AuthorTopic: Ron Paul on the American Empire  (Read 14495 times)

Offline Eddie

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Ron Paul on the American Empire
« on: March 16, 2015, 06:09:15 AM »
Dr. Paul continues to distinguish himself as the only sane voice crying out in the wilderness that is American politics.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-03-15/green-light-empire-ron-pauls-short-history-washingtons-wars-1990

What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

Offline Eddie

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #1 on: March 16, 2015, 06:20:39 AM »
Until the American people understand that this is what's going on, and quit supporting the pimps and the  generals and the money-changers, we're on a path to certain doom.

I've never understood why more people don't rally around this clear-eyed old man. Could it be because Americans are stupid and/or delusional?
What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

Online Surly1

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #2 on: March 16, 2015, 09:09:51 AM »
Until the American people understand that this is what's going on, and quit supporting the pimps and the  generals and the money-changers, we're on a path to certain doom.

I've never understood why more people don't rally around this clear-eyed old man. Could it be because Americans are stupid and/or delusional?

It's because RP can talk for five minutes and make exquisite sense, and have one nodding one's head in agreement. And at the 5:01 mark ... KAPOW! He says something live and direct from the bowels of the 18th century.

It's "Crazy Uncle Liberty," in the phrase of Charlie Pierce.

His anti-war stance enchanted a number of lefty fans who looked no farther than his promise to end foreign wars that he never would be in place to do anything about anyway.

Pierce:
Quote
At its most elemental, the Ron Paul "revolution" was primarily a catchbasin for traditional nativism, goldbuggery, unreconstructed Confederatism, wishful thinking, constitutional mumbledy-peg and, on its not-too-distant fringes, some even more distasteful nuggets from American crackpottery past. (The racism in those newsletters was not accidental. It was the inevitable byproduct in history of most of the ideas that Paul promoted elsewhere. And Senator Aqua Buddha [his son, Sen. Rand Paul] is really the pure stuff, as we will see as he ascends to the leadership of the "revolution.") That so many progressives fell for the con is a measure of the essential intellectual bankruptcy of the Democratic party.
“The old world is dying, and the New World struggles to be born: now is the time of monsters.”

Offline Eddie

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #3 on: March 16, 2015, 09:39:08 AM »
The only thing I ever found myself diametrically opposed to was his stand on abortion. Some of the other accusations don't hold water, imho. Not that I'm interested in getting in a shouting match about it.

The race card is overplayed against old white men in this country. Charlie Pierce would no doubt consider somebody like Fred Reed to be a foaming-at-the-mouth racist, but imho he just points out some of the more obvious idiocies of our failed social experiments. Paul is a medical doctor who once worked in the trenches of a county hospital delivering the babies of the indigent, a POV I can understand quite well...and one that might easily give someone a race bias, whether they started out with one or not.

One man's Confederacy is another man's State's Rights, which were given by the constitution and destroyed forever by Lincoln.

Goldbuggery is another word for stable money.

I'd vote for Rupaul if he promised to reform the banks and reign in the military. Those things are primary objectives, and being in favor of them forgives a multitude of sins.

I'm no big fan of Rand. Ayn Rand or Rand Paul.



What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

Offline MKing

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #4 on: March 16, 2015, 10:50:44 AM »
Dr. Paul continues to distinguish himself as the only sane voice crying out in the wilderness that is American politics.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-03-15/green-light-empire-ron-pauls-short-history-washingtons-wars-1990

Any knowledge on why the skinhead and racist types seem to like what he says? Anything lingering in his background causing need for worry?
Sometimes one creates a dynamic impression by saying something, and sometimes one creates as significant an impression by remaining silent.
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Offline MKing

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #5 on: March 16, 2015, 10:58:31 AM »
Until the American people understand that this is what's going on, and quit supporting the pimps and the  generals and the money-changers, we're on a path to certain doom.

None of us gets out of here alive Eddie, so sure, Doom is guaranteed. And those doing the "generaling" will continue providing you that benefit that you take advantage of every day, yet don't appear to want to give credit for. Pretty rough on those who provide you such a substantial benefit, don't you think?

Quote from: Eddie
I've never understood why more people don't rally around this clear-eyed old man. Could it be because Americans are stupid and/or delusional?

Because he has failed the test when, during the height of his popularity, he was asked a question during a debate about resource issues and flubbed it the same way every other Republicrat or Democan does. Walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, is probably a duck...or in this case...just another lying sleazebag who..upon entering office...will do exactly what he pleases...as opposed to what he promised.

Sometimes one creates a dynamic impression by saying something, and sometimes one creates as significant an impression by remaining silent.
-Dalai Lama

Offline Eddie

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #6 on: March 16, 2015, 11:14:12 AM »
Pretty rough on those who provide you such a substantial benefit, don't you think?


What benefit, exactly? The right to pay millions in taxes so oil tycoons can get richer? I'll trade any benefit( if there is one, which i doubt), for a peaceful, more sustainable planet.

Any knowledge on why the skinhead and racist types seem to like what he says? Anything lingering in his background causing need for worry?

it has been noted by more than one journalist, and I concur, that Ron Paul's most ardent supporters were his biggest liability.


My take is that it's because only people on  the fringe somewhere (not necessarily the fringe I'm on personally, however) are attracted to the kind of grassroots populist Paul is, or rather was. Most people are busy slurping the kool-aid given to them by Fox News, or alternately, NPR.




« Last Edit: March 16, 2015, 12:57:16 PM by Eddie »
What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

Offline MKing

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #7 on: March 16, 2015, 02:00:31 PM »
Pretty rough on those who provide you such a substantial benefit, don't you think?


What benefit, exactly? The right to pay millions in taxes so oil tycoons can get richer?

To have THIS not be your local highway because you are on the wrong side of power projection.



Quote from: Eddie
I'll trade any benefit( if there is one, which i doubt), for a peaceful, more sustainable planet.

Not if it involved your daughter being on that highway at the wrong time. I state it with certainty, but let me say it is more of a high probability comment, giving you the same benefit of a doubt I would any loving father.

Quote from: Eddie
Any knowledge on why the skinhead and racist types seem to like what he says? Anything lingering in his background causing need for worry?

it has been noted by more than one journalist, and I concur, that Ron Paul's most ardent supporters were his biggest liability.

Interesting. I hadn't seen that level of "support". I tend to agree with you, much like Ross Perot the guy comes across like a square shooter most of the time, what part do the maroons tend to exaggerate or run away with?

Quote from: Eddie
My take is that it's because only people on  the fringe somewhere (not necessarily the fringe I'm on personally, however) are attracted to the kind of grassroots populist Paul is, or rather was. Most people are busy slurping the kool-aid given to them by Fox News, or alternately, NPR.

Assuming statistical normality in human intelligence, half of people are below average, add in some large majority of the above average that have intelligence and were never taught to think for themselves, take those who are left and pitch out those who couldn't solve a conceptual problem to save their lives (literally) and MOST people listening to Fox News, NPR, internet blogs and SKinhead Daily Times is a statistical given. Not even a surprise. So any process engineer then asks, what can be done with those who don't meet these criteria, to change the behavior of those who do? CREATING a doom might in that case be a reasonable plan, on the grounds that normal folks can no more see their way out of their mess then you can the luxury you enjoy because of the military representing your interests does so ABROAD. Your state capital has it far better than this country capital...just one of the benefits you and yours enjoy, sitting behind a military making it possible...and you won't even say thank you!!


Sometimes one creates a dynamic impression by saying something, and sometimes one creates as significant an impression by remaining silent.
-Dalai Lama

Offline agelbert

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #8 on: March 16, 2015, 03:39:34 PM »
Eddie,
Ron Paul is right on about the military and the Federal Reserve counterfeiting too.  :emthup: But he was always silent as a tomb about subsidies for the fossil fuel industry AND the nuclear power industry.  :emthdown: His criticism of Wall Street bailouts was feeble, to put it mildly.  :emthdown:

But regardless of his virtues, Ron Paul is way too up front about what he believes for him to be added to the long list of front men called POTUS.

The USA stopped being a democratic republic (and not much of one at that!) when the big dogs saw all the good stuff FDR did. From Truman on, we have been a fascist dictatorship. Our elections are a farce and a fraud. You may believe otherwise. I don't.

Mking is partially right in his analysis. Front men HAVE TO BE palatable to the masses. That's part of the con. Also, Ron Paul doesn't fit the mold of spineless pliability that our M.I.C. big dogs want either.  :evil4:

We are the Fourth Reich, Eddie. GOTT MIT UNS!  :(

You can't blame the people for the leaders they have in a dictatorship. The reason the PR pushes that we ARE a democracy is for the very heinous purpose of BLAMING THE VICTIM. :emthdown:

« Last Edit: March 16, 2015, 07:13:40 PM by agelbert »
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
Faith,
if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

Offline MKing

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #9 on: March 16, 2015, 04:14:54 PM »
You can't blame the people for he leaders they have in a dictatorship.

True. But you can certainly blame Americans for their leaders yet.
Sometimes one creates a dynamic impression by saying something, and sometimes one creates as significant an impression by remaining silent.
-Dalai Lama

Offline Eddie

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #10 on: March 16, 2015, 04:25:40 PM »
To have THIS not be your local highway because you are on the wrong side of power projection.


No reason to assume that any highway here would look like that even if 100% of the troops on foreign soil were pulled back. That's a straw man argument of the least persuasive variety. There are no barbarians at the gate, other than the ones we are creating with our empire building.

The USA stopped being a democratic republic (and not much of one at that!) when the big dogs saw all the good stuff FDR did. From Truman on, we have been a fascist dictatorship. Our elections are a farce and a fraud. You may believe otherwise. I don't.

I don't believe otherwise either. But it's sort of a mind-control issue too. People don't even care enough ( or understand reality well enough) to vote in their own self-interest. They're content to pull the lever for the pre-selected stuffed shirt de jour. They won't even line up behind a guy willing to fight the special interests, when they could.

What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

Offline Petty Tyrant

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #11 on: March 16, 2015, 04:49:30 PM »
and the hardware that did that, if it wasnt captured by the survivors like so much of it, has been given to your local friendly officers on the lower end of the whole intelligence spectrum all unable to think like you can. exactly where its needed next, imagine how satisfying and stimulating seeing it in high definition will be.

Pretty rough on those who provide you such a substantial benefit, don't you think?


What benefit, exactly? The right to pay millions in taxes so oil tycoons can get richer?

To have THIS not be your local highway because you are on the wrong side of power projection.



Quote from: Eddie
I'll trade any benefit( if there is one, which i doubt), for a peaceful, more sustainable planet.

Not if it involved your daughter being on that highway at the wrong time. I state it with certainty, but let me say it is more of a high probability comment, giving you the same benefit of a doubt I would any loving father.

Quote from: Eddie
Any knowledge on why the skinhead and racist types seem to like what he says? Anything lingering in his background causing need for worry?

it has been noted by more than one journalist, and I concur, that Ron Paul's most ardent supporters were his biggest liability.

Interesting. I hadn't seen that level of "support". I tend to agree with you, much like Ross Perot the guy comes across like a square shooter most of the time, what part do the maroons tend to exaggerate or run away with?

Quote from: Eddie
My take is that it's because only people on  the fringe somewhere (not necessarily the fringe I'm on personally, however) are attracted to the kind of grassroots populist Paul is, or rather was. Most people are busy slurping the kool-aid given to them by Fox News, or alternately, NPR.

Assuming statistical normality in human intelligence, half of people are below average, add in some large majority of the above average that have intelligence and were never taught to think for themselves, take those who are left and pitch out those who couldn't solve a conceptual problem to save their lives (literally) and MOST people listening to Fox News, NPR, internet blogs and SKinhead Daily Times is a statistical given. Not even a surprise. So any process engineer then asks, what can be done with those who don't meet these criteria, to change the behavior of those who do? CREATING a doom might in that case be a reasonable plan, on the grounds that normal folks can no more see their way out of their mess then you can the luxury you enjoy because of the military representing your interests does so ABROAD. Your state capital has it far better than this country capital...just one of the benefits you and yours enjoy, sitting behind a military making it possible...and you won't even say thank you!!


ELEVATE YOUR GAME

Offline MKing

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #12 on: March 16, 2015, 04:51:48 PM »
To have THIS not be your local highway because you are on the wrong side of power projection.


No reason to assume that any highway here would look like that even if 100% of the troops on foreign soil were pulled back. That's a straw man argument of the least persuasive variety.

Not quite. It is the consequence of NOT being friendly with the people who have the ability to apply violence nearly anywhere, and to any degree, they wish. And when that ability doesn't belong to YOU, it belongs to someone else, and then there is only the luck of the draw. Perhaps our leadership makes the wrong decision, doesn't suck up to the right foreign leaders, and presto….you and I get exactly the results of NOT being the 800# gorilla. It isn't a straw man, just an observation based on history and how humans have been treating each other over the millennia.

But sure…there is always a chance that if your country kowtows at exactly the right moment, maybe signs a pledge to obey Sharia law, and then sure! You don't have to worry about the highway, only whether or not your wife forgets to wear her burka in public.

Quote from: Eddie
There are no barbarians at the gate, other than the ones we are creating with our empire building.

There are barbarians in OUR country Eddie, living in YOUR state, and just because you weren't raised within sight of some doesn't mean they aren't there..waiting. And it doesn't take much to bring them out, and they don't tend to be seen in force, and in your wonderful childhood perhaps you never even had to be in the same county as them. I was related to a few, could argue forcefully that one of them donated genetic material to my existence, and my life is as much a repudiation of such behavior as any reaction to being born poor and in the hills.

Quote from: Eddie
People don't even care enough ( or understand reality well enough) to vote in their own self-interest. They're content to pull the lever for the pre-selected stuffed shirt de jour. They won't even line up behind a guy willing to fight the special interests, when they could.

There hasn't been one running for highest office in the land yet (might bend on that one a little with Ross Perot), there have only been those who CLAIM they will fight special interests. Like Obama once railed against raising the countries debt ceiling, and King George I said he wouldn't raise taxes, the other one who claimed he wasn't boffing interns, all the normal behavior of those who really don't give a shit what they TOLD you, only whether or not they can get their wives Senatorships in states that are far more interesting than podunk.
Sometimes one creates a dynamic impression by saying something, and sometimes one creates as significant an impression by remaining silent.
-Dalai Lama

Online Surly1

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #13 on: March 16, 2015, 05:09:36 PM »
Pretty rough on those who provide you such a substantial benefit, don't you think?


What benefit, exactly? The right to pay millions in taxes so oil tycoons can get richer? I'll trade any benefit( if there is one, which i doubt), for a peaceful, more sustainable planet.
Indeed.

We all pay attention  to domestic politics, but what happens overseas is so heavily filtered and distorted that few know the truth of the matter.
I would just as soon my tax dollars not pay for Fallujah, Mosul and Gaza, hokay?

Most people are busy slurping the kool-aid given to them by Fox News, or alternately, NPR.

I'd just suggest you compare the foreign policy reporting of NPR to that of Faux for a couple of days before you cast them as opposite poles. Not features, not domestic reporting, but foreign policy. I think you will become aware that NPR stands for National Pentagon Radio for a reason; NPR "News" is yet another neocon bastion when it comes to foreign policy.
“The old world is dying, and the New World struggles to be born: now is the time of monsters.”

Offline MKing

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Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #14 on: March 16, 2015, 05:10:49 PM »
and the hardware that did that, if it wasnt captured by the survivors like so much of it, has been given to your local friendly officers on the lower end of the whole intelligence spectrum all unable to think like you can. exactly where its needed next, imagine how satisfying and stimulating seeing it in high definition will be.

Hey, you won't find any objection coming off my keyboard for the demilitarization of local police. Although I seriously doubt they've handed out A10 Warthogs as of late, but still, I get the point.

And I've got cops in the family, brother in law types, and you can't paint all cops as knuckle dragging armed goons, certainly in between busting heads they actually do things to protect folks.

Doing his job, off duty no less….some typical half-wit comes along and kills him.

http://denver.cbslocal.com/2015/02/20/woman-charged-in-crash-that-killed-jefferson-county-deputy/

Sometimes one creates a dynamic impression by saying something, and sometimes one creates as significant an impression by remaining silent.
-Dalai Lama

 

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