AuthorTopic: Ron Paul on the American Empire  (Read 14173 times)

Offline Surly1

  • Administrator
  • Master Chef
  • *****
  • Posts: 15829
    • View Profile
    • Doomstead Diner
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #15 on: March 16, 2015, 05:18:07 PM »
Dr. Paul continues to distinguish himself as the only sane voice crying out in the wilderness that is American politics.

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-03-15/green-light-empire-ron-pauls-short-history-washingtons-wars-1990

Any knowledge on why the skinhead and racist types seem to like what he says? Anything lingering in his background causing need for worry?

His body of work.

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Elections/President/2011/1229/Racist-newsletter-timeline-What-Ron-Paul-has-said
http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2011/12/27/395391/fact-check-ron-paul-personally-defended-racist-newsletters/
http://www.vice.com/read/yeah-ron-paul-is-racist-after-all-sorry

From the Monitor article:

Quote
Here, in timeline format, are some prominent Paul statements tied to the issue drawn from transcripts, video clips, and news reports.


The roar of Ron Paul: Five of his unorthodox views on the economy

PHOTOS OF THE DAY Photos of the day 02/08
1985 to 1994

 The controversial statements that have surfaced stem largely from this period. They were contained in newsletters with titles like Ron Paul’s Freedom Report, the Ron Paul Political Report, the Ron Paul Survival Report, and the Ron Paul Investment Letter, rarely under a byline (although many contained first-person references that readers would assume referred to Paul himself).

Some samples: A December 1989 newsletter quoted by James Kirchick in the New Republic predicted "Racial Violence Will Fill Our Cities" because "mostly black welfare recipients will feel justified in stealing from mostly white 'haves.' "

Another letter said "I think we can assume that 95 percent of the black men in that city [Washington] are semi-criminal or entirely criminal."

An August 1992 edition of the Ron Paul Report labeled former Rep. Barbara Jordan (D) of Texas "the archetypal half-educated victimologist," according to the Houston Chronicle.

1995 to 1996

In a 1995 C-Span interview, Paul talks up his newsletter and espouses some familiarity with its contents. He says it deals a lot "with the value of the dollar, the pros and cons of the gold standard, and of course the disadvantages of all the high taxes and spending our government seems to continue to do."

Paul, having been out of office for a decade, ran for Congress in 1996 and the content of the newsletters were raised by his opponent as a campaign issue. Paul's campaign doesn't deny authorship of the newsletters, but says the Democratic rival is taking the message out of context.

In a Dallas Morning News interview, Paul said the comment about black men in the District of Columbia arose from his study of a report by the National Center on Incarceration and Alternatives, a criminal justice think tank in Virginia.

2001

In a story published by Texas Monthly, Paul tells the magazine that he didn't write "those words." The magazine itself says the newsletter statements are not "remotely like" Paul's public utterances.

"I could never say this in the campaign, but those words weren't really written by me," Paul said, according to Texas Monthly. "It wasn't my language at all. Other people help me with my newsletter as I travel around. I think the one on Barbara Jordan was the saddest thing, because Barbara and I served together and actually she was a delightful lady."

He said he had "some moral responsibility" for the words, and that his campaign aides said it would be "too confusing" to argue during the campaign that the words were not his. Paul quoted his aides saying "It appeared in your letter and your name was on that letter and therefore you have to live with it."

Yeah, don't you?
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline g

  • Golden Oxen
  • Contrarian
  • Master Chef
  • *
  • Posts: 12280
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #16 on: March 16, 2015, 05:28:56 PM »
Not that it matters to the Libertarian haters :-\


     Refusal to endorse the Republican nominee


As in 2008, in 2012 Paul ultimately refused to endorse the ticket selected by the Republican Party. He said that there was no essential difference between Romney and his Democratic opponent, President Obama, on the most critical policies: "I've been in this business a long time and believe me there is essentially no difference from one administration to another no matter what the platforms.... The foreign policy stays the same, the monetary policy stays the same, there’s no proposal for any real cuts and both parties support it."[124]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Paul  :icon_study:




Offline MKing

  • Contrarian
  • Sous Chef
  • *
  • Posts: 3354
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #17 on: March 16, 2015, 05:54:54 PM »
Any knowledge on why the skinhead and racist types seem to like what he says? Anything lingering in his background causing need for worry?

His body of work.

http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Elections/President/2011/1229/Racist-newsletter-timeline-What-Ron-Paul-has-said
http://thinkprogress.org/politics/2011/12/27/395391/fact-check-ron-paul-personally-defended-racist-newsletters/
http://www.vice.com/read/yeah-ron-paul-is-racist-after-all-sorry

Oh my. After working through just the first link, it looks like further investigation is certainly required.

Sometimes one creates a dynamic impression by saying something, and sometimes one creates as significant an impression by remaining silent.
-Dalai Lama

Offline agelbert

  • Global Moderator
  • Master Chef
  • *****
  • Posts: 11820
    • View Profile
    • Renewable Rervolution
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #18 on: March 16, 2015, 07:27:05 PM »
GO,
Nobody likes a dictatorship. What makes you think Ron Paul would not get "the treatment" that, for example, Governor Jesse Ventura got?  :evil4:  And he has three times the nuts that Ron Paul ever had!

Do you really underestimate the people that actually run this country that much?

MKing knows the score quite well.

This is a long article. But it shows DETAILS of how agnotology (the deliberate manufacture of ignorance in the service of power and profit) is used on us 24/7. Just skip everything but "Military Secrecy". They OWN THIS FUCKING COUNTRY!

http://social-epistemology.com/2012/01/20/agnotology-the-making-and-unmaking-of-ignorance-and-race-and-epistemologies-of-ignorance-reviewed-by-susan-dieleman/

« Last Edit: March 16, 2015, 07:28:49 PM by agelbert »
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
Faith,
if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

Offline Petty Tyrant

  • Cannot be Saved
  • Sous Chef
  • *
  • Posts: 4573
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #19 on: March 16, 2015, 07:47:02 PM »
maybe not warthogs no, armed drones yes. i agree there are still decent cops around, but i dont have the same appreciation for what a brother in laws sister type does for the police department in policy development esentially as the politicians editor.


and the hardware that did that, if it wasnt captured by the survivors like so much of it, has been given to your local friendly officers on the lower end of the whole intelligence spectrum all unable to think like you can. exactly where its needed next, imagine how satisfying and stimulating seeing it in high definition will be.

Hey, you won't find any objection coming off my keyboard for the demilitarization of local police. Although I seriously doubt they've handed out A10 Warthogs as of late, but still, I get the point.

And I've got cops in the family, brother in law types, and you can't paint all cops as knuckle dragging armed goons, certainly in between busting heads they actually do things to protect folks.

Doing his job, off duty no less….some typical half-wit comes along and kills him.

http://denver.cbslocal.com/2015/02/20/woman-charged-in-crash-that-killed-jefferson-county-deputy/
ELEVATE YOUR GAME

Offline g

  • Golden Oxen
  • Contrarian
  • Master Chef
  • *
  • Posts: 12280
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #20 on: March 16, 2015, 08:27:15 PM »
GO,
Nobody likes a dictatorship. What makes you think Ron Paul would not get "the treatment" that, for example, Governor Jesse Ventura got?  :evil4:  And he has three times the nuts that Ron Paul ever had!

Do you really underestimate the people that actually run this country that much?

MKing knows the score quite well.

This is a long article. But it shows DETAILS of how agnotology (the deliberate manufacture of ignorance in the service of power and profit) is used on us 24/7. Just skip everything but "Military Secrecy". They OWN THIS FUCKING COUNTRY!

http://social-epistemology.com/2012/01/20/agnotology-the-making-and-unmaking-of-ignorance-and-race-and-epistemologies-of-ignorance-reviewed-by-susan-dieleman/

I gave it twenty minutes Agelbert, sorry, but it is too much for my squash to understand.

Yes, I know we are most likely screwed but I am a hopeless romantic dreamer, who keeps wishing hoping and believing that a Good person will come along soon and deliver us from Evil.

What else have we got at this point  but faith and hope in a Fairy Tale?

Offline RE

  • Administrator
  • Chief Cook & Bottlewasher
  • *****
  • Posts: 38036
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #21 on: March 16, 2015, 08:59:20 PM »
RP would not have made much difference even if he had been electable.

The system itself is captured and hopelessly corrupt.  Gold as I have pointed out more than a few times doesn't solve resource depletion issues, and even if you tried switching to such a system it would merely accelerate the deflationary spiral.  You have a similar problem with trying to collapse in the military.  You have huge industries employing millions of people involved in the War Biz.  If you're not dropping bombs on somebody, all the Bomb Engineers are unemployed.  Drone Jockeys at Langley are unemployed.  MRAP manufacturers can't sell enough new armored vehicles every year while the old ones get donated to the local Gestapo. etc, etc, etc.

The systems that got us to where we are now developed over hundreds and in some cases thousands of years of time.  No one person, not the POTUS, not the Chinese Premier or the Ruskie Prime Minister can change the way the juggernaut operates, only react to the problems that become apparent as the system breaks down.  Both China and Russia are barely holding together by Strongmen who have plenty of internal enemies and 5th Column issues to deal with.

The only Hopium is that when the system collapses, individual communities can work to create or re-create more simple systems and local Goobernance.  The Nation-State model is in catastrophic failure mode.

RE
Save As Many As You Can

Offline Petty Tyrant

  • Cannot be Saved
  • Sous Chef
  • *
  • Posts: 4573
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #22 on: March 17, 2015, 09:14:35 AM »
this is the reality, it takes a while to accept, i know.


RP would not have made much difference even if he had been electable.

The system itself is captured and hopelessly corrupt.  Gold as I have pointed out more than a few times doesn't solve resource depletion issues, and even if you tried switching to such a system it would merely accelerate the deflationary spiral.  You have a similar problem with trying to collapse in the military.  You have huge industries employing millions of people involved in the War Biz.  If you're not dropping bombs on somebody, all the Bomb Engineers are unemployed.  Drone Jockeys at Langley are unemployed.  MRAP manufacturers can't sell enough new armored vehicles every year while the old ones get donated to the local Gestapo. etc, etc, etc.

The systems that got us to where we are now developed over hundreds and in some cases thousands of years of time.  No one person, not the POTUS, not the Chinese Premier or the Ruskie Prime Minister can change the way the juggernaut operates, only react to the problems that become apparent as the system breaks down.  Both China and Russia are barely holding together by Strongmen who have plenty of internal enemies and 5th Column issues to deal with.

The only Hopium is that when the system collapses, individual communities can work to create or re-create more simple systems and local Goobernance.  The Nation-State model is in catastrophic failure mode.

RE
ELEVATE YOUR GAME

Offline JRM

  • Sous Chef
  • ****
  • Posts: 3190
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #23 on: March 17, 2015, 02:56:07 PM »
I've never understood why more people don't rally around this clear-eyed old man. Could it be because Americans are stupid and/or delusional?

I think he's a courageous truth teller about some important things. Yet, still, he's quite nutty on other things. 

The Libertarian Party is like that, too.

One thing folks on the far right like Ron Paul and the Libertarian Party (I know, the whole party's platform isn't necessarily on the "Right," but much of it certainly is!) don't seem to get is that if you drown "government" in a bath tub without also drowning corporations (and maybe also the super-rich) in the same damn tub on the same night you end up with something even WORSE than what you started with.

My "avatar" graphic is Japanese calligraphy (shodō) forming the word shoshin, meaning "beginner's mind". --  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoshin -- It is with shoshin that I am now and always "meeting my breath" for the first time. Try it!

Offline JRM

  • Sous Chef
  • ****
  • Posts: 3190
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #24 on: March 17, 2015, 03:22:06 PM »
E.g. -

(from Wikipedia):

Environmental

As a free-market environmentalist, he asserts private property rights in relation to environmental protection and pollution prevention.[161] He called global warming a hoax in a 2009 Fox Business interview, saying, "You know, the greatest hoax I think that has been around in many, many years if not hundreds of years has been this hoax on the environment and global warming."[162] He acknowledges there is clear evidence of rising temperatures in some parts of the globe, but says that temperatures are cooling in other parts.[163]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Paul#Environmental
My "avatar" graphic is Japanese calligraphy (shodō) forming the word shoshin, meaning "beginner's mind". --  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoshin -- It is with shoshin that I am now and always "meeting my breath" for the first time. Try it!

Offline JRM

  • Sous Chef
  • ****
  • Posts: 3190
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #25 on: March 17, 2015, 03:25:07 PM »
Free-market environmentalism
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

"Free-market environmentalism is the political position that argues that the free market, property rights, and tort law provide the best means of preserving the environment, internalising pollution costs, and conserving resources."

Okay. Like, yeah.  Right.  ::)
My "avatar" graphic is Japanese calligraphy (shodō) forming the word shoshin, meaning "beginner's mind". --  http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shoshin -- It is with shoshin that I am now and always "meeting my breath" for the first time. Try it!

Offline Eddie

  • Global Moderator
  • Master Chef
  • *****
  • Posts: 17502
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #26 on: March 17, 2015, 03:56:06 PM »
Yeah, I think most of us have hard time seeing "market forces" as a stabilizing force, since we've lived our entire lives watching the corporations rape the planet and pass on much of the costs to the public. Hard core libertarians would argue that we haven't had real market forces operating for a long time, but that's a less than persuasive viewpoint.

Maybe if big business had to shoulder the real cost of the extractive industries, then market forces might behave in a much different way than what we've experienced. I still have a hard time seeing how you don't get to a "tragedy of the commons" situation without strong environmental controls on industry.

The part of the libertarian dream I do strongly identify with is just the desire to be left the fuck alone, to live my dreams , without being taxed into slavery to support a system that wastes money and resources like they came for free, and works as a conduit to transfer whatever wealth I produce to someone else's pockets.
What makes the desert beautiful is that somewhere it hides a well.

Offline g

  • Golden Oxen
  • Contrarian
  • Master Chef
  • *
  • Posts: 12280
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #27 on: March 17, 2015, 03:57:54 PM »
I've never understood why more people don't rally around this clear-eyed old man. Could it be because Americans are stupid and/or delusional?

I think he's a courageous truth teller about some important things. Yet, still, he's quite nutty on other things. 

The Libertarian Party is like that, too.

One thing folks on the far right like Ron Paul and the Libertarian Party (I know, the whole party's platform isn't necessarily on the "Right," but much of it certainly is!) don't seem to get is that if you drown "government" in a bath tub without also drowning corporations (and maybe also the super-rich) in the same damn tub on the same night you end up with something even WORSE than what you started with.

Not so sure about that statement, rather all encompassing.

Don't you think there are good and bad corporations as well as super-rich folks?

Offline g

  • Golden Oxen
  • Contrarian
  • Master Chef
  • *
  • Posts: 12280
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #28 on: March 17, 2015, 04:00:25 PM »
E.g. -

(from Wikipedia):

Environmental

As a free-market environmentalist, he asserts private property rights in relation to environmental protection and pollution prevention.[161] He called global warming a hoax in a 2009 Fox Business interview, saying, "You know, the greatest hoax I think that has been around in many, many years if not hundreds of years has been this hoax on the environment and global warming."[162] He acknowledges there is clear evidence of rising temperatures in some parts of the globe, but says that temperatures are cooling in other parts.[163]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ron_Paul#Environmental

So? He has plenty of company in this view. What's the problem besides the fact he doesn't agree with your view on the matter?

Offline g

  • Golden Oxen
  • Contrarian
  • Master Chef
  • *
  • Posts: 12280
    • View Profile
Re: Ron Paul on the American Empire
« Reply #29 on: March 17, 2015, 04:04:16 PM »
Quote
The part of the libertarian dream I do strongly identify with is just the desire to be left the fuck alone, to live my dreams , without being taxed into slavery to support a system that wastes money and resources like they came for free, and works as a conduit to transfer whatever wealth I produce to someone else's pockets.
   :emthup: :emthup: :emthup: :ernaehrung004:

That certainly is part of it Doc, a very important part.

 

Related Topics

  Subject / Started by Replies Last post
0 Replies
517 Views
Last post April 13, 2016, 02:48:18 PM
by Surly1
20 Replies
2456 Views
Last post July 24, 2017, 01:18:41 AM
by azozeo
4 Replies
343 Views
Last post May 21, 2018, 07:54:00 PM
by Palloy2