AuthorTopic: Syria - Russia - US  (Read 19341 times)

Offline RE

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #75 on: October 30, 2015, 04:18:51 PM »
This is nothing new, just the US going public with what it has been doing for months. 

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If US spec ops are placed with the YPG, it will run afoul of Washington's coordination with Turkey just two days before an election that revolves around Erdogan's attempt to paint the Kurds as a threat to national security.

If the Pentagon embeds US troops with the Free Syrian Army, well then they'll be engaging Hezbollah and the Quds directly.

Of course no matter where Obama decides to place the troops, they'll be at risk of getting hit by Russian airstrikes and the consequences of that speak for themselves...

Additionally, they those in the north could be bombed by NATO ally Turkey, and everywhere they could be attacked by ISIS/Al Nusra and Assad's forces.

One has to wonder why they are necessary at all.  It's not like 20-30 (some are saying 50) more troops are going to make a difference.  It must be that the US doesn't trust their proxy fighters with the smart communications for real-time satellite viewing of the battlefield, and for calling in air strikes.

The golden rule of "Don't do stupid stuff" has been forgotten.

The hypothesis about the comm equipment is a good one.

The problem of course is somebody from the other side is going to peg their location and start lobbing missiles at them.

It's also not like this is a Patton-Montgomery-Rommel Tank Battle out in the desert.  Most of these battles are either being fought inside towns and cities or in mountainous terrain.  In neither place are ground vehicles very helpful.  So your Special Ops with all the cool high tech gear has to hump it around on foot, thus making him an ideal target for a Sniper.

In the end, this won't make a whole lot of difference, anymore than the "advisors" JFK sent to Vietnam did.  To make any difference, they would need to take every grunt we currently have in uniform all over the world and drop them in on the Beaches of Syria.  But then who would be left to Police the rest of the world and man all those military bases we have sprinkled around?

Just because the idea is stupid and ineffectual doesn't mean it won't be done though.  There is an illusion they are trying to maintain here of being able to project military power.  They also don't want to just hand over Syria to Russia and Iran.  Even if Syria has little Oil left and no decent farmland, it still has valuable Ports on the Mediterranean.  So they seek to maintain influence over the region. 30-50 "Advisors" plus doing air drops of Ammo is about the best they can do for boots on the ground presence.

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Offline Petty Tyrant

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #76 on: October 30, 2015, 04:44:51 PM »
Even if Syria has little Oil left

ah but they do,  the big bonanza in the golan heights,  and if israel found it and has plans to drill it after the low oil price crash it must be free flowing. Putin is quite a stickler for legality and that area belongs legally to syria as recognised by the un. The only problem has been they never had the muscle to take it back since 1967, unlike now with their enforcer friend there.  If they made that suicidal play, it would unite the two muslim sects at war as already seen in 1948 and 1967. The golan is also where the valley of megiddo is,  for anyone who takes bible prophecy seriously.

Im now leaning heavily toward a scenario where all the expensive oil production that is being shut down will not be able to come back quickly or sustainably if or when the price recovers. The chinks and yanks are both going to not just want but NEED the last easy oil in mena. 
« Last Edit: October 30, 2015, 04:59:19 PM by Uncle Bob »
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Offline Surly1

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #77 on: October 30, 2015, 05:04:34 PM »
Maybe the 30 advisers are a "tripwire". I can see the headlines "30 American Heroes Killed in Savage Russia Attack". "Remember The Maine".

7pm whitehouse "My fellow Americans it is with a heavy heart that I address you tonight. .... I have order our armed forces to drive Russia out of Syria and Ukraine. God bless America." (as if he can issue an order to God to do the blessing).

FWIW, a real and present danger.
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Offline RE

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #78 on: October 30, 2015, 05:07:47 PM »

Im now leaning heavily toward a scenario where all the expensive oil production that is being shut down will not be able to come back quickly or sustainably if or when the price recovers. The chinks and yanks are both going to not just want but NEED the last easy oil in mena.

Another point to consider is that if you depopulate Syria, they need less of the Oil left there for local consumption, thus leaving more to Export for further Happy Motoring in the FSoA.

The ideal is just to have a few Syrian Slaves left to man the Oil Pumps in the searing heat, rotate in a few Overseers with weapons to keep them working and ship the oil out without having to pay for it.

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Offline edpell

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #79 on: October 30, 2015, 06:45:50 PM »
Oh my God I have discovered a paradise of rational thought. Without jingoistic crazy talk.   :o 

Offline edpell

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #80 on: October 30, 2015, 07:03:37 PM »
Hey man, take another hit for NATO and Allah.   

"This recent seizure of amphetamines involving the Saudi prince in Lebanon is simply the latest tell-tale incident. Not very long ago, a reported shipment of around six-million captagon pills were seized, headed for ISIS/ISIL fighters in Syria, and the accusation was being made from multiple sources that NATO itself began production of the drug in a Bulgarian laboratory in 2011 – the very year of the Libyan and Syrian ‘uprisings’ – and that they are now also producing the drug elsewhere too. By now, I would suggest we have enough evidence to suggest that these drugs have been driving much of the most ultra-violent terrorism since 2011, first in Libya, then Syria and Iraq, and that the drug has been steadily provided by agencies within NATO, Saudi Arabia and possibly other sources, from the very start."

from http://21stcenturywire.com/2015/10/30/isis-mayhem-being-fueled-by-saudi-arabia-and-cia-drugs-trafficking/

Offline Palloy

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #81 on: October 30, 2015, 07:33:35 PM »
https://www.rt.com/news/320178-lavrov-syria-vienna-ceasefire/
Vienna talks: 19 global powers to work to establish nationwide Syria ceasefire
30 Oct, 2015

The 19 global and regional powers who have gathered in Vienna have agreed to work towards setting up a nationwide ceasefire in Syria, according to the joint statement.

"One of the most important agreements of today's meeting is that the talks’ participants are asking the UN to gather representatives of the Syrian government and the opposition to begin the political process," Lavrov told a press-conference in Vienna. This political process should provide for all sides to create "an inclusive structure" that will help to prepare a new constitution and hold elections that should be controlled by the UN. All Syrian nationals should be able to take part in the elections, including refugees in other countries, the top Russian diplomat stressed.

Terrorists must not be given a chance to seize power in the country, Russian FM Sergey Lavrov said during a press conference, adding that this understanding is shared by all 19 parties attending the talks. "We have a common enemy, and we must not let this enemy gain power neither in Syria nor in any other state," Lavrov said.

"If a ceasefire is declared, no terrorist organizations should be subjected to it," Russia's Foreign Minister said.
[Palloy: this appears to be a mis-translation]
A comprehensive list of terror groups operating in Syria will be defined during a separate meeting.

    Joint statement, adopted on the results of multilateral meeting on #Syria pic.twitter.com/JPGut7oikR
    — MFA Russia (@mfa_russia) October 30, 2015

Participants of the Vienna talks agreed on the necessity to work on a new constitution in Syria, and to hold elections that should be administered by the UN, Lavrov said. State institutions are to remain intact.

"Russia remains firm on its position that fighting terrorism should be conducted in accordance with the solid basis of international law, whether we are talking about military interventions from air or ground operations, these need to be conducted in agreement with the government or with the UN Security Council," Lavrov said.

Meanwhile, the truce is to be followed by the formation of a transitional government. Earlier reports said that the ceasefire should be achieved within four to six months, but the Russian FM did not confirm the timetable.

The UN is calling for all the countries that have influence on the Syrian government and opposition to try and put them at a negotiating table, the United Nations' special envoy for Syria, Staffan de Mistura said.

Humanitarian access should be provided to all territories in Syria, and help to refugees intensified, the talks’ participants pointed out.

Should Assad go?

The fate of Bashar Assad remained a stumbling block throughout the seven hour meeting.

The US and its allies including Saudi Arabia believe that the Syrian president, whose term expires in 2021, must resign. "There is no way President Assad can unite and govern Syria," US Secretary of State John Kerry said, adding that "Syrians deserve a different choice."

"We can't allow that difference [in views on Assad's fate] to get in the way of the possibility of diplomacy to end the killing and find a solution," the US official said. But added: "Make no mistake: the answer to the Syrian civil war is not found in the military alliance with Assad in our point of view."

Kerry also told the journalists that US is employing a two-part approach in Syria: intensifying the counter-terror campaign and "intensifying our diplomatic efforts in order to end the conflict," adding that both steps are "mutually reinforcing."

US troops will be deployed in northern Syria, Kerry said in Vienna. They "will help to coordinate local ground forces and coalition efforts" in the region. He said that the announcement of Obama's decision to deploy more military forces in the country during talks on peace efforts is "a coincidence," adding that the US is "very proud" of what has already been achieved in Iraq and Syria.

The US and its allies do not demand the immediate resignation as a precondition for peace process anymore, saying Assad can stay in power for months during the period of transition, but insist he must step down when it draws to a close.

At the same time, Russia's Lavrov again stressed that it is up to the Syrian people to make such decisions.

"The Syrian people should define the future of their country... including Assad's fate," Russia's FM added.

As the meeting in Vienna wrapped up it remained unclear how truce and the transitional period are going to be implemented, how long the latter will last, and whether the parties in the Syrian conflict are ready to accept it - as neither Damascus nor the opposition took part in the negotiations. The next round of Vienna talks is scheduled to take place in two weeks.

The civil war has been going on in Syria since 2011, when violent protests erupted as part of the so-called Arab spring. Having seized the vacuum of power, terrorist organization Islamic State (IS, formerly ISIL/ISIS) managed to capture huge territories in Syria and Iraq. On September 30 this year, Russia started a military operation against IS and other terrorist groups in Syria. The US-led coalition has also been fighting terrorists in the region for over a year.

Vienna meeting participants: Russia, the US, Saudi Arabia, Turkey, Iraq, Italy, Egypt, Great Britain, Germany, Lebanon, Qatar, Iran, France, China, the UAE, Jordan, Oman, the EU and the UN.
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Offline RE

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #82 on: October 30, 2015, 07:49:34 PM »
https://www.rt.com/news/320178-lavrov-syria-vienna-ceasefire/
Vienna talks: 19 global powers to work to establish nationwide Syria ceasefire
30 Oct, 2015

The really sad part of this is all these folks are being paid big bucks to sit around a table and jawbone this.  Like anybody could enforce a fucking ceasefire or make sure no "terrorists" get involved in the deal.  They're ALL terrorists!  "Let the Syrian People decide" who will run the country?  Which tribe or sect of "Syrians" are we talking about here?  What about the "Syrians" in Refugee Camps in Turkey?  Can they send in Absentee Ballots?

The stupidity here is just unbelievable.

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Offline Palloy

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #83 on: October 30, 2015, 08:09:49 PM »
Quote
Lavrov: All Syrian nationals should be able to take part in the elections, including refugees in other countries, the top Russian diplomat stressed.

It might be a bit hard, but if there's good will on all sides, it could be done.  What is likely to happen though, is the recalcitrant ones around the table would be shown up for what they are.  It's a dangerous trap for US, Saudi and Turkey.
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Offline RE

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #84 on: October 30, 2015, 08:22:14 PM »
Quote
Lavrov: All Syrian nationals should be able to take part in the elections, including refugees in other countries, the top Russian diplomat stressed.

It might be a bit hard, but if there's good will on all sides, it could be done.  What is likely to happen though, is the recalcitrant ones around the table would be shown up for what they are.  It's a dangerous trap for US, Saudi and Turkey.

Get real.  There's even more factions there than in European Parliaments.  Nobody could form a majority Goobermint or agree on a "Leader" either.  Besides that, they still got no money or access to international credit markets, and no jobs for Syrians besides shooting each other.

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Offline Palloy

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #85 on: October 30, 2015, 09:25:49 PM »
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Get real.  There's even more factions there than in European Parliaments.  Nobody could form a majority Goobermint or agree on a "Leader" either.  Besides that, they still got no money or access to international credit markets, and no jobs for Syrians besides shooting each other.

I think Assad has a clear majority, despite what the MSM might say.  What they all know they need is a strongman with a secular philosophy, and that's what Assad is, (and that was what Saddam was).  If the Syria-Iraq-Iran-Russia bloc is formed, they would all have access to EEU markets and BRICS and AIIB finance.  Given the geostrategic value of the bloc, I guess the fact that Syria is flat broke and out of oil and out of food and in ruins, wouldn't matter so much.  China: we will rebuild your shattered buildings, and all we want in return is a tiny little naval/air base to call our own, and trade.

Anyway, given how pissed off Turkey and Saudi must be at the moment with the US, get ready for black swans there.
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Offline RE

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Putin Makes Obama an Offer He Can’t Refuse
« Reply #86 on: October 31, 2015, 03:02:05 AM »
Capo a Capo.

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http://www.counterpunch.org/2015/10/29/putin-makes-obama-an-offer-he-cant-refuse/

Putin Makes Obama an Offer He Can’t Refuse


<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/SeldwfOwuL8" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/SeldwfOwuL8</a>

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Offline RE

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Syria: Battle for Supply Routes-Logistics (Southfront Video)
« Reply #87 on: October 31, 2015, 03:26:36 AM »
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Offline Surly1

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #88 on: October 31, 2015, 06:04:31 AM »
Hey man, take another hit for NATO and Allah.   

"This recent seizure of amphetamines involving the Saudi prince in Lebanon is simply the latest tell-tale incident. Not very long ago, a reported shipment of around six-million captagon pills were seized, headed for ISIS/ISIL fighters in Syria, and the accusation was being made from multiple sources that NATO itself began production of the drug in a Bulgarian laboratory in 2011 – the very year of the Libyan and Syrian ‘uprisings’ – and that they are now also producing the drug elsewhere too. By now, I would suggest we have enough evidence to suggest that these drugs have been driving much of the most ultra-violent terrorism since 2011, first in Libya, then Syria and Iraq, and that the drug has been steadily provided by agencies within NATO, Saudi Arabia and possibly other sources, from the very start."

from http://21stcenturywire.com/2015/10/30/isis-mayhem-being-fueled-by-saudi-arabia-and-cia-drugs-trafficking/

Somewhere, Oliver North is smiling.
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Offline Surly1

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Re: Syria - Russia - US
« Reply #89 on: October 31, 2015, 07:25:56 AM »
No Survivors After Russian Airplane With 224 On Board Crashes In Egypt's Sinai
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2015-10-31/no-survivors-after-russian-airplane-224-board-crashes-egypts-sinai-peninsula

"According to the airline, the cause of the tragic accident was not human error."


Perhaps two can play the downed airliner game.


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