AuthorTopic: Trumpism: The Ideology  (Read 13716 times)

Offline Palloy

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Re: Trumpism: The Ideology
« Reply #75 on: March 13, 2016, 03:49:02 PM »
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UB:
Upthread there is a salon.com article by a Mr or Ms Buric, pleading the case for a Fascist analogy to be applied to Donald Trump the leading  candidate for the 2016  US Presidential Election. It is acknowledged therein that comparisons to Hitler and accusations of fascism are over used to the point of becoming meaningless. I referenced Godwins Law;

https://en.m.wikipedia.org › Godwin's_law

A "sacred cow" is an article of faith taken from the Hindu religion where the religious revere the cow due to its providing sustenance through milk and manure. Three such sacred tenets I described unambiguously [Putin is the agressor against the west, Orban the only EU leader to stand up to the troika and central bankers is bad and the Balkan war was legit.] and should not require further explanation  are torn down in the article and I hear crickets, (the insect not British Empire sport) the nearest thing to the sound of silence, ie no comments contradicting the articles stance on all three topics. This is surprising because the regular posters on this site such as yourself are staunch defenders of the opposite positions, and would ordinarily express objections to the positions on the issues taken by the articles author.

I take it you are referring to these two sentences in that very long article:

Quote
Trump would feel perfectly at home in the company of the new generation of European authoritarians like Viktor Orban of Hungary or Vladimir Putin of Russia.  He does not care that Putin considers America Russia’s historic enemy because for Trump the real enemy is within.

And your concern is that no one commented on it.  I think your implication is that this was because we agreed with 99% of the thrust of the article, that Trump is a fascist, so we let these points pass.

Orban is the right-wing PM of Hungary, who in 2012 used his Parliamentary majority to change the constitution to make the old former Communist ruling party, MSZMP, to be a criminal organisation, with serious implications for the left-wing descendent of it, MSZP, his current opposition.  He is also a very poor political fit with the rest of Europe, which has to decide EU issues unanimously.  The migrant crisis is a good example of this.  Is he authoritarian? - probably yes, although I don't know much else about the situation.

Putin is definitely NOT authoritarian.  He has huge popular support, but in terms of political power he has much organised opposition, and is in constant battle with the oligarchs (a mafia that got control of the economy in the Yelstin years, and friends of the US), and the pro-Europeans led by Medvedev.  The fact that he stepped down from the Presidency when his first two terms were up is surely testament to that.  That he is trying to wrest power away from the oligarchs is surely as good thing, although that sets him up for criticism by the US with the authoritarian tag.

As for the third "sacred cow", the break up of Yugoslavia, that was so complex and badly mis-reported on, that I am not at all sure who was authoritarian and who was not.

So of those 3 sacred cows, I agree with one, disagree with another, and don't know about the third.

How all that bears on Trump being a fascist or not, I don't know.  My opinion hasn't been changed just because of an article by a former Yugoslavian, now US history professor.

Quote
UB: ... I hear crickets, (the insect not British Empire sport) the nearest thing to the sound of silence, ie no comments contradicting the articles stance on all three topics.

There, simplified it for you.
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Online Surly1

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Re: Trumpism: The Ideology
« Reply #76 on: March 14, 2016, 02:37:08 AM »

I take it you are referring to these two sentences in that very long article:

Quote
Trump would feel perfectly at home in the company of the new generation of European authoritarians like Viktor Orban of Hungary or Vladimir Putin of Russia.  He does not care that Putin considers America Russia’s historic enemy because for Trump the real enemy is within.

And your concern is that no one commented on it.  I think your implication is that this was because we agreed with 99% of the thrust of the article, that Trump is a fascist, so we let these points pass.

That covers it from my POV as well. Thanks, Palloy.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Online Surly1

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Re: Trumpism: The Ideology
« Reply #77 on: March 14, 2016, 02:44:09 AM »





What policy does he advocate that is more authoritarian than anything obama is already doing?  Well who knows what he might do if he got the chance. It looks like people are flocking to him as an expression of wanting to be free from the authoritarianism they are already living under.

 The rent a riot didnt sit outside waving candles singing bob dylan and john lennon like this guy tries to make it sound. Here is her side of the story [/i]

http://www.nytimes.com/politics/first-draft/2016/03/12/trump-supporter-who-made-nazi-salute-explains-why-she-made-the-gesture/


The objective among us can read Garza's account and Peterson's self-serving account and make up their own minds. As usual, you seem to have made up yours well in advance of the facts.

A picture is worth ten thousand words. Godwin's Law notwithstanding.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

Offline Petty Tyrant

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Re: Trumpism: The Ideology
« Reply #78 on: March 14, 2016, 03:16:07 AM »
I believe when u keep accusing someone of doing or being something,  eventually they will oblige and meet the expectation.
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Re: Trumpism: The Ideology
« Reply #79 on: March 14, 2016, 03:38:36 AM »
I believe when u keep accusing someone of doing or being something,  eventually they will oblige and meet the expectation.

That may be true for the easily coerced; less so for people capable of independent thought.
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

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Re: Trumpism: The Ideology
« Reply #80 on: March 14, 2016, 03:40:16 AM »
"It is difficult to write a paradiso when all the superficial indications are that you ought to write an apocalypse." -Ezra Pound

 

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