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Offline RE

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Re: Zombie Rehab
« Reply #15 on: June 11, 2013, 03:47:50 PM »
The Great Zombie Rehab Debate between LD and AB now moved to the Doomsteading Board from Behind the Curtain.

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Offline agelbert

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Re: Zombie Rehab
« Reply #16 on: June 11, 2013, 08:10:18 PM »
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For my money, sitting here in the cheap seats, that was one remarkable post. Well crafted, nuanced, striking where necessary. A tip o' the Crown of Thorns to you, sir.



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Are you aware that the Libertarians have their own definition for a zombie that is QUITE mainstream right now among Republican circles as well? ANYBODY that works in a bureaucracy (i.e. GOVERNMENT JOB) is a zombie to them. If you don't own your own business or work in private enterprise, you are a dead beat zombie useless eater sponging off all those "job creator" predators out there that do "so much" to "help" the US economy.

If I had a nickel for every time I heard that HORSESHIT from IDIOTS that have never been sweating bullets controlling air traffic, I would be rich. 

So yeah, the word "ZOMBIE" is a button pusher for me because of its propagandist use to demonize millions of town, county, state and federal employees.

It is a gross generalization put out there for the SOLE PURPOSE of trashing the commons, destroying good government (what's left of it), and funneling MORE profit into predatory capitalist pockets.

The incredible IRONY of this SHIT is that the predatory capitalists on Wall Street and Madison Avenue are the MAIN DRIVERS of the matrix, NOT the federal government!  Yeah, they have turned the governemnt into their lakey but I DESPISE the flipping of the order of EVIL here to label the GOVERNMENT (a mere TOOL that can be use for good or bad) as the bad guy when the predatory capitalists are BY DEFINITION, the bad guys. And the predatory bastards are the ones pushing the ZOMBIE label 24/7.

Frankly, the term is deliberately derogatory, cardboard and two dimentional. It's a name calling propaganda exercise. For that reason alone, I don't think it adequately defines the populace who are victimized, willingly or unwillingly, by the matrix.



This goes right to the heart of the "zombie" meme and the reason for the vigor with which the media/entertainmen t complex pushes it. ("World War Z" coming soon to a multiplex near you!)

I could never quite put my finger on what I found so troubling about that.

You nailed it..

As Eliot said of Pound in his dedication of The Waste Land, "il miglior fabbro."

Thank you, sir.  :icon_sunny:

Here's the follow up rant  :icon_mrgreen::

The matrix is, ABOVE ALL, a well oiled propaganda machine that SPECIALIZES in taking concepts that appeal to the average MAM (military aged male) and using said concepts or memes to neutralize any threat those MAMs could present to the matrix. This is achieved by flipping the concepts on their heads in EXPERT, CLEVER and APPEALING Orwellian fashion.

This accomplishes the vital divide and conquer function of the matrix by making sure that the MAMs TARGET fellow MAMs for their perceived woes and not the matrix controllers (the PARASITES at the top).  :evil4: :evil6:

That's silly, you say. They'd never get away with that. Everybody would see through it. You scoff!  :icon_scratch:

Let's take the term "ALPHA MALE" as a prime example of successful MINDFUCK MATRIX ORWELLIAN PROPAGANDA.

The REASON you think of a CEO, Hedge Fund Billionaire or Wall Street Broker/Banker when that term is brought up is because of a successful Orwellian propaganda campaign. The human version of the ALPHA MALE is a "job creator" (he is the reverse) and provides leadership for his corporation (no he doesn't - he strips it bare and moves on). :P

Based on the above two falsehoods, the premise proceeds logically to RHIP. The ALPHA MALE DESERVES more than the rest of us because we OWE him for all the WORK he does. He doesn't have to concern himself with the losers out there without jobs or in need of welfare because he does SO MUCH to keep the PRODUCTIVITY of the economy at a high level. He is VICTIMIZED by a governmental ZOMBIE tax structure where a bunch of UNPRODUCTIVE people work  who don't deserve their "cushy" jobs. We need LESS GOVERNMENT so we will all have MORE FREEDOM from the matrix! :evil4: :evil6:

Implied in all the above propaganda you will find these corollaries:

1) People who chose lower pay for job security are not ALPHA MALES.

2) People who have bleeding heart concepts about feeding zombies and other useless eaters are not ALPHA MALES.

3) People who don't cherish FREEDOM are not ALPHA MALES.

4) People who are not ALPHA MALES are losers.   

5) ALPHA MALES need not concern themselves with losers.

6) ALPHA MALE behavior is worthy of praise.

7) ALPHA MALES, like the wolves in nature, preserve the strength of the Homo sapiens pack

8 )Zombies are PARASITES on society. Unlike the ALPHA MALES who are jungle survivors in the true Darwinian sense, these PARASITES feed a fascist police state matrix by not questioning authority or bucking the system for the good of predatory capitalism (I mean human society, of course  :evil4:).

9) PARASITES (Zombies) are evolutionary dead ends. The sooner they die off, the better. 

10) If you are getting shafted by the government or a corporation, it's your own fault because you are a PARASITE ZOMBIE that doesn't deserve FREEDOM and RESPECT and INDEPENDENT, CONSCIENSE FREE BEHAVIOR like the ALPHA MALE.

NOTE: All the above propaganda corollaries apply to so-called ALPHA FEMALES too. :evil4:


Now lets take a look at ALPHA MALES AND FEMALES in an ACTUAL WOLF PACK:

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A typical wolf pack will contain a number of individuals that specialize in certain areas, such as pup rearing and hunting.

The specialist hunters are usually female; this is because they are roughly 25 per cent smaller than the males, meaning that they are much faster and agile than the bulkier males.

There are often a couple of wolves within the pack that are capable of sprinting like a greyhound, reaching speeds fast enough to either catch or force their prey into an ambush.

Usually, the hunter will not be the alpha or breeding female, as the risk of injury for a hunter is high, and the alpha is far too valuable to the survival of the pack. She will, however, keep a close eye on proceedings from the sidelines and ensure that the lower ranked wolves remain disciplined during the hunt. This is often a very difficult, so she will often initiate practice sessions before a hunt to drill the discipline home.

Nowadays, the term alpha when used in wolf circles is a misnomer, as it often implies dominance. The alpha wolves in a pack do not dominate other individuals in any sort of coercive sense. Instead, they simply enjoy the greatest amount of social freedom in the pack, by never having to submit to anyone and of course enjoying the privilege of being the only two individuals permitted to breed.

http://jkenny.hubpages.com/hub/Wolves-Hunting-Behaviour

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Occasionally a wolf will opt to hunt alone, but is usually far more cautious and rarely hunts anything bigger than a rabbit. Usually they will catch creatures such as rodents and birds, and occasionally will compete with bears for fish during the salmon season.

http://jkenny.hubpages.com/hub/Wolves-Hunting-Behaviour

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The pack leader isn't necessarily the alpha male [source: Busch]. The alpha female takes the reins in certain groups since wolf rankings are based on strength and the ability to win fights, not gender.

http://animal.discovery.com/mammals/wolf-pack-mentality.htm

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Life span
In the wild wolves generally live until they are 6- 8 yeas old. In captivity, they can live until they are 16 because they are better feed and do not suffer the hardship that wolves in the wild do,
[such as death by parasites or injuries.

http://www.timberwolfps.org/wolf-facts.html

Are you getting COGNITIVE DISSONACE YET? Why not? ???


Does this LOOK LIKE AN ALPHA MALE TO YOU?


In NATURE, the only ACTUAL equivalent organism that lives in a wolf pack that can compare with a MATRIX MOVER AND SHAKER from Wall Street is a TICK (i.e. a wolf PARASITE).


Why? Because the wolf earns his keep 24/7. He ALWAYS works for the good of the pack. The ALPHA MALE or FEMALE have a higher probability of injury from fights than the rest of them in return for breeding freedom.

The right to breed does not translate into the "right" to make thousands of times the pay of the average worker and avoid paying taxes. It's a clever distortion of the extremely limited freedom that the ALPHA wolves have along with being subjected EQUALLY to PARASITES and even more than the others to FIGHT and possibly HUNTING injuries.

If enough PARASITES (like TICKS) cover a dog, they can kill it. They anesthetize the wound where they suck blood so the dog doesn't realize its danger. When the dog dies, the TICKS just move on to find another host. I'm sure wolves get the same treatment.

Gee, those TICKS don't seem to love freedom, independent thought or bucking the system all that much, DO THEY? Those TICKS act a LOT like CEOs and other blood suckers on Wall Street, DON'T THEY? And ""productivity" is a cruel joke for a TICK, is it not?

In fact, the human version of the "wolf" that is weak and dying from lost blood is not helped at all by the Wall Street TICKS. They call these weak "wolves" evolutionary dead ends and useless eaters.

When they can't get another drop of blood out of them, they might even call them ZOMBIES!


Does this look like a ZOMBIE to you ? ???

These ZOMBIES are  good for nothing but to be discarded in the trash, well deserving of their deaths for not being "stronger" and "competitive" like we PRODUCTIVE, JOB CREATING, FREEDOM LOVING, GOVERNMENT HATING TICKS. :whip: DEATH to the PARASITES!  ;) (and let's always remember to not look in the mirror  :evil4:). 



Is this a PARASITE or a VICTIM? ???

So, we end up with a MATRIX powered by Wall Street PARASITES  who label the PRODUCTIVE members of the pack (which includes the actual APHA MALES and FEMALES and all the other human versions of the wolf pack) that keep the economy moving despite the constant encroaching hindrance of the Wall Street PARASITES, as "PARASITIC ZOMBIES".

The authors of the police state matrix FOMENT DISDAIN and DERISION for the EMPLOYED or RETIRED members of the economy (people who BENEFITED the economy by VOLUNTARILY CHOOSING, at the start of their careers, to make less money in return for more security), among the main victims of free enterprise predatory capitalist, TICK blood sucking, many millions of which are now unemployed, struggling and on food stamps.

The authors of the police state matrix say, "We CAN"T have those unemployed or struggling to survive thinking that we Wall Street PARASITES caused their woes.

It's time to grab an opportunity out of this crisis. It's time for MORE divide and conquer. WHO has security? WHO can join with those struggling to in a united front to create "difficulties" for Wall Street and our beloved MATRIX? Why, it's GOVERNMENT and RETIRED WORKERS!  :evil4:

We PARASITES haven't been able to destroy job security in government jobs so let's just DEMONIZE the FUCK out of them by calling them ZOMBIES and PARASITES. Also, let's MAKE SURE to give RETIREES a 24/7 "guilt trip" for "milking the government" and call their pensions  by that nice divide and conquer, envy producing term of "ENTITLEMENTS" instead of EARNED BENEFITS THAT ARE OWED TO THEM. That way we can keep our blood sucking going while the "wolf pack" (the suckers) fight amongst themselves." :evil6: :evil7:

They say, "We Wall Street PARASITIC TICKS will laugh all the way to the bank and make sure that anyone that figures out our GIANT MATRIX CON is labeled a conspiracy theorist, anti-American, anti-Free Enterprise, anti-FREEDOM, socialist, pinko commie, ZOMBIE defender, coward, etc. :evil4: :evil6:

As long as anyone with a secure job as an employee is demonized as a zombie and or a parasite, the real parasites are accelerating us towards OUR and THEIR self destruction.  :(  :emthdown:

Blaming the victim is not only inaccurate, it serves the purposes of the MATRIX by keeping the heat of the REAL PARASITES. Do your part. Blame the guilty, not the innocent.
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
Faith,
if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

Offline RE

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Zombie Rehab: The Black Armband
« Reply #17 on: June 12, 2013, 01:16:29 AM »
OK, I am going to drop in here with a few thoughts.  Sadly, I simply do not have time to go point by point in either LDs or ABs posting to say what I think is right or wrong about it.

The main thing here is I think 2 ideas are being conflated here, the "Zombie" idea and the "Parasite" or "Leechfuck" idea.

Zombies are not RESPONSIBLE for the problems we face, they are VICTIMS, just as those of us who are Non-Zombies are Victims.  I don't BLAME Zombies, I feel sorry for them.

Nevertheless, some folks are so far gone, despite the fact it is not their fault really, THEY CANNOT BE SAVED.  Where are you going to make your effort, with those who still have a CHANCE, or those who are so Brainwashed by the Hologram nothing you say will ever even make a DENT in what they think?

It is Triage, the World is a MASH Unit now, and there are a very few people with a Green Armband on who still might be saved, but MOST people already wear the Black Armband of DEATH.  Expending effort and resources to save these people is a waste of time and resources, and even beyond that, in the Full Collapse Scenario these folks present a DANGER to you.  When they can't get hold of Goobermint Cheese, they won't go looking for Wild Edible Plants, they'll go shopping in your Garden first, then go Shopping in your store of Preps, then they'll EAT YOU if you are not ready for that eventuality with enough NUMBERS to turn them away and Protect & Defend yourself and your Loved Ones.

We all write here on the Diner, and this material is for the most part available to anyone in an industrialized culture who owns an Iphone to read.  The opportunity is out there to educate yourself, YOU all found the Diner, now didn't you?  I in turn found the Peak Oil Message Board, found Antal Fekete, found Carroll Quigley, found Gibbon's Rise & Fall of the Roman Empire....man it is all OUT there to read if you look for it a bit.  I am going to continue to waste my time with people who will not READ, will not LISTEN, will not THINK?  I am sorry, no I will not, they are too far gone, they wear the Black Armband now.  I triage them off.  I hope they die a relatively painless death.  I expend my energy to SAVE AS MANY AS I CAN.  I CANNOT SAVE THEM ALL.

My emotions, my hopes and dreams for the survival of Homo Sapiens do not reside with the Zombies out there, or the Parasites and Leechfucks that run Corporate Amerika either.  They are dead people.  I SEE DEAD PEOPLE.


I harbor my resources, I don't invest in the Black Armbands.  I invest in DINERS.

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Offline Surly1

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Re: Zombie Rehab
« Reply #18 on: June 12, 2013, 02:55:23 AM »
PLEASE tell me you are going to adapt these two posts into a blog post.

Supurb analysys, and parentheetically sheds light on why people pay Frank Luntz big $$$ to test language and "frame" issues.

Get to writing, AG.

 ;D ;D
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline RE

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Re: Zombie Rehab
« Reply #19 on: June 12, 2013, 03:06:43 AM »
PLEASE tell me you are going to adapt these two posts into a blog post.

Supurb analysys, and parentheetically sheds light on why people pay Frank Luntz big $$$ to test language and "frame" issues.

Get to writing, AG.

 ;D ;D

Which 2?  There's a bevy of entertaining and informative posting here in the thread thus far.

I split it off so that the totality of the ideas would be consolidated, because it is a very good thread concept overall.  So yea, my plan is/was to fashion it into a Blog Post, but since YOU mentioned the idea, and YOU are an ADMIN, now this is YOUR job.  LOL.

Consider this a lesson on when it is a good idea to keep your mouth shut.  LOL.

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Offline Surly1

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Re: Zombie Rehab
« Reply #20 on: June 12, 2013, 03:22:04 AM »
PLEASE tell me you are going to adapt these two posts into a blog post.

Supurb analysys, and parentheetically sheds light on why people pay Frank Luntz big $$$ to test language and "frame" issues.

Get to writing, AG.

 ;D ;D

Which 2?  There's a bevy of entertaining and informative posting here in the thread thus far.

I split it off so that the totality of the ideas would be consolidated, because it is a very good thread concept overall.  So yea, my plan is/was to fashion it into a Blog Post, but since YOU mentioned the idea, and YOU are an ADMIN, now this is YOUR job.  LOL.

Consider this a lesson on when it is a good idea to keep your mouth shut.  LOL.

RE

I think not.

Am happy to excerpt, find images and Dinerize, of course, but AG is far too cogent a writer for me to put words in his mouth for attribution. Best done by him, IMO.

Let's hear from him.

This whole "zombie" thread started by LD has occasioned much useful discussion.

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The world is full of two kinds of people:
Those who divide the world into two kinds of people, and those who don't.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline RE

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Re: Zombie Rehab
« Reply #21 on: June 12, 2013, 03:34:40 AM »

I think not.

Am happy to excerpt, find images and Dinerize, of course, but AG is far too cogent a writer for me to put words in his mouth for attribution. Best done by him, IMO.


Hello.  Have you ever read one of my Consolidation Posts of Diner Threads?  I don't "put words in ANYBODY'S Mouth", I just Copy/Paste out of a thread the most well conceived posts that talk to the topic.  I leave out the stupid dickering posts like this one. LOL.  It's NOT ROCKET SCIENCE!  LOL.

Anyhow, I will do this one tomorrow night, and Demonstrate the Technique to you GRASSHOPPER. SNATCH THE PEBBLE FROM MY HAND!


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Offline jdwheeler42

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Re: Zombie Rehab
« Reply #22 on: June 12, 2013, 04:21:57 AM »
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The world is full of two kinds of people:
Those who finish what they start...
Making pigs fly is easy... that is, of course, after you have built the catapult....

Offline RE

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Re: Zombie Rehab
« Reply #23 on: June 12, 2013, 04:41:54 AM »
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The world is full of two kinds of people:
Those who finish what they start...

...AND THOSE WHO START WHAT THEY FINISH?''

How about those who Say What They Believe, and those who Believe What They Say?

Not to mention those who Walk the Walk; those who Talk the Walk,; others who Walk the Talk; some who Talk the Talk and others who are Deaf, Dumb and BLIND?

Then there are those who Reap what they Sow, and others who never planted Jack Shit in their whole lives.

I think there are more than two kinds of people.  ::)

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Offline luciddreams

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Re: Zombie Rehab
« Reply #24 on: June 12, 2013, 06:55:09 AM »
once again I find myself without the time to comment much today.  Gaggle of exams back to back due to it being an abbreviated semester.  Made an 83 on the one I thought I'd fail BTW.

I didn't get a chance to read all of Agelberts last long post, just the intro bit before he got into talking about nature, which I would love to break down.  In fact I've seen several points where I disagree with Agelbert. 

The main point is that zombies aren't a victim of society, they are society.  They're no more a victim than I or anybody else living in this clusterfuck, but their apathy and laziness is largely responsible for this clusterfuck.  That's the point, holding people responsible.  The people have the real power, we have the numbers that compose hordes.  Nobody has the power to stop a big enough horde. 

Anyways...off to micro yet again...maybe I'll skip today :icon_mrgreen:

if you see another post anytime soon from me that's what happened. 

I'd like a chance to respond to Agelbert before the blog goes up to btw...

Offline luciddreams

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Re: GM and LD said
« Reply #25 on: June 12, 2013, 08:16:02 AM »

I read your article and I think it is a thought binary. The negative part of the binary defines a zombie (evolutionary failure) while the positive part defines an evolutionary success.

The evolutionary success or failure argument is weakened by the FACT that you allow for the possibility that zombies can morph into non-zombies. So, you aren't REALLY talking about evolution, as in positive or negative mutations, but ADAPTATION inside the Homo SAP gene pool.

I thought a gene mutation is an adaptation to the gene pool?  Either way I think you're splitting hairs.  Besides I'm speaking more in terms of this is something that's being set up.  I mean those who survive the bottleneck will probably not be zombies...although they could be.  Take the bad ass, drug flingin', gun wieldin' biker gang type...or the gang bangin' type...or prisoners released from prison en mass due to the government subsidies that probably keep them in prison drying up.  Lot's of "alpha males" to fight and some will survive the bottleneck...so maybe that theory of mine doesn't have much merit...although it was mostly just something uttered sort of poetically.  I like the way it sounds at least.  Not something I'm prepared to spend time defending really...so I'll just let you have that one ;D

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The ability to adapt to the imposition of the matrix, by recognizing that it is a system that must fail due to it's thermodynamically impossible goal of infinite growth in a finite biosphere, is limited by some skill, awareness, intelligence or all of them together in sufficent amounts, right?

If you can read then you can figure it out.  Shit, if you can look around you can figure it out.  Hell I can smell it myself :laugh:  It just require you be willing to pull your head out of your ass.

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Somewhere along the road of life, you became aware of the matrix.  :o :P :( With the zeal of a convert, you set out to warn your fellow humans. :stop: :argue:

No, by the time I got around to learning about PO I had largely given up on society giving two shits about the truth.  My zeal was spent trying to convince people that 9/11 was an inside job.  Mike Ruppert handled that one expertly with Crossing the Rubicon.  It's a tome to be sure, but he ties 9/11 and peak oil to each other...if you haven't read it you should, but that's another topic for debate.  My point is that after I realized people weren't willing to objectively look at the facts due to bias and brain programming, and...well...just laziness, I then realized trying to convince them was worse than pissin' on an electric fence.  I mean unless you're a masochist...in which case piss away I guess. 

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as Maslow's hierarchy attests, lack of peer group acceptance is painful.  :( It is, moreover, a powerful force in behavioral modification. :whip: That is, it is a TOOL of the matrix propaganda machine, is it not?  :icon_scratch:  ;)

or just human psychology.

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IOW it may be quite possible that you DID convince your fellows of the insanity and danger of the matrix and, privately fearing ostracism, they pretended NOT to understand the gravity of your warning ("Hey, let's watch the big game - this subject is depressing!"   ;)).

Yes, but I think that's probably the exception to the rule and not the rule. 

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Your reaction, a road I have been down many many times, is anger at their stupidity, willfull ignorance OR cowardice. :angry5:

I'm long past anger brother.  Believe me.  I don't lose any sleep over zombies...I promise. 

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Do you notice I used the word "OR" just now? After all, YOU get it. If THEY don't get it and they aren't mentally retarded, then they are cowards, right?

I mean they can be all kind of things.  They could be just lazy, or to preoccupied with football, or buying and trading toys online!  I mean there are an infinite number of reasons they would decide to cram their head back in the sand.   :icon_scratch:

I think JMG is correct with his advocacy for the use of ternaries.  You see they break those little binaries you are so fond of.   :icon_mrgreen:

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Now this gets complicated because I am going to make the case that you aren't holding them responsible for their behavior; you are holding them responsible for YOUR present and future behavior. 8)

Only person I hold responsible for my behavior is me.  That goes for every other "adult" on planet Earth. 

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Let's rewind your life to the Navy. You get trained in radar electronics instead of nukes. You never see combat and you never go AWOL after 117 days at sea. You do your full hitch and land a nice job in IBM after leaving the service.

Somebody comes up to you that had a hard time in the war and tells you about the matrix. You promise to look into it   :icon_study:  because you respect that guy's opnion and, after some research  :o,  you are able to see the propaganda pattern out there labeling everyone that questions the "approved" historical and present status quo as a conspiracy nut.

You study the numbers and you realize that, not only is there a matrix going on keeping people numb, but the system cannot help but implode. :o 

You start saving money and prepping but you don't tell the dude that alerted you. What you tell him is that there is a good game on TV that you can't miss.  :icon_mrgreen: WHY? Because you UNDERSTAND how the matrix propaganda machine goes all out to RUIN anyone that smells a rat. :evil7:  You don't want to be labelled a conspiracy nut at work because you might lose your job so you just do what you can do on the side to prepare (buy a piece of land, learn permaculture, etc.).

You say you would never go that route.   :emthdown: That's cowardly. :emthdown:  It may not QUITE be zombie behavior but, since said person isn't doing anything to counter the matrix, they are part of the problem, not part of the solution.  :emthdown: :P


So you're saying had I been "successful" after quitting the navy I'd have been more cowardly?  When I got out I could have went to any nuclear power plant...probably in the world after completing NNPTC, Prototype, and then makin' B-Nuke quals on the Vinson, CVN-70, and got a job starting in the six figures.  The USN nuclear pipe line is known throughout the world as some of the best nuke training there is.  I chose not to be "successful" because I realized that that success was a dead end road and I didn't want to go down it.  I had to pay for my soul first, after spending six months in the Arabian Sea droppin' bombs on innocent nomads, red cross centers, hospitals, and Mosques.  Money was the least of my concern after liberating myself from the navy. 

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Well my friend, there are over 450 people in the Doomstead Diner. I wager that over 80% are "keeeping a low profile" about the matrix as a way of avoiding ostracism. Are they zombies?   :icon_scratch:

Not at all.  If you're on the Diner, and you come back to it for at least one more click, than you ain't a Zombie...well I suppose you could be a troll, or bored, or government/corporate agents, or bots, or...shit...here we go again :laugh:

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I studied your zombie research. Are you aware that the Libertarians have their own definition for a zombie that is QUITE mainstream right now among Republican circles as well? ANYBODY that works in a bureaucracy (i.e. GOVERNMENT JOB) is a zombie to them. If you don't own your own business or work in private enterprise, you are a dead beat zombie useless eater sponging off all those "job creator" predators out there that do "so much" to "help" the US economy.

I mean this with all due respect Sir...Fuck politics...don't get me started on politics Agelbert.  My cussometer pegs out at about 9 cuss words for every 10 towards the end of the politics debate.  It's a puppet show...end of story.  Another form of football for a different, more egg head shaped form of idiot.  I tried politics when I campaigned for Ron Paul in 2007.  Just more zombie food IMO :P

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If I had a nickel for everytime I heard that HORSESHIT from IDIOTS that have never been sweating bullets controlling air traffic, I would be rich. 
 

I hear you, I could say the same about almost causing a reactor scram at sea...during war...or a life depending on whether or not you can get this petroleum tube down this 300 pound overweight, Congestive Heart Failure victim's trachea before his face turns even more purple.

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So yeah, the word "ZOMBIE" is a button pusher for me because of its propagandist use to demonize millions of town, county, state and federal employees.

I get it, but those ass holes don't get to define my language for me.  That's called New Speak.  Orwell wrote all about that in 1984.  There's a New Speak Dictionary doncha know :laugh:  As my wiki research demonstrated, the word did not start as propaganda.  Just witchcraft in a culture and time different from our own.  And those Zombies had very real cohorts.  Those thrown from a train after being brutally beaten for refusal to be a slave I imagine. 

We had the same problem with the word Vixen.  You see it as a derogatory word, and I see it as a beautiful one.  I see it as the beauty incarnate in my wife, mother to my children, and lover...as that beauty emanating from each of her pores.  That's Vixen like.  But I make no secret about the fact that I turn into a fox at night  :laugh:

Quote
It is a gross generalization put out there for the SOLE PURPOSE of trashing the commons, destroying good government (what's left of it), and funneling MORE profit into predatory capitalist pockets. :emthdown:

all the more reason to co-opted the co-opted word back from the co-opters in the 1984 copters man O0
Quote
The incredible IRONY of this SHIT is that the predatory capitalists on Wall Street and Madison Avenue are the MAIN DRIVERS of the matrix, NOT the federal government!  Yeah, they have turned the governemnt into their lakey but I DESPISE the flipping of the order of EVIL here to label the GOVERNMENT (a mere TOOL that can be use for good or bad) as the bad guy when the predatory capitalists are BY DEFINITION, the bad guys. And the predatory bastards are the ones pushing the ZOMBIE label 24/7.

The main drivers of the Matrix are the lost souls that allow it to continue to exist.  I'm in line with those lost souls...part of me at least.  The part that has to feed his children no matter what becomes of this world.  I have two be two people.  One...concerned with collapse issues 100% of the time, and Two, playin' this stupid fuckin' game of "can I have some credentials for food" and a position at the Ministry of Health please :'(

Quote
Frankly, the term is deliberately derogatory, cardboard and two dimentional. It's a name calling propaganda exercise. For that reason alone, I don't think it adequately defines the populace who are victimized, willingly or unwillingly, by the matrix.

We are all victims of that evil fuckin' machine Agelbert...even those at the highest levels...the 1% or whatever the fuck you wanna call'em. 

Quote
LD, you are where you are because of certain experiences that WOKE YOU UP. If you hadn't had them you would be quietly living on 50 acres or so right now, making a $100,000 a year or more, and prepping your ass off for when the shit hits the fan while telling all your acquaintances everything is hunky jake (to avoid workplace ostracism or job loss for the sake of your family) and bragging about how your team won last night...

That sounds familiar to you Agelbert.  Am I sensing some regret here perhaps?  The experience that "WOKE ME UP" was when I woke up one day from a mid day siesta...I was 18 at the time...yawning real big, getting up from bed to go eat some cereal, and I get a weird feeling I need to turn around.  So I do so, and what I saw altered my consciousness like the bacteriophage's lytic conversion does to a bacterial cell ;D  What I saw that did that was myself, lying in bed, sound asleep.  When I returned a short while later (and short here is up for interpretation seeing as how your real time  double's time is quite different from your normal interpretation of time) I did not return as the same person. 

Quote
Sure, you wouldn't be acting CRAZY LIKE A FOX.

yes I would be, I are a fox homey...I can't help myself.   :laugh:







So this point by point stuff is getting tiresome Agelbert.  Don't get me wrong...I enjoy it...but it takes time.  Time that is much better spent in conversation in real time, face to face, as people. 

My biggest issue with you is that you're allowing one entity, a political, libertarian one...to be precise, to define what a Zombie is and is not.  Zombies are real, my man, and they ain't welcome at the foxstead.  They will be removed from the premises with all means at our disposal.  I don't have time for knuckleheaded knuckleheads.  I mean I'm a knucklehead from time to time myself, but my guidance system is not.  It's one thing to play around and have a good time, and quit another to just never have a moral direction, or compass...or True North as I think Joseph Campell put it once. 

I'm in it to win it Agelbert.  I'm going to do everything I can to ensure my son's get to spread their genes into the world...hopefully one that's not ravaged by man any longer...but whatever the case may be...my boys will know how to survive in it.  A lot of that battle is done on a mental landscape.  I'm giving them many different lenses to see the world with...a toolkit of lenses. 

But when it comes to Zombies...well I'm the Zombie Whisperer after all  :roll2:

And BTW, this message was brought to you by a 33 year old practicing the long lost art of...hookey.  Why go to college if you're not going to skip class every now and then :icon_sunny:

Offline WHD

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Re: Zombie Rehab
« Reply #26 on: June 12, 2013, 09:32:13 AM »

Quote
So yeah, the word "ZOMBIE" is a button pusher for me because of its propagandist use to demonize millions of town, county, state and federal employees.

It is a gross generalization put out there for the SOLE PURPOSE of trashing the commons, destroying good government (what's left of it), and funneling MORE profit into predatory capitalist pockets.

I personally can't tell the difference between the "zombie" who works for gov or the "zombie" who works for corp. In my experience, the average minion is equally unquestioning of TPTB, more often than not making excuses for gross institutional insanity, so as not to have to question their own service to grossly insane, demonic institution, public or private. What is the difference between big bank charging me $800 in fees on $80 of overdrafts, or city gov charging two weeks pay because I dared to try to honor an ancient white pine, to save it from the fire, some zombie neighbor cut down because he couldn't grow grass underneath it? In fact, I'd say the capitalist fucks and their gov counterparts have created a nice little racketeering enterprise, by which city inspector Harold writes me up for whatever, enters it into the bureaucratic system, by which it comes to private contractor. Private contractor gets paid, Harold keeps his job (and maybe drives me out of my house and buys it and destroys everything I've done here?), City gets it's cut to pay it's pensioners with, etc, AS IF I AM SOME KIND OF ATM. Which Harold inspector fuck I saw parked outside my house this morning. Here we go again...

Which "zombies" public and private btw are a secret power of the State, often heard of late defending the State, regurgitating something to the effect of "I have nothing to hide." I.E. the State can crush anyone as long as it isn't ME.

Excuse my grumpiness. All that "zombie" consuming has the climate-changed jet stream parked over Minnesota. Saw the sun for the first time in about 2 months yesterday, though it was  :icon_sunny: :rain: :icon_sunny: :rain: :icon_sunny: :rain:, often at the same time all day. Today on my day off: non stop rain.  :(

 

Offline luciddreams

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Re: Zombie Rehab
« Reply #27 on: June 12, 2013, 09:52:11 AM »
As long as anyone with a secure job as an employee is demonized as a zombie and or a parasite, the real parasites are accelerating us towards OUR and THEIR self destruction.  :(  :emthdown:

Our and THEIR self destruction may be baked into the cake at this point.  I don't think it is entirely, but I think billions dieing in the coming years is likely.  Which is why the foxstead is so important.  It's true, there are many "eco-villages" out there, which are arguably close enough to the same thing as the foxstead, so why not just go join an existing one? 

I've looked into existing ones...one really, the permaculture scene in Asheville NC mostly.  There are a lot of good people there, who are awake to the doom we spend our time talking about.  They are at least doing something about these problems.  I think the reason I'm into the foxstead is because the process is extremely meticulous this way.  We are creating it every day at the Diner actually. 

Point is, nothing is going to change about the direction those ticks are taking our planet.  We have to deal with the facts that are all ramifications of their destruction.  Yet they are just people to are they not?  I mean if we're all equal and shit.  If egalitarianism is true than it's true for all...even the 1%. 

Quote
Blaming the victim is not only inaccurate, it serves the purposes of the MATRIX by keeping the heat of the REAL PARASITES. Do your part. Blame the guilty, not the innocent.

I no longer give a shit who's to blame Agelbert.  It's a fucked up mess at this point.  Beyond all repair even.  Or to go extreme Navy acronym for you, it's SNAFU, TARFU, AND FUBAR all at the same time.  Government has been lobotomized and neutered, Corporations are the Wax of Icarus's wings as well as the hubris in his head, and the masses are mostly pharmaceutically altered on fukitol and hopium with their hopes in technotriumphalism.  What's it matter who's to blame. 

IMO the 1% are zombies too, or worse than zombies even, they're the Witchdoctors makin' all of those zombies in the first place...for purposes of slavery.  Freedom is Slavery after all.  The point is to wake up and stop being a zombie.  Start dealing with the reality of our world.  Take the power back. 

I'll let Rage say it:

Quote
"Take The Power Back"

Bring that shit in! Uggh!

Yeah, the movement's in motion with mass militant poetry
Now check this out...uggh!

In the right light, study becomes insight
But the system that dissed us
Teaches us to read and right

So called facts are fraud
They want us to allege and pledge
And bow down to their God
Lost the culture, the culture lost
Spun our minds and through time
Ignorance has taken over
Yo, we gotta take the power back!
Bam! Here's the plan
Motherfuck Uncle Sam
Step back, I know who I am
Raise up your ear, I'll drop the style and clear
It's the beats and the lyrics they fear
The rage is relentless
We need a movement with a quickness
You are the witness of change
And to counteract
We gotta take the power back

Yeah, we gotta take the power back
Come on, come on!
We gotta take the power back

The present curriculum
I put my fist in 'em
Eurocentric every last one of 'em
See right through the red, white and blue disguise
With lecture I puncture the structure of lies
Installed in our minds and attempting
To hold us back
We've got to take it back
Holes in our spirit causin' tears and fears
One-sided stories for years and years and years
I'm inferior? Who's inferior?
Yeah, we need to check the interior
Of the system that cares about only one culture
And that is why
We gotta take the power back

Yeah, we gotta take the power back
Come on, come on!
We gotta take the power back

Hey yo check, we're gonna have to break it, break it,
break it down
Awww shit!

Uggh!

And like this...uggh!

Come on, yeah! Bring it back the other way!

The teacher stands in front of the class
But the lesson plan he can't recall
The student's eyes don't perceive the lies
Bouning off every fucking wall
His composure is well kept
I guess he fears playing the fool
The complacent students sit and listen to some of that
Bullshit that he learned in school

Europe ain't my rope to swing on
Can't learn a thing from it
Yet we hang from it
Gotta get it, gotta get it together then
Like the motherfuckin' weathermen
To expose and close the doors on those who try
To strangle and mangle the truth
'Cause the circle of hatred continues unless we react
We gotta take the power back

Yeah, we gotta take the power back
Come on, come on!
We gotta take the power back

No more lies
No more lies
No more lies
No more lies
No more lies
No more lies
No more lies
No more lies

Uggh!

Yeah!

Take it back y'all
Take it back, a-take it back
A-take it back y'all, come on!
Take it back y'all
Take it back, a-take it back
A-take it back y'all, come on!

Uggh!

Yeah!



<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/APmUWC8S1_M" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/APmUWC8S1_M</a>





Offline jdwheeler42

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Re: GM and LD said
« Reply #28 on: June 12, 2013, 10:17:39 AM »
I studied your zombie research. Are you aware that the Libertarians have their own definition for a zombie that is QUITE mainstream right now among Republican circles as well? ANYBODY that works in a bureaucracy (i.e. GOVERNMENT JOB) is a zombie to them. If you don't own your own business or work in private enterprise, you are a dead beat zombie useless eater sponging off all those "job creator" predators out there that do "so much" to "help" the US economy.

I mean this with all due respect Sir...Fuck politics...don't get me started on politics Agelbert.  My cussometer pegs out at about 9 cuss words for every 10 towards the end of the politics debate.  It's a puppet show...end of story.  Another form of football for a different, more egg head shaped form of idiot.  I tried politics when I campaigned for Ron Paul in 2007.  Just more zombie food IMO :P

Quote
So yeah, the word "ZOMBIE" is a button pusher for me because of its propagandist use to demonize millions of town, county, state and federal employees.

I get it, but those ass holes don't get to define my language for me.  That's called New Speak.  Orwell wrote all about that in 1984.  There's a New Speak Dictionary doncha know :laugh:  As my wiki research demonstrated, the word did not start as propaganda.  Just witchcraft in a culture and time different from our own.  And those Zombies had very real cohorts.  Those thrown from a train after being brutally beaten for refusal to be a slave I imagine. 

We had the same problem with the word Vixen.  You see it as a derogatory word, and I see it as a beautiful one.  I see it as the beauty incarnate in my wife, mother to my children, and lover...as that beauty emanating from each of her pores.  That's Vixen like.  But I make no secret about the fact that I turn into a fox at night  :laugh:

Quote
It is a gross generalization put out there for the SOLE PURPOSE of trashing the commons, destroying good government (what's left of it), and funneling MORE profit into predatory capitalist pockets. :emthdown:

all the more reason to co-opted the co-opted word back from the co-opters in the 1984 copters man O0
Quote
The incredible IRONY of this SHIT is that the predatory capitalists on Wall Street and Madison Avenue are the MAIN DRIVERS of the matrix, NOT the federal government!  Yeah, they have turned the governemnt into their lakey but I DESPISE the flipping of the order of EVIL here to label the GOVERNMENT (a mere TOOL that can be use for good or bad) as the bad guy when the predatory capitalists are BY DEFINITION, the bad guys. And the predatory bastards are the ones pushing the ZOMBIE label 24/7.
Quote
Frankly, the term is deliberately derogatory, cardboard and two dimentional. It's a name calling propaganda exercise. For that reason alone, I don't think it adequately defines the populace who are victimized, willingly or unwillingly, by the matrix.

We are all victims of that evil fuckin' machine Agelbert...even those at the highest levels...the 1% or whatever the fuck you wanna call'em. 

My biggest issue with you is that you're allowing one entity, a political, libertarian one...to be precise, to define what a Zombie is and is not.

Personally I'm sick of this NewSpeak by people calling themselves Libertarians.  The proper term for the people who call people with government jobs 'zombies' is Corporatists.  Maybe I was deluded to begin with, but my understanding was that Libertarianism was an advocate for individual freedoms, something which I strongly believe in.  Now they seem to have been taken over by corporate advocates.  I'm sorry, as far as I'm concerned Big Business = Big Government = Mass Media.  They're all in it together, and they're all against us, and if you support any of them, you're a useful idiot to them.
Making pigs fly is easy... that is, of course, after you have built the catapult....

Offline agelbert

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LD said
« Reply #29 on: June 12, 2013, 10:39:45 AM »
Quote
I no longer give a shit who's to blame Agelbert.

You keep sayin' that.  But you, like WHD, care A LOT who is to blame!  :icon_mrgreen:

How do I know your secret? Because you plan to survive this clusterfuck and have PLANS, like RE does, to make SURE it doesn't happen again.  ;)

You, and all that venture into the Foxstead, SUN project or whatever are keen observers of the status quo and have taken GREAT PAINS, as is obvious by all your analytical prose, to understand HOW this happened and, more importantly, WHY.

You have tracked down the historical path of perversion to its greed filled, giant ego, hubris tainted CORE.

You KNOW that it all goes back to a predator that doesn't understand biosphere boundaries and rules. You KNOW this because YOU, WHD, RE and many others here CARE!

Ya ain't foolin' me, friends!  :icon_mrgreen:




Doomstead Diner mouse that CARES!  :icon_mrgreen:

The FINE PRINT not seen on the above overtly QUIXOTIC graphic is a deep and narrow hidy hole just behind our SURVIVOR MOUSE...  ;)  :icon_mrgreen: :laughing7:
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
Faith,
if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

 

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