AuthorTopic: Official EV Carz Thread  (Read 19821 times)

Offline RE

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Official EV Carz Thread
« on: November 25, 2015, 06:08:13 AM »

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/electric-cars-and-the-coal-that-runs-them/2015/11/23/74869240-734b-11e5-ba14-318f8e87a2fc_story.html

Electric cars and the coal that runs them

 By Michael Birnbaum November 23

POWER PLAY | Cheap electricity, a changing climate This is part of a series exploring how the world’s hunger for cheap electricity is complicating efforts to combat climate change.


ROTTERDAM — In this traffic-packed Dutch city, electric cars jostle for space at charging ­stations. The oldest exhaust-spewing vehicles will soon be banned from the city center. Thanks to generous tax incentives, the share of electric vehicles has grown faster in the Netherlands than in nearly any other country in the world.

But behind the green growth is a filthy secret: In a nation famous for its windmills, electricity is coming from a far dirtier source. Three new coal-fired power plants, including two here on the Rotterdam harbor, are supplying much of the power to fuel the Netherlands’ electric-car boom.

As the world tries to reduce greenhouse-gas emissions and combat climate change, policymakers have pinned hopes on electric cars, whose range and convenience are quickly improving. Alongside the boom has come a surging demand for power to charge the vehicles, which can consume as much electricity in a single charge as the average refrigerator does in a month and a half.

The global shift to electric cars has a clear climate benefit in regions that get most of their power from clean sources, such as California or Norway. But in areas supplied by dirtier power, like China, India and even the Netherlands, which is on track to miss ambitious emissions targets set for 2020, the electric-car jump has slimmer payoffs. In some cases, it could even worsen the overall climate impact of driving, experts say.
As the appetite for electricity soars, the world keeps turning to coal


The dilemma highlights the crucial importance of clean electricity in global goals to slash greenhouse-gas emissions, the focus of a December summit in Paris. Cutting transportation-
related emissions can help — but not if pollution is simply shifted from the tailpipes of cars to the smokestacks of coal-fired power plants, which generate 40 percent of the world’s electricity.

Amid revelations that Volkswagen faked the emissions of its supposedly clean diesel cars, even more hopes have been pinned on electric vehicles. Global sales are expected to more than double over the next decade.

“The overall emissions of electricity generation in Europe still haven’t gone down,” said Luc Werring, the former principal adviser to the European Commission on energy issues. “If you drive your car on mixed electricity, then you’re not reducing carbon as much as you’d expect.”
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Driving electric cars, he said, “is not as positive as some would like.”
Embrace of electric

In Rotterdam, city leaders have been searching for ways to cut the smog that has long plagued the gridlocked center, where skyscrapers jostle with low, postwar office blocks. Generous Dutch tax incentives have cut the cost of electric vehicles, and the high cost of gasoline — nearly $7 a gallon — has also spurred more people to buy the cars, making the country second only to Norway in terms of percentage of electric vehicles on the road. Four percent of all cars sold in the Netherlands last year were electric.

And starting next year, Rotterdam will ban from its city center all gasoline cars built before mid-1992 and diesels built before 2001.

Drivers say they appreciate knowing that they’re doing something positive for the environment, even as they contend with having to adopt a new driving style.
Play Video1:46
Why the world still uses coal
Coal is one of the world’s largest sources of greenhouse gas emissions and a major climate change contributor. So why are we still using it? For the same reasons we always have: it’s cheap, plentiful, easy to transport and easy to get. (Jorge Ribas and Julio Negron/The Washington Post)

“You get more relaxed. You don’t want to push down too hard because that will really drain your battery,” said Paul van den Hurk, an electric-vehicle consultant who drives a Nissan Leaf, an electric car with a range of about 85 miles. “You can listen to the music on your stereo because you don’t hear the roar of your engine.”

In many ways, the Netherlands could be an ideal home for electric cars: The country is densely populated and smaller than West Virginia. The best vehicles can now cross the nation on a single charge. Tesla, the California-based manufacturer of high-end electric cars, has made the Netherlands its European beachhead, opening a new factory in the central city of Tilburg in September, where vehicles are assembled for the company’s growing European market.

For now, the plant is putting out 90 vehicles a day, whose prices can run well over $100,000, but it could triple that production rate. In a high-profile endorsement, 200 of the taxis that serve Amsterdam’s airport are now Teslas, and the city wants to convert its entire taxi fleet to electric within the next decade.

But for all the efforts both locally and nationally, the Netherlands will blow past its 2020 emissions targets, the result of the new coal-fired power plants and delays in expanding wind power. Two of the new coal-fired plants are in Rotterdam’s port, where their tall smokestacks belch exhaust across the city.

“People say we are Joe Windmill, but we missed the boat in developing wind energy,” said Jacques de Jong, a former Dutch energy regulator who is now a senior fellow at the Hague-based Clingendael International Energy Program. Dutch authorities are scrambling to catch up, but they face stiff resistance from local residents who dismiss the windmills as unsightly.

Rotterdam’s grid operator says that it faces a challenge with the increase in electric cars, even as it encourages their use. Household electricity demand will rise as the vehicles spread. The amount of electricity the vehicles will need will increase by 50 percent by 2023, according to government projections, although it is still just a fraction of the overall consumption of the country.

Electricity generated from renewable sources is increasing in the Netherlands, but with overall demand for electricity rising, the percentage of coal-generated electricity is staying stubbornly high. Coal provided 29 percent of the country’s electricity last year, and it spiked even higher this year. Dutch government forecasts expect coal to provide about the same amount of electricity in 2030 as it did in 2014.

Amid a surge in U.S. coal exports, the dirtiest fuel is so cheap that it is upending European attempts to switch to cleaner sources of electricity.

“There was a discussion going on to shut down the coal generators, and that’s over. The coal price is too low,” said Marko Kruithof, the manager of sustainability and innovation at Stedin, the grid operator for Rotterdam and much of the region surrounding it.

In Rotterdam, Stedin has helped build thousands of charging points for electric cars. A charge-up for a Tesla costs about $20, and that gives it a 250-mile range. It’s much cheaper than driving a gasoline-powered car.

Proponents believe electric cars are on the verge of a breakthrough that would significantly reduce their cost while extending their range. Chevrolet, Nissan and other manufacturers say they will soon roll out cars that could travel up to 200 miles on a single charge, the distance that many analysts believe is necessary to broaden their appeal beyond a niche market. Tesla, whose cars already exceed that range, plans in 2017 to start producing a model aimed at the mass market that would cost $35,000.
Benefits vary widely

Advocates think that because the vehicles store energy in their batteries, they could one day play a useful role in smoothing out the surges in the grid caused by the increased use of wind and solar energy, which provide electricity only when the sun shines or the wind blows. But those clean-
electricity sources will need to grow simultaneously for the climate impact to be positive.

“In electric vehicles, you cannot decouple the car from the electricity generation,” said Paul Nieuwenhuis, co-director of the Electric Vehicle Center of Excellence at Cardiff University. “If we don’t manage the demand, we would need to build more power stations to deal with it.”

In the United States, where a natural gas boom has helped push down emissions from the power sector, the potential climate benefits of electric cars vary widely depending on the cleanliness of the electricity mix.

In coal-fired Colorado, a gasoline car with fuel economy better than 35 miles per gallon will be better for emissions than the average electric car, according to calculations from the Union of Concerned Scientists. In hydropowered Upstate New York, in contrast, the same gas car would need to achieve 135 miles per gallon. In the Washington region, the figure stands between 63 and 68 miles per gallon.

On average in the United States, at least in major markets, electric cars would offer an improvement on carbon emissions, said Nic Lutsey, program director at the International Council on Clean Transportation. “It seems that on the whole, the carbon footprint will only get better,” he said, because efforts to reduce greenhouse-gas production in electric power plants are moving forward more rapidly than ­electric-car production.

But environmentalists look at other regions with mixed feelings. The biggest market in the world is China. Sales of electric cars nearly tripled there between January and August compared with a year earlier, according to the China Association of Automobile Manufacturers.

Chinese leaders have embraced electric cars as a way of cleaning up cities that have some of the worst air quality in the world. But the Chinese electricity market is heavily dependent on coal; the pollution is simply being taken from the centers of cities and moved to their outskirts.

Amid the mixed picture for electric cars, some environmentalists say that money spent on them might be better directed elsewhere.

“The economics do not make sense to push more electric vehicles onto the market” to improve the climate, said John DeCicco, a professor at the University of Michigan Energy Institute. He said that attention might be better focused on making conventional combustion engines more efficient.

“There’s a movement toward cleaner energy, but it’s not there yet,” said Hugo de Bruijn, a sustainable mobility adviser in Rotterdam. “From an energy perspective, it’s not ideal.”

This article has been updated to reflect newer figures comparing the emissions of gasoline-powered cars and electric cars in various parts of the United States, as compiled by the Union of Concerned Scientists.

Read more from this series:

China confronts the pain of kicking its coal addiction

U.S. exports its greenhouse-gas emissions — as coal. Profitable coal.

India’s huge need for electricity is a problem for the planet

1.3 billion people are living in the dark
Michael Birnbaum is The Post’s Moscow bureau chief. He previously served as the Berlin correspondent and an education reporter.
« Last Edit: January 05, 2016, 01:38:15 AM by RE »
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Offline MKing

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Re: Electric cars and the coal that runs them
« Reply #1 on: November 25, 2015, 10:18:27 AM »
My number, interns of fuel for my EV, is 33% solar and wind. It will do for now, until I get more panels, and as the state continues to build out wind farms. And replaces coal fired plants with natural gas.

I wonder who has the agenda against electric cars, that they need to contrive a bad guy scenario for them?
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Offline RE

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Porsche will sell electric sports car
« Reply #2 on: December 05, 2015, 07:49:28 AM »
Brought to you by Volkswagen, manufacturer of great Diesel cars!  ::)

310 Miles on a charge, and it will charge in 15 minutes!  Wirelessly!  LOL.

Some Battery development is needed.

RE

http://cnnphilippines.com/lifestyle/2015/12/05/Porsche-electric-sports-car.html

Porsche will sell electric sports car




By Peter Valdes-Dapena, CNN Money

Updated 16:40 PM PHT Sat, December 5, 2015
65
The four-door car, which looks like a futuristic version of today's Porsche Panamera, will be able to go 310 miles on a single charge, Porsche has boasted.

NEW YORK (CNNMoney) — Porsche plans to offer an all-electric performance car by the end of the decade. The four-door car, which looks like a futuristic version of today's Porsche Panamera, will be able to go 310 miles on a single charge, Porsche has boasted.

The Mission E was originally unveiled at the Frankfurt Motor Show as a concept car, but the board of Volkswagen Group, Porsche's parent company, has now approved development of the car for factory production. When the car was unveiled in September, a Porsche spokesperson only said that "production of the car would be feasible within the near future."

The car is part of a bigger push by Volkswagen Group into electric vehicles and plug-in hybrids. In all, the group plans to introduce 20 such vehicles by 2020, company executives have said.

It's not clear what the Volkswagen Group diesel scandal will do to those overall plans, however. Volkswagen's sales have plummeted in the U.S. and globally as a result. The company has had to set aside millions of dollars to deal with potential fines and the costs of refitting as many as 11 million diesel cars to meet emissions standards. It will need to recall 500,000 cars in the U.S. alone.

Porsche has said that the Mission E will be able to go from zero to 60 miles an hour in under 3.5 seconds. That figure has already been beaten by some versions of the Telsa Model S, though, which can leap from zero to 60 in under three seconds. The Porsche will also be able to charge wirelessly by parking over a coil embedded in a garage floor.

The car will charge quickly, too, according to Porsche, reaching 80% of a full charge in only 15 minutes, enough to drive 250 miles. Porsche executives have said that more battery development is needed, however. Porsche has not announced anything about the price of the Mission E.

CNNMoney's Alanna Petroff contributed to this report.

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Offline RE

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Electric Car-B-Q
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2016, 10:53:09 AM »
If this is what happens to Elon Musk's Carz, can you imagine what will happen to one of his rockets?  ::)

RE

http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2016-01-01/norwegian-car-b-q-tesla-model-s-bursts-flames-burns-crisp-while-charging

Norwegian Car-B-Q: Tesla Model S Bursts Into Flames, Burns To A Crisp While Charging

Submitted by Tyler Durden on 01/01/2016 12:55 -0500


The Norwegian owner of a Tesla Model S found an unexpected f(i)ringe benefit during a cold Friday afternoon when shortly after he had parked his luxury electric car at a supercharging station in Gjerstad, and left, he realized the car could serve as a very quick and efficient, if quite toxic, source of heating for the cold Scandinavian country, after the Model S spontaneously burst into flames.

Nobody was injured in the incident in which the Tesla unexpectedly started burning, at which point emergency services were alerted.

By the time firefighters arrived, the car was completely ablaze.

As Norway's FVN reports, the fire department could not use water to extinguish the electric car fire, so it just let Tesla burn out completely while dousing it with foam and watching the luxury paperweight burn to a crisp.

FVN adds that the only way to extinguish electric car fire is by using water with a copper material. However, it is too costly for the Norwegian fire departments. There were more f(i)ringe benefits: according to firefighter, Steinar Olsen, it is dangerous to breathe the smoke from the fire because it has fluorine gas in it, and when an electric car burns down the toxic gases emitted are far more dangerous than those from a normal car.

As Jalopnik adds, the Model S has been involved in a handful of documented fires in the past few years, as a result of both crashes and charging, although Tesla has disagreed on the latter cause.

Photos from the scene of the incident courtesy of FVN:








On various previous occasions when a Model S burned down under similar circumstances, the stock price of TSLA reacted accordingly, although it always rebounded after Elon Musk soothed the market's nerves about the "one-time" nature of the Car-B-Q.

However, now that even Consumer Reports yanked its glowing endorsement of the car, the rebound may be delayed especially if the NHTSA finally wakes up and forces Musk to do another recall for a car which unexpectedly combusted just because it was being charged. One thing is certain: a recall "fixing" the battery pack would have a massive price tag attached to it, and it is possible that after years of ignoring the company's cash burn and liquidity, those two "fundamental" drivers of value will finally come back to haunt the market with a vengeance.

In other news, Chinese corporate fraudsters just came up with a new and improved excuse for misplacing their financial records: "we left it in the Tesla as it was charging and everything burned down."
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Offline RE

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Faraday Future unveils Batmobile-like electric concept car at CES
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2016, 01:36:27 AM »
Chinese-backed and their first plant will be in...get this... LAS VEGAS!  HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

This is a sure winner.  Sign me up for some stock in this company.  ::)

RE

http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-faraday-future-ces-20160104-story.html

Faraday Future unveils Batmobile-like electric concept car at CES


Faraday's FFZERO1 concept car was unveiled at CES in Las Vegas. (Faraday)
Andrea ChangAndrea ChangContact Reporter

The wait is over.

Faraday Future, the secretive Chinese-backed Gardena automaker, finally unveiled its first concept car at CES: a sleek, silver-and-black Batmobile-esque electric vehicle called the FFZERO1.

The 1,000-horsepower car was revealed Monday night during a launch event attended by hundreds of media. It can accelerate from zero to 60 in fewer than three seconds, with a top speed of more than 200 miles-per-hour.

Richard Kim, Faraday's head of global design, called the vehicle a "high-performance electric dream car" designed to "fight ugliness."

With its single-seat configuration and, if it ever goes into limited production, almost certain sky-high price tag (executives didn't comment on financials), the FFZERO1 concept car won't become ubiquitous anytime soon.

Nick Sampson, Faraday's senior vice president of research and development and product development, noted that when Faraday does release its first production car to market in a couple of years, it will be something more approachable. The car might be a sedan or maybe an SUV, although he noted that it will start out as a premium product, with a premium price.

Over time, Faraday would like to produce a car that is more affordable, he said.

Although a production vehicle is still a ways out, Faraday has generated significant buzz since its inception 18 months ago. In that time, it has grown to 750 employees worldwide and recently announced that it would build its first manufacturing facility in North Las Vegas.

Faraday will break ground on that site in the next few weeks; when it is completed, it will be 3 million square feet and house 4,500 workers.

Faraday's mission, Sampson said, is "a complete rethink of what mobility means." It wants to bring a speedier, technology-driven focus to car-making modeled after the innovations coming out of Silicon Valley.

"We must anticipate the future and act upon it with speed, decisiveness and a willingness to be more like a technology company rather than an automotive company," Sampson said. "We have a very transformative vision."

The hype surrounding the company has also led to speculation that it could become a real rival to Tesla. Faraday execs appeared to welcome those comparisons, and took a few gentle jabs at the fellow SoCal automaker.

"Tesla and Elon Musk have created something incredible and we should applaud them for it," Sampson, who formerly worked at Tesla, said. But he noted it took Tesla nine years to develop its first mass-market production vehicle, while Faraday is moving at a much faster rate, from rapidly scaling up its workforce to attempting to roll out a car in a couple of years.

And he was quick to point out that Faraday has hired several employees who used to work at Tesla, Apple, Google and BMW.
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Offline agelbert

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Re: Official EV Carz Thread
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2016, 01:10:53 PM »
Chinese-backed and their first plant will be in...get this... LAS VEGAS!  HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!

This is a sure winner.  Sign me up for some stock in this company.  ::)

RE

http://www.latimes.com/business/technology/la-fi-tn-faraday-future-ces-20160104-story.html

Faraday Future unveils Batmobile-like electric concept car at CES


Faraday's FFZERO1 concept car was unveiled at CES in Las Vegas. (Faraday)
Andrea ChangAndrea ChangContact Reporter

The wait is over.

Faraday Future, the secretive Chinese-backed Gardena automaker, finally unveiled its first concept car at CES: a sleek, silver-and-black Batmobile-esque electric vehicle called the FFZERO1.

The 1,000-horsepower car was revealed Monday night during a launch event attended by hundreds of media. It can accelerate from zero to 60 in fewer than three seconds, with a top speed of more than 200 miles-per-hour.

Richard Kim, Faraday's head of global design, called the vehicle a "high-performance electric dream car" designed to "fight ugliness."

With its single-seat configuration and, if it ever goes into limited production, almost certain sky-high price tag (executives didn't comment on financials), the FFZERO1 concept car won't become ubiquitous anytime soon.

Nick Sampson, Faraday's senior vice president of research and development and product development, noted that when Faraday does release its first production car to market in a couple of years, it will be something more approachable. The car might be a sedan or maybe an SUV, although he noted that it will start out as a premium product, with a premium price.

Over time, Faraday would like to produce a car that is more affordable, he said.

Although a production vehicle is still a ways out, Faraday has generated significant buzz since its inception 18 months ago. In that time, it has grown to 750 employees worldwide and recently announced that it would build its first manufacturing facility in North Las Vegas.

Faraday will break ground on that site in the next few weeks; when it is completed, it will be 3 million square feet and house 4,500 workers.

Faraday's mission, Sampson said, is "a complete rethink of what mobility means." It wants to bring a speedier, technology-driven focus to car-making modeled after the innovations coming out of Silicon Valley.

"We must anticipate the future and act upon it with speed, decisiveness and a willingness to be more like a technology company rather than an automotive company," Sampson said. "We have a very transformative vision."

The hype surrounding the company has also led to speculation that it could become a real rival to Tesla. Faraday execs appeared to welcome those comparisons, and took a few gentle jabs at the fellow SoCal automaker.

"Tesla and Elon Musk have created something incredible and we should applaud them for it," Sampson, who formerly worked at Tesla, said. But he noted it took Tesla nine years to develop its first mass-market production vehicle, while Faraday is moving at a much faster rate, from rapidly scaling up its workforce to attempting to roll out a car in a couple of years.

And he was quick to point out that Faraday has hired several employees who used to work at Tesla, Apple, Google and BMW.

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Offline azozeo

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Re: Official EV Carz Thread
« Reply #6 on: January 05, 2016, 01:54:53 PM »
<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/JzVKn6lBsNI&fs=1" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/JzVKn6lBsNI&fs=1</a>
I know exactly what you mean. Let me tell you why you’re here. You’re here because you know something. What you know you can’t explain, but you feel it. You’ve felt it your entire life, that there’s something wrong with the world.
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Offline RE

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How Elon Musk Stole My Car
« Reply #7 on: January 19, 2016, 05:21:04 PM »
How much longer can this snake oil shit go on?

RE

https://www.atlantic.net/blog/how-elon-musk-ceo-of-telsa-motors-stole-my-car/

How Elon Musk Stole My Car

Marty
January 14, 2016 by Marty (1 posts) under Uncategorized
34 Comments
3015

This was my personal experience with Tesla Motors. I’m a fan of what Tesla Motors is trying to accomplish, and hope they get their issues worked out.

 

With a new baby on the way, I was in the market for a new vehicle.  I scheduled a test-drive with Tesla Motors (Tesla) in mid-November, and was on the fence about purchasing a Tesla. I had some questions which I emailed my test-drive consultant, but didn’t receive any response and I wasn’t particularly in love with the car, so I let it go.

A few weeks later, I was talking to a friend of mine who had just leased a Tesla. I explained my experience, and how I felt the price of the car was too high for what it is. While Tesla doesn’t offer discount cars, he explained there is a way to pay less. Tesla has what are referred to as “inventory cars”. These are cars used for test drives, showrooms, as well as loaners. They do have mileage, you have to take them “as is”, and there is no custom configuration. But, if you can find one to your liking you can get a pretty big discount.  He recommended I speak with his Owner Advisor, Kevin, and he connected me with him.

 

Tesla doesn’t have a traditional dealership network; it is pioneering the luxury electric vehicle (EV) segment, and pioneering selling cars without traditional dealerships. That means it operates its service centers, and showrooms itself. By unifying this process it should give a better experience to it customers. Kevin, the Owner Advisor (salesperson) I was referred to, is based out of Tesla HQ in Palo Alto, California.

 

After working with Kevin for a few weeks, I was able to find a car that met my needs in Pasadena, California. On December 24, I placed my order with Kevin by paying $4,000 as a deposit. Kevin assured me that this secured the vehicle for me, and that it was marked as sold and unavailable for anyone else to sell. I followed up with him the next week, and he said they were just trying to find a carrier to ship the car to Florida, and I should begin working with my Delivery Specialists.


(Above, the confirmation screen with VIN of the Tesla Model S Elon Musk is driving)

Tesla has Delivery Orientation Specialists and Delivery Experience Specialists who work to help you through the process of getting the car. In my case, it was Caroline and Chelsea. Caroline explained to me that typically it takes a week to get the car, but because it was late in the year it might take up to two weeks, with the latest delivery date being Jan 8. She also explained that there was no way to get the car by the end of 2015. This made sense, because as a public company, Tesla was striving to meet its delivery commitments to its shareholders. By prioritizing deliveries of cars that could actually be delivered before the end of 2015, they could meet their quotas, and then deliver cars (like mine) early in 2016. Because I wanted to support Tesla, I didn’t think much of anything when I didn’t hear from anyone from that point on.

 

The week of what I thought would be my expected delivery, my electrician was calling to schedule the installation of my additional power receptacle in my garage. We had agreed to do it once I got the car. I began calling my local Tesla location and choosing the “New Vehicle Delivery” option, but it would only ring and go to a voicemail that hadn’t been set up. I called repeatedly and no one would answer. Frustrated, I called and chose the “sales” option and spoke with an representative there that took my message and assured me someone would call me back.  Still, I got no calls back. Since the car was coming by January 8, I was starting to get concerned. I had to coordinate the car, the power installation, disposing of my old car in a sequence of events that I couldn’t start until I knew when I would get the car.

 

By Wednesday, I was emailing my delivery specialist and calling. I didn’t know what was going on. By Thursday I was showing people at work how they don’t answer the phone or respond to my email. I was very concerned that I was paying over $100k for a car, and if this was the new sales process how terrible would the service be? Should I just cancel? How could I cancel if no one would even talk or communicate with me? Was there a problem in transit? Basically, I was stuck and frustrated, plus I had already paid for a deposit which covered the non-refundable transportation cost.

 

Exasperated, I called the local Tesla dealer again. This time, no one answered and my call was transferred to Tesla HQ. The representative asked for the 6-six digits of my vehicle VIN. Tesla offers a “my Tesla” portion of their site that new buyers login in to, to sign electronic paperwork, upload copies of driver’s licenses as well as proof of insurance. In addition, it shows a model of the car and some advice on how to power it. Most importantly, after you make your initial payment, the reservation number for your car is replaced with a VIN (Vehicle Identification Number) which signifies the specific car which is allocated to you. This is done shortly after you send in your initial payment. Therefore, I was able to provide my VIN information to the Tesla representative, who promised me Kevin my original Owner Advisor would call me back.

 

On the evening of January 7, the day before I was to receive my car, Kevin called me to explain he had a call in with the Office of the CEO at Tesla and was working with his team in Tesla to resolve a problem that had come up — their CEO, Elon Musk, had taken my car and was using it as his personal vehicle to test a new version of autopilot. Even worse, he said he could see all the calls I had made into the Orlando delivery center this past week, and no one was taking my calls because no one knew what to do.

 

Tesla logs every in-bound call to their centers, and stores all of this in a national database. This is most likely tied into a CRM (Customer Relationship Management) system, to provide better service. So, for example, Kevin in California saw detailed records of all my attempts to connect with someone in Orlando.  Since no one knew what to do, they were deliberately avoiding taking my calls or communicating with me.

 

I was floored. Not only because my car had been taken by their CEO, not only that no one bothered to reach out or communicate with me, but they were actively trying to avoid me.  I called and reached Kevin again on the evening of Jan 8. He explained my original car was so aftermarket at this point there was no way I would get it. Kevin began suggesting a different car that didn’t match what I was looking for, then suggested another car for $20k more.

 

Frustrated, I called Tesla HQ to complain, and requested to speak to someone in the Office of CEO. The person answering wanted to know why, so I explained the situation and was transferred to a Ms. Kloskey (sp?). As was typical with Tesla, not only did she not answer, her voicemail was full so I couldn’t leave a message. I hung up and called back, and reached a representative who I explained my situation to, and requested escalation to someone who could make things right. The representative took my message, and said he would forward it to the appropriate person.

 

I received a call back from Kevin, who explained he had gotten the memo that I called. Once again, I couldn’t penetrate Tesla’s screening system to find someone who cared, empathized, or treated me like a human. I could only speak with Kevin who was unhappy that they didn’t give me the right experience.

 

Tesla has a strange way of communicating with customers I think is best described as customer service vaporware. That is, they spend more time trying to create the illusion of customer service, rather than actually providing it. There is no mechanism for them to get feedback, as I tried to provide, so its difficult to see how they can improve if they don’t know where they are going wrong.

 

Tesla is pioneering two things at once, (a) a luxury full-EV segment for passenger vehicles, and (b) bypassing the traditional dealer network and selling directly to consumers. Since I never got my car, I can’t speak to (a). But, because (b) is so horribly broken, I don’t think (a) can succeed. My concern is if Tesla fails the experiment of directly selling cars to consumers may be considered a failure, when in reality it was tremendous missteps on Teslas part that caused it to not work. Right now, Tesla ships low volumes of cars to early adopters and ardent enthusiasts who will overlook the organizations short-comings. But I think launching a higher volume (Model 3) sedan later this year with their current organization will be watching a slow-motion train wreck.

 

 

Thought questions for Tesla:

    Why was Elon Musk (CEO of the company) allowed to take a car that was marked in their system as sold?
    When Tesla employees became aware of what happened, why didn’t they reach out to me? How did no one involved think of the customer?
    Even worse, why did Tesla employees actively work to avoid my calls and email?
    If Tesla is logging interactions with their customers (like phone-calls) to a national database, why didn’t they notice that someone was calling in and only getting voicemail. Shouldn’t this be a red-flag, or shouldn’t someone at Telsa HQ be reaching out to find out why/whats going on/why someone keeps calling so often?
    The only person who communicated with me (in the end) was Kevin. At no point did he ever apologize or ask how to make things right. He only communicated he was disappointed and not the experience Tesla wanted to provide. (He did apologize for “handing this incorrectly”, but I think this was in regards to my requesting my money back). What is the escalation policy here?
    I tried three times to communicate with Tesla HQ, the first on their post test-drive e-mail form which they automatically send. I wrote constructive criticism and didn’t get any follow up. As detailed in my experience here, I called the Tesla HQ twice and was unable to reach anyone that cared or could help me.

 

 

In the end, I cancelled my order and Tesla agreed to refund my money. If a tech-savvy $100k car buyer can have this experience, what hope is there for this organization to go mainstream? Tesla is a publicly traded company that loses money. So, strictly speaking, it doesn’t need customers as long as it can fund its losses via Wall Street. In my experience, its a hobby masquerading as a company, and it can probably run as a hobbyist organization for some time. But, at some point, customers will matter, they always do. Hopefully, if this posts reaches the right people in Tesla it will serve as a wake-up call to right their ways before its too late.

 

In 21 years as a founder/CEO of my own company, dealing with Tesla has been the most bizarre and strange experience I’ve had interacting with another organization.

 

Note: There were many other errors, selling me a Ludicrous upgrade which didn’t apply to my car, Tesla endorsed electricians not familiar with Tesla, dual charger availability issues, etc. My experience regarding these issues may have been affected by their employees trying to avoid me.
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Offline MKing

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Re: Official EV Carz Thread
« Reply #8 on: January 19, 2016, 06:49:38 PM »
Buying a Tesla is not necessary. Just run down to your average Ford dealer and skip all the hassles from the newbie car company. And pay 60% less.

Sometimes one creates a dynamic impression by saying something, and sometimes one creates as significant an impression by remaining silent.
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Offline RE

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Back to the Future: The Delorean Rises from the Ashes
« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2016, 12:28:29 AM »
OK, this is not strictly speaking an EV story, but this guy should convert the carz to electric.  Then he could get another goobermint subsidy!

RE

http://www.upi.com/Business_News/2016/01/28/Delorean-car-going-back-into-production/1251453957820/

Delorean car going back into production
By Shawn Price   |   Jan. 28, 2016 at 1:28 AM


The famed Delorean car will be coming back into production for the first time since 1982 and will be made in the U.S., the company's CEO said. The first cars are expected to roll off the production line in 2017. Photo by Irina Afonskaya/Shutterstock.

HOUSTON, Jan. 28 (UPI) -- The famous Delorean car will soon be back in production and made on U.S. soil, the company CEO said.

The car's revival was bought to life by the "low volume manufacturing bill" just passed in congress for the now-Texas-based company. It will be the first time the car -- often viewed as the time machine in the Back to the Future movies -- will be produced since 1982.

Delorean Motor Company CEO Stephen Wynne told Houston TV station KPRC "It's fantastic! It is a game changer for us. We've been wanting this to happen. It means we're back as a car company again."

Wynne is a mechanic who specializes in Deloreans, and since buying the rights to the defunct company in 1995, has sold parts and refurbished models from his Humble, Texas shop.

The original car was made in Northern Ireland from 1976 to 1982, but these "new" Deloreans will be the first manufactured in the United States. And Wynne intends to keep the iconic look, gull-wing doors included.

"There's no reason to change the appearance of the car," he told KPRC. "As we go into the program, we'll decide what areas need to be freshened up."

His refurbished models cost between $45,000-$55,000. But the "new" models will probably sell for just under $100,000 depending on the engine used.

Wynne plans to produce about 300 cars, rolling out one car a week beginning in early 2017.
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Offline RE

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Aston-Martin produces the next Bond, James Bond 007 Car
« Reply #10 on: January 28, 2016, 12:48:46 AM »
This is getting ridiculous.

RE ::)

http://www.slashgear.com/watch-2-4-million-aston-martin-vulcans-fiery-wrath-27424553/

« Last Edit: January 28, 2016, 12:54:54 AM by RE »
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Offline RE

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Is this the Moment of Truth for Elon Musk?
« Reply #11 on: March 28, 2016, 06:31:12 AM »
Prediction:

EPIC FAIL!

RE

http://qz.com/648506/after-the-tesla-model-3-launches-this-week-the-world-will-know-if-elon-musk-called-the-electric-car-future-correctly/?utm_source=YPL

After the Tesla Model 3 launches this week, the world will know if Elon Musk called the electric-car future correctly


Written by
Steve LeVine

It is Elon Musk’s moment of truth.

Over the last dozen years, the serial entrepreneur and inventor has built a buzzing fervor from Wall Street to Silicon Valley by accomplishing the improbable—erecting a globe-spanning automobile company from scratch. His Tesla Motors is the only such success in at least a half-century. In that time, scores of automaking ventures with global ambition have brightly launched, only to stall, fail, and, in the best cases, get picked over at pennies on the dollar. Tesla is still going, though, stylishly and single-handedly validating the commerciality of electric cars along the way.

Only, this achievement isn’t what drove Musk into autos. Back in 2004, when he became Tesla’s primary investor and chairman, his objective wasn’t to build cool cars, or even cool electric cars. It was to trigger the birth of a new, mainstream industry—to bring electric cars to the masses. Musk saw and continues to see electrics as a crucial part of a solution to climate change.

Despite being chronically late to deliver his cars, Musk has attracted a fanatical base of owners: mainly rich, green-minded clients who wish to make a statement, whether politically, aesthetically, or both. It’s a decidedly limited group. Last year, Tesla sold about 51,000 cars. Musk hopes to deliver another 93,000 vehicles this year, which, while an impressive jump, isn’t quite there if you’re thinking like a big carmaker: It would equal a mere 4% of the approximately 1.9 million cars sold in 2015 by both BMW and Mercedes, elegant brands that Musk regards as his true competition. It is not an industry, and Musk knows it....

read the rest at quartz
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Offline RE

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The Wheelz are Falling Off the EV Bus: Unsafe at any Voltage
« Reply #12 on: June 10, 2016, 07:41:53 PM »
More bad press for Snake Oil Salesman Elon Musk.  WTF is going to buy one of these pieces of shit?


RE

http://www.nytimes.com/2016/06/11/business/tesla-motors-model-s-suspension.html?_r=0

For Tesla Owner, Losing a Wheel Was Just the First Surprise

By NEAL E. BOUDETTE and ANNALYN KURTZJUNE 10, 2016


A Tesla Model S. Tesla said any suggestion that it was trying to keep owners from reporting safety problems “is preposterous.” Credit Michael Nagle for The New York Times

Pete Cordaro was creeping down a dirt road in his 2013 Tesla Model S electric car, on a Sunday outing with his wife to hunt mushrooms in the Pennsylvania woods, when he encountered a pothole and then heard a loud crack.

“The front of the car just dropped,” he said. “The left front wheel just detached from the car.”

When Tesla picked up his car, Mr. Cordaro was at first told he would have to pay for the repairs because they were from normal wear. After pressing his case with a Tesla manager, he was told the company would pay part of the cost — as long as he signed a nondisclosure agreement.

Neither the equipment breakdown nor the confidentiality demand turned out to be an isolated case. And now they have Tesla Motors on the defensive.

After the nation’s top auto safety regulator raised questions about reports of suspension problems with the Model S, Tesla declared in a blog post on Friday that the suspension system had no safety defects. But what set the case apart from other auto safety episodes was the introduction of a nondisclosure agreement into the relationship between car owner and automaker — an unusual practice by an unconventional company whose founder, Elon Musk, has roots in Silicon Valley, not Detroit.

The company acknowledged having had car owners sign such agreements, and said it did so to protect itself from potential lawsuits after performing a repair at a discount or at no charge.

But the practice has raised concerns that it could prevent owners from reporting safety problems to the National Highway Traffic Safety Administration, which called Tesla’s use of such agreements “troublesome,” and told the company not to use terms that dissuade people from reporting safety concerns to the agency.
Continue reading the main story
Related Coverage

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On Friday, a Tesla spokeswoman said in an email that “to remove any doubt,” the automaker would modify the language of the documents to make clear that the goal “is to benefit customers, while not harming us for doing a good deed.” She did not elaborate on how it would be changed.

The safety agency said in a statement that the changes were satisfactory, without elaborating. It described its review of the Model S suspension as “a routine data collection,” adding that it had not found any safety issues so far and that Tesla was cooperating.

In agreements like the one Mr. Cordaro signed, Tesla refers to the repairs as a “gesture of good will,” made without “any admission of liability or wrongdoing or acceptance of any facts.”

That statement alone is uncontroversial. It is standard legalese protecting Tesla from admitting any wrongdoing by way of making a repair, said David Vladeck, a law professor at Georgetown University and a former director of the Federal Trade Commission’s Bureau of Consumer Protection.

But he said two other provisions in the contract were problematic in that they seemed to muzzle consumers: asking car owners to waive the right to future legal action and to keep the entire incident confidential.

“You agree to keep confidential our provision of the good will, the terms of this agreement and the incidents or claims leading or related to our provision of the good will,” the Tesla document said.

Tesla said it was “preposterous” to suggest that it was trying to prevent owners from reporting safety problems to N.H.T.S.A. or any other government agency. But Mr. Vladeck said that distinction was unimportant. “Most reasonable consumers would interpret this as a provision prohibiting them from talking to anyone, including government or lawyers or anybody else,” he said.

Tesla was founded in 2003 with the idea of establishing battery-powered cars as a viable emissions-free replacement for the internal combustion engine, and challenging many auto industry conventions. It sells cars directly to customers without franchised dealers, a practice that has led to legal battles in several states.

The company is also building a gigantic battery factory in Nevada and often announces news in Twitter posts by Mr. Musk.

The use of nondisclosure agreements with customers appears to be highly unusual in the auto industry. Ford, General Motors and Toyota all said they did not have customers sign confidentiality agreements in exchange for fixing cars that have broken down.

Joan Claybrook, a former head of N.H.T.S.A., said requiring customers to keep quiet about repairs aroused suspicion. “I don’t know why they’d do that,” she said. “It makes it seem like they want to cover something up.”

Representative Leonard Lance, Republican of New Jersey, introduced legislation in Congress in April that would prevent companies from including nondisclosure clauses in consumer contracts. California, where Tesla is based, enacted a similar law in 2014.

News of Mr. Cordaro’s breakdown and the nondisclosure agreement he signed was trumpeted by auto bloggers tracking suspension problems in the Model S, a luxury sedan whose pricing starts at about $70,000.

The N.H.T.S.A. website lists 33 complaints received since October about suspension failures in the car, Tesla’s top-selling model.

Mr. Cordaro, an auto enthusiast who used to make hot rod cars, said Friday that he did not think the agreement barred him from talking to the safety agency or anyone else about the breakdown his car suffered in late April. When he reviewed it, Mr. Cordaro concluded that “it was basically toothless,” he said. “It only keeps me from talking about the costs and filing a lawsuit.”

In fact, he posted a short video on YouTube showing the broken ball joint from his car.
Tesla failed control arm and ball joint Video by Pete Cordaro

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/DgdKZMlzQog" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/DgdKZMlzQog</a>

Once his car was repaired and returned, he filed details of his suspension issue with the safety agency, and a few weeks later got the broken ball joint from Tesla and sent it on to N.H.T.S.A.

But he was nevertheless upset with how Tesla has dealt with what he thinks could pose a serious safety concern. “If it had happened on the highway, it could have been catastrophic,” Mr. Cordaro, 61, said by phone while driving his Model S.

The owner of a vending machine company in Connellsville, Pa., about 50 miles southeast of Pittsburgh, he said he was a Tesla fan and had already put down deposits to buy two Model 3 compacts when they come out in a year or so. “I just want them to look into this and do the right thing,” he said.

Mr. Cordaro said he was further annoyed because Tesla, in its blog post about the Model S suspension and confidentiality agreements, suggested his breakdown had resulted from hard driving.

The company said he lived on a long dirt road and noted that his car was “caked with mud” when it was picked up — information that Mr. Cordaro called “a fabrication.”

“I wasn’t out four-wheeling in the car,” he said. “I live on an asphalt road and have maybe driven on dirt roads 10 times.”

A Tesla spokeswoman said the company was looking into the matter.
« Last Edit: June 10, 2016, 10:33:46 PM by RE »
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Offline RE

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Elon Borrows some MOAR
« Reply #13 on: September 01, 2016, 01:02:10 AM »
I WANT one of those credit cards!  I am sure I could do better with SUN☼ than Elon is doing with Tesla!   ::)

RE

Tesla plans to raise funds this year to tackle cash crunch


People visit a Tesla Model S car during the Auto China 2016 in Beijing, China, April 25, 2016. REUTERS/Jason Lee/File Photo
By Paul Lienert

Facing a severe cash crunch, Tesla Motors Inc plans to raise additional money this year to help fund development and production of its new Model 3 sedan and build out a massive battery factory, the company said on Wednesday.

The electric carmaker plans to raise money through an equity or debt offering, it said in a filing with the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission. Some of that money could also support Tesla's planned acquisition of its money-losing sister company, SolarCity Corp.

Tesla Chief Executive Officer Elon Musk had warned the combined companies might need "a small equity capital raise" in 2017. Musk is the major shareholder in both firms.
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Tesla's cash situation has taken on additional urgency with the $2.6 billion SolarCity deal announced on Aug. 1.

Musk also said on Wednesday that Tesla plans to release an update of its partly automated self-driving system "in a few weeks." U.S. regulators are probing a May 7 fatality in Florida in which a driver using Tesla's Autopilot system crashed into a truck.

The timing of the SEC filing on Tesla's fundraising plans "reinforces the need for SolarCity to have quick access to capital," Barclays analyst Brian Johnson said.

The document also disclosed that Musk discussed a potential Tesla-SolarCity merger in February with SolarCity's CEO, Lyndon Rive, who is also Musk's cousin. At a subsequent special meeting on Feb. 29, the Tesla board rejected a proposal to evaluate a merger, according to the filing. On May 31, the Tesla board changed course and decided to pursue the merger.

In the meantime, Tesla's cash position has deteriorated, despite a $1.7 billion equity raise on May 19.

Earlier this month, Tesla said it closed the second quarter with nearly $3.25 billion in cash, but in July it repaid $678 million on a revolving credit line and planned to redeem $422 million in convertible notes.
Also In Technology News

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    Samsung shares hit over Galaxy Note delays, battery explosion claims

That would leave the company with $2.15 billion in cash. But it also told analysts earlier this year it planned to spend $1.75 billion in the second half on plants and equipment, primarily to get the $35,000 Model 3 ready for production next year and finish construction at the Reno, Nevada, "gigafactory."

As a result, Tesla would have around $400 million in cash at a time when both Tesla and SolarCity have been burning through cash.

Tesla has posted operating losses in 14 straight quarters and negative cash flow since early 2014.

(Reporting by Paul Lienert in Detroit; Editing by Jeffrey Benkoe and Matthew Lewis)
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Offline RE

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Low Budget Chinese Elon Musk not doing too good
« Reply #14 on: November 15, 2016, 06:50:48 PM »
http://www.ccenterdispatch.com/news/state/article_e4b40fb2-6fda-551c-83d1-fa2335ed1d85.html

 Work stops at electric-car factory site outside Las Vegas

Posted: Tuesday, November 15, 2016 5:37 pm | Updated: 6:46 pm, Tue Nov 15, 2016.

Associated Press | 0 comments

LAS VEGAS (AP) — Work has been suspended at a site outside Las Vegas where Nevada has pledged up to $335 million worth of incentives to an upstart electric car company that promises to have a vehicle still on the drawing board rolling off a new $1 billion assembly line in 2018.

The idling of the Faraday Future project at the Apex Industrial Park site in North Las Vegas was characterized by company spokesman Ezekiel Wheeler as a "temporary adjustment, or a work stop."
CCBA1115

Wheeler said hitting pause will let the company direct money and attention to developing the concept car it wants to present at the big Consumer Electronics Show in Las Vegas in January.

"Our refocusing is to ensure we bring a cutting-edge vehicle to a very dated system ... and show the world what we're capable of," Wheeler said.

"We want to fully fulfill our promise to the state of Nevada" for the 3 million-square-foot facility, he added.

The contractor, industrial construction firm AECOM, said it has completed grading and foundation work, and it expects the go-ahead to resume construction next year.

"At this time, Faraday Future is temporarily adjusting their construction schedule with plans to resume in early 2017," AECOM spokesman Brendan Ranson-Walsh said in an email statement. "We remain fully committed to our client and our employees working on this project, and we look forward to the facility's successful delivery."

Gov. Brian Sandoval called Nevada lawmakers to a special Legislative session 11 months ago to approve $215 million in tax breaks and $120 million in infrastructure improvements to attract Gardena, California-based Faraday Future to the North Las Vegas site.

In a statement, Steve Hill, chief of the Governor's Office of Economic Development, vowed Tuesday that the state will be protected "in the event the full factory does not open to produce and sell cars."

"Faraday Future does not earn abatements until they have invested $1 billion on the site," Hill said, and the state won't issue bonds to fund infrastructure until the company "provides security equal to the amount of the bonds."

Bond funding isn't expected to occur until next at least September, Hill added, and it will need approval by the state Board of Finance. The five-member board is chaired by the governor and includes state Treasurer Dan Schwartz, Controller Ron Knecht and two appointed members.

Schwartz has been a critic from the start of the Faraday Future project relying on what he called "financing by a mysterious Chinese billionaire for a project in a financially challenged municipality."

Schwartz said he remains skeptical the project will succeed. "I think he's out of money," Schwartz said of Chinese entrepreneur Jia Yueting, the financial backer of the electric car effort.

Wheeler and Hill each acknowledged that Jia has faced questions about the sustainability of a swift business expansion aimed at attracting U.S. customers. One of Jia's Chinese companies, LeEco, unveiled a sleek smartphone last month to compete with Apple's latest iPhone and Google's Pixel phone.

In July, LeEco announced it was buying Vizio, a leading North American brand for smart TV and sound bar sales.

"We understand his rapid growth ... (and) questions about overexpansion and cash issues," Wheeler said.

But Hill, the Faraday Future official, insisted the electric car project is a top Jia priority. "LeEco has announced that it will become more disciplined in the management of its enterprises," he said.
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