AuthorTopic: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal  (Read 26761 times)

Offline RE

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Another Dead St Louis Teen: Rinse and Repeat
« Reply #45 on: October 11, 2014, 12:01:26 AM »
250 UNARMED PEOPLE MURDERED BY COPS EVERY YEAR!
Police Policies Studies Council

RE


Protests Continue in St. Louis Over Police Shooting of Another Black Teen


By Press TV
Global Research, October 10, 2014
Press TV
Region: USA
Theme: Law and Justice, Police State & Civil Rights


Hundreds of angry protesters have clashed with police in the US city of St. Louis for a second consecutive night after a white police officer fatally shot another black teenager.

As many as 400 demonstrators chanted and marched through St. Louis in the state of Missouri on Thursday night following loud protests the night before over the shooting death of 18-year-old Vonderrit Myers Jr. by an off-duty white policeman on Wednesday.

The latest police shooting took place two months after Darren Wilson, a white police officer shot and killed 18-year-old Michael Brown in Ferguson, a predominantly black suburb of St. Louis, sparking weeks of violent protests.

Thursday’s demonstration over Myers’ death grew increasingly chaotic overnight with police arresting several protesters and one officer getting slightly injured.

Several American flags were also burned and stomped on by the protesters. “It’s not our flag,” said Elizabeth Vega, an artist who said she had been protesting since Brown’s death. “Our children are being killed in the street. This flag doesn’t cover black or brown people.”

Gina Gowdy, 46, stood for hours waving an upside-down American flag. “I have three grandsons,” she said. “This has to stop. They are assassinating our black young men. People are fed up.”

The St. Louis police department has refused to identify the 32-year-old off-duty officer who was working for a private security firm when he killed Myers.

St. Louis Police Chief Sam Dotson told reporters that the black teen got into “physical alteration” with the policeman before he was fatally wounded. He said the suspect allegedly turned and “pointed a gun at the officer and fired at least three rounds at the officer.”

The victim’s family, however, contend that the police are lying. “The police are lying,” Joseph Cotton, Myers’s grandfather, said outside the family home on Thursday.

The victim’s mother told The Associated Press by phone Thursday that her son wasn’t carrying a gun, as police claim. Syreeta Myers said her son was holding a sandwich when he was killed. “Police lie. They lied about Michael Brown, too,” she said.

Several civil rights organizations and protest groups have planned marches during the weekend over the killing of Michael Brown with Myers’ death on Wednesday expected to add fuel to the fire.

Police brutality and the unnecessary use of heavy-handed tactics have become a major concern across the US in recent years. US police shoot and kill an average of 1,000 people a year, 1 in 4 of whom are unarmed, according to a report by the Police Policy Studies Council.
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Offline Ashvin

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #46 on: October 11, 2014, 05:09:01 AM »
RE, you can fantasize about class action lawsuits all you want, but the fact is, IF you were a lawyer, you would either be following my advice or you would be disbarred for filing frivolous lawsuits. I suspect the former. This thread has really revealed to me the hypocrisy and carelessness of people on this forum. You guys will talk nonsense all day about racism and minorities because you are NOT one and your ass is not on the line.

I will rest easy knowing that if any of you ever find yourselves in the position of taking photos or video of the police in a public place and getting arrested, you will NOT resist, but rather present your airtight constitutional defense in court, now that you are INFORMED. You will get off the charge, then come back to your computer and make reckless comments which only PROMOTE racism and social unrest.

AG, all I can say is that you are a huge disappointment on this thread. I expect less empty rhetoric and more level-headed analysis from you.

Offline RE

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #47 on: October 11, 2014, 11:02:11 AM »
you would be disbarred for filing frivolous lawsuits.

This is precisely the problem.  With 250 unarmed people murdered by cops every year, obviously this is not a frivolous issue.  There are a few thousand people demonstrating in St Louis and Ferguson who don't think it is frivolous either.  Only a Fascist would consider it frivolous.

I am disappointed to discover that you are a Fascist, didn't pick that up before.  I rechristen you Il Duce Watson here on the Diner.  :icon_mrgreen:



RE
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Offline JoeP

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #48 on: October 11, 2014, 12:32:51 PM »

I am disappointed to discover that you are a Fascist, didn't pick that up before.  I rechristen you Il Duce Watson here on the Diner.  :icon_mrgreen:


"Ash the Fasc" has a ring to it too.   :D
just my straight shooting honest opinion

Offline Ka

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #49 on: October 11, 2014, 01:45:47 PM »
you would be disbarred for filing frivolous lawsuits.

This is precisely the problem.  With 250 unarmed people murdered by cops every year, obviously this is not a frivolous issue.  There are a few thousand people demonstrating in St Louis and Ferguson who don't think it is frivolous either.  Only a Fascist would consider it frivolous.

I am disappointed to discover that you are a Fascist, didn't pick that up before.  I rechristen you Il Duce Watson here on the Diner.  :icon_mrgreen:

Unbelievable. Ashvin is talking CFS and you manage to twist that into calling him a fascist.

Offline jdwheeler42

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #50 on: October 11, 2014, 01:48:26 PM »
I am disappointed to discover that you are a Fascist, didn't pick that up before.  I rechristen you Il Duce Watson here on the Diner.  :icon_mrgreen:
"Ash the Fasc" has a ring to it too.   :D
Nah, Ashvin is just trying to blend in with his colleagues....
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Offline agelbert

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #51 on: October 11, 2014, 02:12:00 PM »
RE,
Well said. Always remember all those brilliant (no sarcasm here - they were considered the pinnacle of legal thinking and properly just constitutional law guardians) jurists and lawyers from 1930s Germany, THAT WERE STILL THERE in 1968, who peddled empty rhetoric for Hitler to survive, presented (at Nuremberg) an erudite "defense" of their prudent, measured, legal, analytical logic of doing the "best they could" under the duress of Hitler's dictates (they claimed they saved many lives - NOT) only to be told they were full of baseless rhetoric and perjurous mendacity after over a thousand witnesses told the REAL story. Nevertheless, most of them got off SCOTT FREE. They do take care their own, don't they.  :icon_mrgreen:

They DON'T take care of we-the-people. They never will. Handmaidens of whoever is in power with empty, but high sounding rhetoric to accompany their claim to being defenders of justice. I wish it weren't so.

Discussing LAW with a lawyer is a waste of time; they are hopelessly locked in confirmation bias and defending their bread and butter with all their sophistic and erudite skills. It's not personal; it's just that they keep foremost in their keen minds the disbarring consequences of defending natural law over statist laws formulated for the coercion of the citizenry on behalf of the health of the state.


I have been to court Pro Se twice. I pounded the law, used state supreme court Stare Decisis (case law) precedent, rules of legal procedure and constitutional law as well as mortgage law and inheritance law (when needed) to back every  assertion on every motion, presented evidence of fraud, and pleaded with a judge to overturn a clearly illegal power of attorney, only to be ignored (because, of course, the judge could not counter my claims  :evil4:).

This is what they do when you pound the law and they don't want to follow it. They are watching VERY closely for you to make assertions not based on law (especially if you are a pro se messing with their private corporate club - At which point they lambast you with all sorts of legal terms for not knowing what you are talking about, demanding that you get a lawyer, or face contempt of court charges or be prevented from representing yourself henceforth - I studied all those games in advance so they were never able to have that "fun" with me. LOL!).

But they aren't done just because they can't throw you out of court for not knowing the law. Oh no! If, after the judge willfully (and "lawfully"  :evil4:) ignores your motions, you attempt to pressure the judge asking them to "reconsider" a court order or overturn (leave without effect) their sentence or ruling, they just say NO.

In our corrupt system, a judge does NOT have to justify shit, regardless of what a lawyer will tell you. In order to get a judge to recuse themselves, GET THIS, THEY have to APPROVE the motion for recusal that you present! 

Talk about stacking the deck! And forget complaining about the judge to the court system unless you have a lot of money and patience. One judge I recently had the misfortune of dealing with was taken to the state supreme court for deliberately ignoring a state supreme court ruling on Dolo incidente (a bank offers financial products to a public entity, and hides the true costs of the product) in order to defend a crooked banking institution.

The state supreme court ruled it was an HONEST MISTAKE OF INTERPRETATION (bullshit!) by said judge. Said judge, that had just thumbed her nose at the supreme court, was not penalized in any way, and was allowed to continue as a judge in good standing. 

Expect a lawyer (after a week on the clock charging per hour studying the court proceedings  :icon_mrgreen:)  to say this is another ISOLATED INCIDENT and, overall, the system is just  dandy and Just, and every case must be looked at separately, not as a "ridiculous, wild eyed, judgement" of the overall system by "imagining" a pattern of corruption where "there is none". RIGHT. 

Lawyers and judges have a REAL PROBLEM connecting dots. They are LOATHE to see a pattern that reveals the TRUTH about how corrupt and dysfunctional our court system is. They are the fish that swim in that water. They will never see anything wrong with the water, period. That's confirmation bias. Of course, they will argue day and night that they are there to preserve the integrity of that system and are vigilant of flaws and the system is "self correcting" for these "unfortunate isolated incidents" of corruption. That's just rhetoric. 

The system now dances to the tune played by, mostly the large corporate institutions in general and the banks in particular. All these so called LEGAL, LAWFUL LAWS can be traced to profit through some form of violation over the natural laws of life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness.

The latest twist, a very embarrassing one for the judge I mentioned above , that shows CLEARLY the puppet threads from the bank to the judge (in my quixotic legal effort) is hilarious if it wasn't so tragically unjust.

I filed a motion requesting a third party lawsuit. I was asked to reveal the grounds for inclusion (even though I had JUST DONE THAT in the motion) of said third party (my dad's second wife who was now legally an heir due to the death of my father).

I gave the grounds, I cited the law, I gave precedents, etc. I alleged she MUST be part of the bank's list of party sued or the lawsuit the bank presented is invalid. I cautioned the judge against ruling for the bank because this set up a very bad precedent allowing blood heirs to ignore a widow from a second marriage in foreclosure sale proceeds. I even was so bold as to claim the constitutionality of that ruling could be questioned and the foreclosure sale ruled invalid along with (I slipped this in at the last :evil4:) the judge appearing as the handmaiden of the bank and thereby undermining the TRUST of the people in our court system (a cause for recusal - I never did waste my time attempting to get that judge's recusal - they are mostly ALL banking puppets).

I was ignored. The "honorable" judge, after (LOL!) stating there was "no controversy" in the lawsuit, hands down the sentence in favor of the bank. I call up the widow and tell her if she thinks she can play this game and run to the foreclosure auction and snap up the property, she's got another thing coming. I told her this was a setup from the word go and admitted I had gone to bat for her to defend my interests, not just hers. I yelled this at her: She had never defended justice or my inheritance. She had sided with my family and they were going to shaft her. Have a nice day.

Well the widow, firmly holding her wallet in panic, raced to the bank with her copy of the last will and testament of my old man. The bank filed a motion to "leave the sentence without effect" and amended the lawsuit to include the widow. I had filed multiple motions asking, FOR MONTHS, that all that be done and MUST ?BE DONE according to the LAW! In exactly two days, the judge rescinded her sentence, accepted the amended lawsuit, AND issued a sentence ruling in favor of the NEW and IMPROVED amended lawsuit.

What an embarrassment for that judge to behave like such a lackey! I have a count of over 16 judges that have perused that case since I began being a pain in the legal ass in February. I'm sure the cocktail parties are no fun for that judge right now.  8)

There were a few, brave, principled jurists in Germany that were NOT Jewish who were willing to stand on principle. There are a few in the USA today.



They will be silenced by their peers and the state. The only solution to tyranny is an EX CURIA solution.



Hebrews 11: 39 These were all commended for their faith, yet none of them received what had been promised, 40 since God had planned something better for us so that only together with us would they be made perfect


« Last Edit: October 11, 2014, 02:41:05 PM by agelbert »
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
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if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

Offline jdwheeler42

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #52 on: October 11, 2014, 02:18:44 PM »
Unbelievable. Ashvin is talking CFS and you manage to twist that into calling him a fascist.
RE is being dramatic, but he is right in the sense that "all that is required for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."  You are correct, what Ashvin is saying makes CFS for the individual, in the short term, as it did for the Germans when the Nazis came to power.  It didn't make sense to try to fight them, the consequences for the individual were too negative and the chance of success too slim.  But collectively the consequences of not fighting fascism are far greater, in the long run.
Making pigs fly is easy... that is, of course, after you have built the catapult....

Offline agelbert

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #53 on: October 11, 2014, 02:44:03 PM »
JD,
Well said.  :emthup: :emthup: :emthup:

Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
Faith,
if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

Offline RE

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #54 on: October 11, 2014, 03:13:06 PM »
Unbelievable. Ashvin is talking CFS and you manage to twist that into calling him a fascist.

It's a Gift.  :icon_mrgreen:

RE
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Offline agelbert

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #55 on: October 11, 2014, 03:37:25 PM »
Unbelievable. Ashvin is talking CFS and you manage to twist that into calling him a fascist.

It's a Gift.  :icon_mrgreen:
RE

   :emthup:
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
Faith,
if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

Offline Ka

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #56 on: October 11, 2014, 04:32:45 PM »
Unbelievable. Ashvin is talking CFS and you manage to twist that into calling him a fascist.

It's a Gift.  :icon_mrgreen:
RE



   :emthup:

Thumbs up for demagoguery?

@JD,

Here's what happened.
RE: What a lawyer should do is file class-action lawsuits for every case of police brutality.
Ashvin: if a lawyer did that he would be disbarred for filing frivolous lawsuits.
RE: You're calling Ferguson frivolous? You're a fascist.

On the larger issue of "all that is required for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.", where has Ashvin said "do nothing"? What he has said is that if you are in the immediate situation of being bullied by a cop, do nothing in that situation, and then see if you can get redress in court. Do you think in that situation that you would fight back? I sure as hell will not, and RE has said that he would not, and I very much doubt that AG would either.

Offline Ashvin

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #57 on: October 11, 2014, 06:04:35 PM »
Unbelievable. Ashvin is talking CFS and you manage to twist that into calling him a fascist.

It's a Gift.  :icon_mrgreen:
RE



   :emthup:

Thumbs up for demagoguery?

@JD,

Here's what happened.
RE: What a lawyer should do is file class-action lawsuits for every case of police brutality.
Ashvin: if a lawyer did that he would be disbarred for filing frivolous lawsuits.
RE: You're calling Ferguson frivolous? You're a fascist.

On the larger issue of "all that is required for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.", where has Ashvin said "do nothing"? What he has said is that if you are in the immediate situation of being bullied by a cop, do nothing in that situation, and then see if you can get redress in court. Do you think in that situation that you would fight back? I sure as hell will not, and RE has said that he would not, and I very much doubt that AG would either.

Thank you Ka, you are always a consistent voice of reason on this forum. AG pretends to be sometimes, but he is starting to show his true colors. He is hoping and praying that other people here don't realize that his sporadic use of legal terminology is absolute NONSENSE. AG doesn't have the slightest clue as to what the law is, but unfortunately his LACK of humility is shining through here and he refuses to consider the possibility that he may be wrong. I expect that kind of arrogance and egoism from RE, because he takes PRIDE in his "CFS" (aka IGNORANCE and intellectual LAZINESS), but not AG. And, as you pointed out, the HYPOCRISY is rampant here. But I suspect we will never get a reasonable resposne to that charge, because they know it is true and simply DON'T CARE... as long as its not their old white asses on the line, they will continue to spread propaganda to "win" an argument.

Offline Surly1

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #58 on: October 11, 2014, 06:14:15 PM »
Unbelievable. Ashvin is talking CFS and you manage to twist that into calling him a fascist.

It's a Gift.  :icon_mrgreen:
RE



   :emthup:

Thumbs up for demagoguery?

@JD,

Here's what happened.
RE: What a lawyer should do is file class-action lawsuits for every case of police brutality.
Ashvin: if a lawyer did that he would be disbarred for filing frivolous lawsuits.
RE: You're calling Ferguson frivolous? You're a fascist.

On the larger issue of "all that is required for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing.", where has Ashvin said "do nothing"? What he has said is that if you are in the immediate situation of being bullied by a cop, do nothing in that situation, and then see if you can get redress in court. Do you think in that situation that you would fight back? I sure as hell will not, and RE has said that he would not, and I very much doubt that AG would either.

Thank you Ka, you are always a consistent voice of reason on this forum. AG pretends to be sometimes, but he is starting to show his true colors. He is hoping and praying that other people here don't realize that his sporadic use of legal terminology is absolute NONSENSE. AG doesn't have the slightest clue as to what the law is, but unfortunately his LACK of humility is shining through here and he refuses to consider the possibility that he may be wrong. I expect that kind of arrogance and egoism from RE, because he takes PRIDE in his "CFS" (aka IGNORANCE and intellectual LAZINESS), but not AG. And, as you pointed out, the HYPOCRISY is rampant here. But I suspect we will never get a reasonable resposne to that charge, because they know it is true and simply DON'T CARE... as long as its not their old white asses on the line, they will continue to spread propaganda to "win" an argument.

FWIW, I hold with you and Ka.

It seems to me that in your posts on this thread, you have described how the law works and what optimum survival strategies are, rather than act as an apologist for the law.

AG's ire at judges and the legal system , while probably justified given his experience, seems ill directed at you. And RE is obviously back on the crackpipe.

If you don't like the law, get it changed. that is, in part, what Occupy was about. As AG illustrates with the excellent Nazi articles, hard to do in a fascist lockup.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline Ashvin

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Re: Three US States Make Recording Police Activity Illegal
« Reply #59 on: October 11, 2014, 06:31:06 PM »
Unbelievable. Ashvin is talking CFS and you manage to twist that into calling him a fascist.
RE is being dramatic, but he is right in the sense that "all that is required for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing."  You are correct, what Ashvin is saying makes CFS for the individual, in the short term, as it did for the Germans when the Nazis came to power.  It didn't make sense to try to fight them, the consequences for the individual were too negative and the chance of success too slim.  But collectively the consequences of not fighting fascism are far greater, in the long run.

Comparing the US constitutional legal system to that of Nazi Germany is RIDICULOUS, as is comparing US attorneys to Germans who supported Nazi policy. In fact, this legal system is the ONLY thing standing between us and the fascists who want to create the "law" as they go along. We should not throw the baby out with the bathwater out of hatred for fascists, because then we become just as ethically depraved and totalitarian as they are.

 

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