That's all Oil workers.  Nobody goes to Barrow for a vacation.

However, the bizness flights count for the same upper middle class to rich people.  You don't get flown around for your job as a carpenter, although you might take a flight for a training workshop every couple of years or so.  You have to be making  a lot of money to fly around for your job, whether it is you or the company you work for directly foots the bill.

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Your class envy is showing again.

You're framing the argument again with your own opinion.  It's not "class envy".  It's maldistribution of wealth, which ends with one class of people burning copious quantities of fossil fuels while the other class burns far less.  Poor people just don't burn as much FF as rich people do, they don't have the money to burn.

RE
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Offline Eddie

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #35 on: January 06, 2019, 02:47:29 PM »
What I am is a regular guy who works his ass off and has a pretty decent life. Unlike most people on the planet, I get collapse.

I don't take kindly to other people (like you for instance)  whom I've gone out of my way to be nice to.....to turn on me and try to use me for a whipping boy because it suits their misguided purpose.

I'm not in need of anything from you. I frankly think, after getting to know you WAY better than anyone here, that you suffer from a pathological personality disorder. You've appointed yourself judge and jury of the rest of us mere mortals. Good thing almost nobody at all gives a shit what you think about anything,

I'm going to shut up now, because I don't want to say anything else. I could say much more, but there is no purpose there.

But stop shitting on me. I don't like it, and I won't put up with it.
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Offline RE

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🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey - In Between answers on Nuclear Energy
« Reply #36 on: January 06, 2019, 02:49:03 PM »
Here's the responses from the "Other" category of the Nuclear Energy Question:

nuclear is dangerous but it can temporarily supply electricity but in the end, it could also mean the end of life on earth if we neglect to shut them down before we collapse or immediately after collapse.
It's too risky but it won't annihilate life on Earth.
Undemocratic and antithetical to a decentralized. post-empire human society.
Fusion or the use of Thorium is our only hope of maintaining a technological based lifestyle, otherwise back to hunter gatherer.
Dangerous but neccessary
In the middle. Better than fossil fuels, but inferior to renewables. As renewable use increases, nuclear use should decrease.
Inefficient and takes too long to build.
Is risky but if properly regulated and controlled by the public (not for profit corp.) it could be viable.
I dangerous and will eventually fail. But will not anihilate life on earth.
Dangerous but manageable, just not by human halfwits. Unsustainable
Answer C but probably won't annihilate all life just make us miserable and cancerous. 
Dark matter, Zero point
Dangerous at the scale which would make a difference to GHG emissions and, at that scale, would have insufficient resources anyway.
Dangerous and should be gradually scaled back and phased out
Is risky and will eventually fail because of human greed and carelessness, leading to uninhabitable areas on the planet.
Should be explored with great caution
c, but come on, not all life. 
Is dangerous, will eventually fail, and lead to highly radioactive areas on Earth's surface that will remain radioactive for a long time, but life will continue on other parts of Earth
Locally Risky but may not lead to global annihilation
Dangerous but will not lead to total annihilation of life on Earth
Dangerous but not as bad as the C option.
Option C without the annihilation of life
Too expensive, too harsh on the environment, and impossible to scale to needs
dangerious and will eventually fail
Is dangerous, and will eventually fail, leading to the the impairment of live on Planet Earth.
is dangerous and will eventurally cuase major problems, local to the plant and perhaps for larger sections of said country.
Unnecessary, dangerous and violent in its current format, using uranium and plutonium. The only reason we use U235 is because of the value of isotopes in medical imaging, and its value for 'dirty bombs' and contaminated bullets for 'war'. Thorium is a better choice for reactors, as it's readily available all over the Earth's surface, and the reaction stops if the power is cut (whereas Uranium/Plutonium goes rogue when power is cut, the reaction dysregulates, and Kaboom!)
Safe with molten salt thorium reactors.
Dangerous, will severely damage areas, realistically on the evidence will not lead to annihilation of life on planet earth.
Is dangerous and will fail but will not annihilate all life
is very dangerous, but will be necessary on a limited scale & for a finite period if the object is to transition to some form of recognisable "civilisation."
too dangerous for long-term use, and should be gradually phased out
Useful as installed but not a long term solution problems with waste
Dangerous and unable to be made safe
Modified "C"; is dangerous and will eventually fail, leading to large areas of radioactive contamination.
Isn't too risky but yet another extension of fossil fuels that will kick the can down the road and become unmaintainable
Safe but impossible to sustain without massive subsidy
Is dangerous and will eventually fail, leading to exclusion zones for humans
wont kill all life on earth but it'll make large parts of the earth a no-go zone for tens of thousands of years and cause immense damage.
close to C, it's a fundamentally flawed equation. it necessarily involves huge expenditures of a technological advanced nature, exactly at the time when it has stopped producing any output, and for centuries down the line. it is impossible to save that wealth and sophistication out of the profits of a running nuke site, so that its aftereffects can be properly taken care of. thus, all nuke sites will become horrendous no-go zones for thousands of years to come and nobody will have the means to cope with it. it won't kill all live on earth but it will make the period from about 50 years in the future on to a couple tens of thousands of years, a tricky time in history to try to stay alive, even without the rest of the collapse to deal with.
C  but not all life will die off
No place to put the never ending waste.
Will fail, but not destroy the earth.
Is risky and needs a high-energy industrial infrastructure which will not be available in the future.
I don't know enough to have an opinion
Is a better option than fossil fuels, but not by much.
Not quite C, dangerous, but I do not believe it will succeed in annihilation of life on Earth.
A technology which depends on FF for its existence, so will not offer any kind of long term 'solution' and it is potentially dangerous. 
Always disappoints - advertised as too cheap to meter, but even integrated molten salt reactor using thorium hasn't yet proved commercial.
between B and C
Will not work in long term, will NOT destroy planet
Dangerous and will eventually fail, causing permanent toxic environmental changes, but not complete annihilation of life on Earth
undesirable but will inevitably be used regardless
Just not worth the risk
Thorium, Molten Salt Reactors NOW!!!!!!
can be safe and should be developed
Development of Thorium reactors.
It's dangerous and will eventually fail but the "anihilation" effects will be limited to certain regions of the planet, and even there, if it happens to be in one of the climatically favorable parts of the planet, human beings will continue to live. The surviving populations will be those that rush to have children very early (mothers in their mid-teens) so that they can propagate before they die an ugly, painful death in their late teens and twenties.      In other parts of the planet, background radiation will go up significantly, but not to any more than an airplane employee (pilot, steward) receives today. A lot of exaggerated hype about the global impact of the (inevitable, imminent) nuclear disaster.
Somewhere between B and C. Will we learn how to safely dispose of waste before we lose the ability to do it? Probably not.
Something between B and C
Dangerous and not an op
Is dangerous and will be phased out
Dangerous and should not be pursued
Is a waste of time and resources
Undesirable but will end up being used anyway
Is safe as long as business as usual continues but will eventually be shut down and  managing radioactive will present a serious but manageable problem for generations to come.
is risky and will fail, but will not anihiliate life on earth
Is dangerous and will eventually fail


RE
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Offline RE

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #37 on: January 06, 2019, 02:56:01 PM »
But stop shitting on me. I don't like it, and I won't put up with it.

I'm not "shitting on you".  I'm shitting on the class of people of which you are a member.

I will however refrain from using specific examples which directly apply to you.  I could have easily changed those locations and activities to other ones, but I thought you could take this in the spirit I used it, which was to get you to realize the cost of your lifestyle.  Instead, you get all mad at me for pointing out stuff which is obviously true and verifiable.

RE
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Offline Surly1

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #38 on: January 06, 2019, 03:08:35 PM »

It means something, this level of educational attainment. It just means something entirely different than whether someone is "dumb" or "smart". It's only tangentially related to that.

What it does mean is that people with Dr. in front of their names are capable of sustained focus, and were willing to hang in with the educational system (which largely does suck) in order to get some kind of credential. It means they are people who can work a plan to completion.

That was great Eddie.
I think you hit the nail on the head. Long before Law School I started building a house in Tahoe on the weekends. Soon after starting I KNEW I was in way over my head (I had done construction as a teenager). BUT I convinced myself I could do it if I just did one thing at a time and then moved on to the next...I think I have met more dumb lawyers than anyone (also some pretty evil ones too). So, I don't take credentials to mean intelligence (or only a certain amount of focused intelligence) just persistence toward a goal.
AJ

I could not agree more. Both  correct. The conference of certificates and degrees means exactly what Eddie says it does: the recipient possesses the persistence and means to follow a course of study to its conclusion. As we have discussed in this pissoir many times, credentialism is just another conduit scheme. Nearly every area of employment demands credentials, administered by gatekeepers, a layer of vultures and parasites well positioned to suck a living from others.

I am still engaged in the world of work as I have for the last 50 years. These trends have been in evidence ever since my cousin (we were booed tackles in college) managed to graduate and become a classroom teacher. He has as much business in a classroom as I did in an operating room. These trends have continued and metasticized. For proof, turn on the TV for an hour, and count the number of ads from "for profit" colleges directly marketing credential meal tickets to a new generation of otherwise-unemployables.

I'm home for a month recovering from hip surgery and watch a good amount of TV, and the torrent of ads are inescapable. And since these kids have neither money nor a pot to piss in, they have to borrow this boodle with loan programs underwritten by We Da Peepul. So after they enter the world of work, they carry a yoke of debt to keep them in line.

It's a wonderful little hamster-wheel.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline RE

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #39 on: January 06, 2019, 03:32:36 PM »

I could not agree more. Both  correct. The conference of certificates and degrees means exactly what Eddie says it does: the recipient possesses the persistence and means to follow a course of study to its conclusion. As we have discussed in this pissoir many times, credentialism is just another conduit scheme. Nearly every area of employment demands credentials, administered by gatekeepers, a layer of vultures and parasites well positioned to suck a living from others.

Credentialism is EVERYWHERE in Industrial Society.  I have earned more "credentials" than I care to count, but here's a few of them:

Expert Rifle from the NRA
Expert Archer from the US Archery Association
Life Scout from the Boy Scouts
Lifeguard Certification from the Red Cross
WSI from the Red Cross
SCUBA Certification from the National Association of Divers
First Aid & CPR from the Red Cross
Driver's License from the DMV
Motorcycle License from the DMV
CDL from the DMV
Elite Gymnastics Coach from the USGA
Clinical Medical Technologis & Supervisor's License form NYS
Teaching Certifications from NYS in 4 Disciplines, Biology, Chemistry, Physics & Mathematics

Lord only knows how many years I spent in getting all those tickets and doing periodic retraining to keep them active.  That took a lot of "stick to it-ness".  Then there is the last decade I spent writing about 10 Dissertations on the subjects of Collapse, with endless hours of research and dedication to that.  I'm as much a "Dr." as anybody else is in terms of the credential time I have spent to learn all this stuff.

RE
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Offline Surly1

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #40 on: January 06, 2019, 03:32:50 PM »
But stop shitting on me. I don't like it, and I won't put up with it.

I'm not "shitting on you".  I'm shitting on the class of people of which you are a member.

I will however refrain from using specific examples which directly apply to you.  I could have easily changed those locations and activities to other ones, but I thought you could take this in the spirit I used it, which was to get you to realize the cost of your lifestyle.  Instead, you get all mad at me for pointing out stuff which is obviously true and verifiable.

RE

RE, you could also give this shit a rest.

Each one of us thinks we are right: that every decision we make is as right and inevitable as if it were written by the Finger of God on the Akashic Records. And if you are trying to convince another person of anything, the absolute worst way to begin is to say, "You're wrong."

There are any number of ways to convince or to engage. And I should maybe try taking my own advice.

Of course, if your purpose is to be argumentative (not a stretch for a self-admitted troll), you don't do that. If you throw a punch, don't be surprised if you get jacked back.

I think your effort on the survey was well done, and the amount of support you got from other bloggers and from the 500+ respondents is exemplary. Some of the questions could have been designed better, sure. In fact, as I recall, you got lit up by some of the anecdotal on the "gender" question. For which I was just fucking baffled.

Count your successes and feel good about your accomplishment, secure in the knowledge that you now have material for the writing mill that will last you well into the future.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline K-Dog

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #41 on: January 06, 2019, 03:34:56 PM »
For the most part in my Guesstimation, these are the upper middle class and moderately rich people who take several vacations every year to Snorkel in places like the Virgin Islands and to Ski the Deep Powder in the Rockies.  These people are now starting to burn some serious amounts of Jet Fuel.

And maybe trips to visit a sick friend? Does that count, comrade? Piss on you, motherfucker.

Just doing a little needling. lol.

Yea, the trips to visit sick friends count.  Especially if you get a vacation Whale Watching and Hiking the Glaciers out of it.

Quote
I don't remember my answer. I think I only flew 4 times in 2018, but if I'm involved in a longer course of training, or in doomer education (and I have flown several times just for that), sometimes it's much more, maybe 10 trips.

I flew once in 2018 I think.  My Tombstone Adventure.  The only time I flew more often than 1-2 times/year was in the early years after the divorce when my hated father was living in other countries and I got flown to visit with him.  Once I flew on a 747 that was virtually empty.  Qantas Airlines in the 70s, not a real well run airline at the time.

Quote
WTF cares, the VAST majority of flights are by salesmen and business people.

Definitely not true of flights from Anchorage to Honolulu.  That is all tourists.  Definitely true that it's all "bizness" on flights from Anchorage to the Slope though.  That's all Oil workers.  Nobody goes to Barrow for a vacation.

However, the bizness flights count for the same upper middle class to rich people.  You don't get flown around for your job as a carpenter, although you might take a flight for a training workshop every couple of years or so.  You have to be making  a lot of money to fly around for your job, whether it is you or the company you work for directly foots the bill.

Quote
Your class envy is showing again.

You're framing the argument again with your own opinion.  It's not "class envy".  It's maldistribution of wealth, which ends with one class of people burning copious quantities of fossil fuels while the other class burns far less.  Poor people just don't burn as much FF as rich people do, they don't have the money to burn.

RE

Now here is the thing about that.



If you don't burn your share of jet fuel some rich asshole is going to do it for you.

Imagine this, a cartoon.  Something like Family Guy.  Lets give our cartoon character a beard, skinny in a vest and blue jeans.  A save the world type but lets not insult him by calling him an SJW.  This characature has been around since the late fifties and has hardly changed.  Austin may be a good place to see one to this day.  Most being smarter than this example.



Our dude drives a gray Subarou in pretty good shape.  The back is covered in bumper stickers.



Remembering this is a cartoon and any semblance to real life is coincidental. 

Our dude is driving his cartoon Subarou on the freeway.  Fog lies ahead.  It thickens but in the gloom our dude sees a sign ahead.  "Save The World".  An arrow points to the right and an off-ramp lies beyond.  Our hero takes the exit wondering why he had never noticed it before.  It seems normal enough, a highway bridge crosses the freeway at the top.  At the end of the off-ramp our hero stops for a stop sign.  Below the stop sign on the same pole there is a right turn arrow.  Or hero takes the right.



The road becomes one way and merges onto a giant loop from which there is no exit.  A loop so large it seems like a regular one way road.  Gas stations and motels.  Bates types of motels where phones don't work and greasy spoon cafes where waitresses know nothing.  It takes more than a tank of gas to get around the loop and sometimes the gas stations are different in what looks to be the same spot a second time around.  But our hero won't notice as he won't notice getting old or wonder why his credit card always works.  For now our hero knows none of this.  He's merged into traffic.  Our hero follows a bumper sticker covered Volvo.



A rainbow colored school bus follows him.  It is a busy road and traffic flows at a nice world saving twenty-five miles an hour.  Our hero thinks of lunch. 

There is a place along this road at a curve on the top of a hill where for a brief second every time around the outside world can sometimes be glimpsed.  Usually an odd fog prevents the view.  In the distance the freeway of the real world can be seen and on this freeway there is no magic.  Everywhere gas is guzzled at seventy miles an hour and nothing is saved.  It is a road unlike the one on which our traveler journeys on.  It's a road devoid of magical thinking.  It is a road devoid of thinking.

If our dude ever sees this road will he ever question why he turned right?  Perhaps the fog can't quite clear.  Some of it could remain behind the eyes.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2019, 03:52:18 PM by K-Dog »
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Offline Eddie

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #42 on: January 06, 2019, 03:52:42 PM »
For the most part in my Guesstimation, these are the upper middle class and moderately rich people who take several vacations every year to Snorkel in places like the Virgin Islands and to Ski the Deep Powder in the Rockies.  These people are now starting to burn some serious amounts of Jet Fuel.

And maybe trips to visit a sick friend? Does that count, comrade? Piss on you, motherfucker.

Just doing a little needling. lol.

Yea, the trips to visit sick friends count.  Especially if you get a vacation Whale Watching and Hiking the Glaciers out of it.

Quote
I don't remember my answer. I think I only flew 4 times in 2018, but if I'm involved in a longer course of training, or in doomer education (and I have flown several times just for that), sometimes it's much more, maybe 10 trips.

I flew once in 2018 I think.  My Tombstone Adventure.  The only time I flew more often than 1-2 times/year was in the early years after the divorce when my hated father was living in other countries and I got flown to visit with him.  Once I flew on a 747 that was virtually empty.  Qantas Airlines in the 70s, not a real well run airline at the time.

Quote
WTF cares, the VAST majority of flights are by salesmen and business people.

Definitely not true of flights from Anchorage to Honolulu.  That is all tourists.  Definitely true that it's all "bizness" on flights from Anchorage to the Slope though.  That's all Oil workers.  Nobody goes to Barrow for a vacation.

However, the bizness flights count for the same upper middle class to rich people.  You don't get flown around for your job as a carpenter, although you might take a flight for a training workshop every couple of years or so.  You have to be making  a lot of money to fly around for your job, whether it is you or the company you work for directly foots the bill.

Quote
Your class envy is showing again.

You're framing the argument again with your own opinion.  It's not "class envy".  It's maldistribution of wealth, which ends with one class of people burning copious quantities of fossil fuels while the other class burns far less.  Poor people just don't burn as much FF as rich people do, they don't have the money to burn.

RE

Now here is the thing about that.



If you don't burn your share of jet fuel some rich asshole is going to do it for you.

Imagine this, a cartoon.  Something like Family Guy.  Lets give our cartoon character a beard, skinny in a vest and blue jeans.  A save the world type but lets not insult him by calling him an SJW.  This characature has been around since the late fifties and has hardly changed.  Austin may be a good place to see one to this day.  Most being smarter than this example.



Our dude drives a gray Subarou in pretty good shape.  The back is covered in bumper stickers.



Remembering this is a cartoon and any semblance to real life is coincidental. 

Our dude is driving his cartoon Subarou on the freeway.  Fog lies ahead.  It thickens but in the gloom our dude sees a sign ahead.  "Save The World".  An arrow points to the right and an off-ramp lies beyond.  Our hero takes the exit wondering why he had never noticed it before.  It seems normal enough, a highway bridge crosses the freeway at the top.  At the end of the off-ramp our hero stops for a stop sign.  Below the stop sign on the same pole there is a right turn arrow.  Or hero takes the right.



The road becomes one way and merges onto a giant loop from which there is no exit.  A loop so large it seems like a regular one way road.  Gas stations and motels.  Bates types of motels where phones don't work and greasy spoon cafes where the waitresses know nothing.  It takes more than a tank of gas to get around this loop and sometimes the gas stations are different in what looks to be the same spot a second time around.  But our hero won't notice as he won't notice getting old or wonder why his credit card always works.  For now our hero knows none of this.  He merges into the traffic.  Our hero follows a bumper sticker covered Volvo.



A rainbow colored school bus follows.  It is a busy road and the traffic flows at a nice world saving thirty miles an hour.  Our hero thinks of lunch. 

There is a place along this road on top of a hill where for a second every time around the outside world can sometimes be glimpsed.  Usually an odd fog prevents it.  In the distance the real world freeway can be seen and on this freeway there is no magic.  Everywhere gas is guzzled at seventy miles an hour and nothing is saved.  It is a road unlike the one on which our traveler journeys.  A road devoid of magical thinking.

Yet our dude never questions why he turned right.

Sorry, I lost you at the beautiful shoes.

Your analogy, obviously meant to point out my personal blind spot, doesn't piss me off as much as RE's blathering on, but then, I don't really know you. And conversely, you don't know me.

The world, as we know it, is about to end. I am not anything at all like Imelda Marcos, and I hate bumper stickers.

Alfred E. Neuman is passing into obscurity as we move into our brave new world.

Do what you gotta do and be who you wanna be. I'm alright. You don't need to worry about me.....unless you fuck with me.
« Last Edit: January 06, 2019, 04:10:02 PM by Eddie »
What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

Offline RE

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #43 on: January 06, 2019, 05:26:17 PM »
Your analogy, obviously meant to point out my personal blind spot, doesn't piss me off as much as RE's blathering on

I'm not "blathering".  I'm writing cogent analysis.

RE
Save As Many As You Can

Offline RE

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Re: 🗳️ 2019 Collapse Political Survey
« Reply #44 on: January 06, 2019, 06:54:02 PM »

         Don't you wish you were the Navigator on that first Cat-Rigged Sailing Canoe that made it to the Big Island of Hawaii when it was still pristine and unspoiled?  When I shut the eyes of my crippled body, that is where I am, on the deck of that boat with Mauna Loa off in the distance.


I wish I were at the helm of a well-found modern sailboat, with all the modern tech, set up for long distance cruising. In my view it would be even better than what you described. One really ironic thing is that in most places, most of the time, right now, in this current time we live in, the ocean is just as beautiful as it was way back then.

Well, given all the plastic debris floating around the Ocean these days, I'm not sure it is quite as beautiful as it once was.  Besides that, there's just about nowhere that's really pristine and unspoiled to make landfall like Hawaii was in ~1000AD.  Even Ocean Falls has a Hydro Plant built on it.  They also did a lot of logging of the neighborhood until they were forced to close the Paper Plant due to Asbestos contamination.  The plant and the asbestos are probably still there though.

Far as your sailboat having all the latest in electronic gizmos, winches and ultralight polymer sails, I do agree it's certainly nicer to sail with all the creature comforts and the assistance of modern technology.  But you pay a price for that in terms of resilience.  If their boat broke down, they could fix just about everything even while at sea, and once making landfall could craft new parts from local materials.  You can't do that with a modern sailboat.

If you were alive back then, you wouldn't miss all that cool technology, because it hadn't been invented and never existed.  To you, the technology of your boat would be the best there was.  In my dreams, I like the simplicity of all that and its sustainability for 1000s of years through all the migrations.  I'm sure it wouldn't be very comfortable for a modern Industrial era Homo Sap, and they certainly wouldn't take a cripple along for the ride. lol.  But in my dreams I'm not a cripple anymore.  I'm the 25 year old I once was, doing giant swings on the high bar and double backs on the trampoline.

RE
Save As Many As You Can

 

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