AuthorTopic: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature  (Read 7429 times)

Offline azozeo

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #15 on: June 20, 2016, 04:51:35 PM »
That blue turquoise is nickel, the green is copper. People wear copper bracelets for their energetic properties.
It must help with the balancing of the natural torroidal fields wizzing around our bodies.
One of the walls in my mine has feldspar (orange turquoise).

Here's a link to the local mine owners here in No. Az. that deal in turquoise sales.


http://www.colbaugh.net/aboutus.html

I know exactly what you mean. Let me tell you why youíre here. Youíre here because you know something. What you know you canít explain, but you feel it. Youíve felt it your entire life, that thereís something wrong with the world.
You donít know what it is but its there, like a splinter in your mind

Offline Ashvin

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #16 on: June 20, 2016, 08:29:58 PM »
Fair Warning Ashvin .....

I will blanket you like chem-trails to a Nibiru sunset    :evil4:

Bring a lunch bucket, it's game on. Feel free to bring Anu with you.

A Spiritual/Philosophical Debate!  We haven't had one of those in AGES!   :icon_sunny:

This could be fun!  Maybe Ka will emerge from Lurkerville!

RE

Well I already told AZ that I won't entertain unsupported or thoroughly debunked speculation as evidence, so sorry to let you down :-\ ... nothing to debate here. The Annunaki and Nibiru fall into the thoroughly debunked category, pretty sure I have posted on this a few times before.

And I know Ka would have nothing to do with that nonsense either...

I got the impression he would be debating Hopi traditions.  Are they unsupported and/or debunked?

RE

I don't even understand what his argument is or how Hopi traditions fit into it. Do you?

I thought, if anything, the debate would be physicalism and naturalism vs. theism... Az made the claim that physics can explain everything. Can anyone elaborate on how any of his subsequent posts relate to that claim? I'm really curious.

Offline RE

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #17 on: June 21, 2016, 12:48:56 AM »

I don't even understand what his argument is or how Hopi traditions fit into it. Do you?

I figured that would be clarified in the course of the debate.

Quote
I thought, if anything, the debate would be physicalism and naturalism vs. theism... Az made the claim that physics can explain everything. Can anyone elaborate on how any of his subsequent posts relate to that claim? I'm really curious.

Subsequent posting so far seem to be mainly a pissing contest between the two of you.

Hopefully, we can now get down to the bizness of substantive argument.

RE
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Offline azozeo

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #18 on: June 21, 2016, 10:44:51 AM »

I don't even understand what his argument is or how Hopi traditions fit into it. Do you?

I figured that would be clarified in the course of the debate.

Quote
I thought, if anything, the debate would be physicalism and naturalism vs. theism... Az made the claim that physics can explain everything. Can anyone elaborate on how any of his subsequent posts relate to that claim? I'm really curious.

Subsequent posting so far seem to be mainly a pissing contest between the two of you.

Hopefully, we can now get down to the bizness of substantive argument.

RE

The poster asked a straight forward question.
I gave him the 2 oldest pieces of data available. The Hopi's passed down the knowledge
orally until the book was written in the early 1900's.
The cuneiform knowledge goes back to ancient Egypt.
What did I get for a response. "Bile"

I know exactly what you mean. Let me tell you why youíre here. Youíre here because you know something. What you know you canít explain, but you feel it. Youíve felt it your entire life, that thereís something wrong with the world.
You donít know what it is but its there, like a splinter in your mind

Offline Ashvin

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #19 on: June 21, 2016, 12:58:54 PM »

I don't even understand what his argument is or how Hopi traditions fit into it. Do you?

I figured that would be clarified in the course of the debate.

Quote
I thought, if anything, the debate would be physicalism and naturalism vs. theism... Az made the claim that physics can explain everything. Can anyone elaborate on how any of his subsequent posts relate to that claim? I'm really curious.

Subsequent posting so far seem to be mainly a pissing contest between the two of you.

Hopefully, we can now get down to the bizness of substantive argument.

RE
myster
The poster asked a straight forward question.
I gave him the 2 oldest pieces of data available. The Hopi's passed down the knowledge
orally until the book was written in the early 1900's.
The cuneiform knowledge goes back to ancient Egypt.
What did I get for a response. "Bile"

They passed down WHAT knowledge? Why are your comments always as vague, indirect and mysterious (not in a good way) as they can be?

I have no problem saying some Hopi traditions could, and most likely do, contain accurate information about reality. Please tell me how that supports your naturalist worldview.

Offline agelbert

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #20 on: June 21, 2016, 01:03:17 PM »

I don't even understand what his argument is or how Hopi traditions fit into it. Do you?

I figured that would be clarified in the course of the debate.

Quote
I thought, if anything, the debate would be physicalism and naturalism vs. theism... Az made the claim that physics can explain everything. Can anyone elaborate on how any of his subsequent posts relate to that claim? I'm really curious.

Subsequent posting so far seem to be mainly a pissing contest between the two of you.

Hopefully, we can now get down to the bizness of substantive argument.

RE

The poster asked a straight forward question.
I gave him the 2 oldest pieces of data available. The Hopi's passed down the knowledge
orally until the book was written in the early 1900's.
The cuneiform knowledge goes back to ancient Egypt.
What did I get for a response. "Bile"

That, my friend, is, considering your debating opponent's methodology, par for the course.


Lawyers NEVER give ANYONE the benefit of the doubt. Lawyers ALWAYS deny responsibility for deliberately attempting to position a debating opponent as one to be scorned, derided and dismissed by any intelligent, reasonable, prudent (etc. you get the idea  ;)) person.

But that's what they are trained to do. And they LIKE doing it.


And of course, they question the mental health of anyone that claims they are trying to game the discourse with bullshit. Don't you know, only a madman or an irrational zealot would question the integrity and credibility of a lawyer...  :evil4:


George Orwell understood lawyerspeak quite well. 
« Last Edit: June 21, 2016, 01:05:48 PM by agelbert »
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
Faith,
if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

Offline Ashvin

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #21 on: June 21, 2016, 01:17:31 PM »
Lawyers also know when someone is trying to avoid the substantive issues and distract from them because they have no arguments. Read the title of this thread, and then tell me how AZ has posted anything related to it, except his first statement that "there is only one set of rules - physics".

Also, how about showing a little intellectual honesty and backbone and telling your pal AZ that you completely disagree with his naturalist worldview. That is if you haven't already given up core Christian theology for ET conspiracy theories and Planet X annihilation any-day-now predictions.

Offline azozeo

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #22 on: June 21, 2016, 01:53:16 PM »
Lawyers also know when someone is trying to avoid the substantive issues and distract from them because they have no arguments. Read the title of this thread, and then tell me how AZ has posted anything related to it, except his first statement that "there is only one set of rules - physics".

Also, how about showing a little intellectual honesty and backbone and telling your pal AZ that you completely disagree with his naturalist worldview. That is if you haven't already given up core Christian theology for ET conspiracy theories and Planet X annihilation any-day-now predictions.


You're ass ought to be locked up for "steering" !
It's illegal in the real estate practice & I know damn good & well it's illegal in kangaroo court shipboard/commerce law as well.
Within 3 posts of this relic of a thread you've put words in KA's mouth & now you're doing it again.

You're buggywhip era view points are crumbling.

Oh & I'm glad you believe in celestial annihilation, you reap what you sew Ashvin ...
I know exactly what you mean. Let me tell you why youíre here. Youíre here because you know something. What you know you canít explain, but you feel it. Youíve felt it your entire life, that thereís something wrong with the world.
You donít know what it is but its there, like a splinter in your mind

Offline jdwheeler42

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #23 on: June 21, 2016, 02:02:59 PM »
Lawyers also know when someone is trying to avoid the substantive issues and distract from them because they have no arguments. Read the title of this thread, and then tell me how AZ has posted anything related to it, except his first statement that "there is only one set of rules - physics".

Also, how about showing a little intellectual honesty and backbone and telling your pal AZ that you completely disagree with his naturalist worldview. That is if you haven't already given up core Christian theology for ET conspiracy theories and Planet X annihilation any-day-now predictions.
LOL... was that this thread?  I don't read threads, as a rule I read messages in the "Most Recent 100" view, so I only respond to the parts of the thread that are quoted in a particular message.  Heck, I don't even know if this comment is directed at me, but I'll answer it anyway.

I don't completely disagree with AZ's naturalistic worldview, I only fundamentally disagree with it.  Kind of like with how when once you understand and accept General Relativity, you realize that Newtonian Mechanics isn't exactly true anyplace in the universe -- but it's close enough most of the time.  Like with evolution: I believe in the fact of macroevolution, but from my perspective it is the tool God uses to create new species.  My worldview is big enough to encompass both Jesus and little green men.
Making pigs fly is easy... that is, of course, after you have built the catapult....

Offline RE

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #24 on: June 21, 2016, 02:29:23 PM »
My worldview is big enough to encompass both Jesus and little green men.

I hope you have a nice cushion for your asshole sitting on that fence.  :icon_mrgreen:

RE
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Offline azozeo

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #25 on: June 21, 2016, 03:36:57 PM »
Ashvin,
I haven't avoided jack squat.

1) I toke your physicists nonsense & shoved it back in your face with Gary Holz remarkable self cure of MS.
2) I showed you in the Holy Bible where that is physics & not groveling to an 8ft. White Lizard God named Jehovah.
3) The best you've offered is a tin foil hat based brush off.
4) You're paid 10's of thousands of dollars to debate ship board bullshit & the best you have to offer the diner is...........
(high hat nigel)                           


That's right ! nothing
I know exactly what you mean. Let me tell you why youíre here. Youíre here because you know something. What you know you canít explain, but you feel it. Youíve felt it your entire life, that thereís something wrong with the world.
You donít know what it is but its there, like a splinter in your mind

Offline agelbert

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #26 on: June 21, 2016, 03:46:31 PM »
Lawyers also know when someone is trying to avoid the substantive issues and distract from them because they have no arguments. Read the title of this thread, and then tell me how AZ has posted anything related to it, except his first statement that "there is only one set of rules - physics".

Also, how about showing a little intellectual honesty and backbone and telling your pal AZ that you completely disagree with his naturalist worldview. That is if you haven't already given up core Christian theology for ET conspiracy theories and Planet X annihilation any-day-now predictions.
LOL... was that this thread?  I don't read threads, as a rule I read messages in the "Most Recent 100" view, so I only respond to the parts of the thread that are quoted in a particular message.  Heck, I don't even know if this comment is directed at me, but I'll answer it anyway.

I don't completely disagree with AZ's naturalistic worldview, I only fundamentally disagree with it.  Kind of like with how when once you understand and accept General Relativity, you realize that Newtonian Mechanics isn't exactly true anyplace in the universe -- but it's close enough most of the time.  Like with evolution: I believe in the fact of macroevolution, but from my perspective it is the tool God uses to create new species.  My worldview is big enough to encompass both Jesus and little green men.

Jd,
I recommend you take a step back and analyze the nature of the post by learned counsel more closely. Since I am a "paranoid whacko" (and that post came RIGHT AFTER MY post), I suspect that it was directed at me in a clever goal post moving, attack the messenger type of fallacious debating technique, RATHER than addressing the issue of empathy deficit disordered sophistry.

To those who will claim, no doubt, that sophistry is not germane to the debate here, I beg to differ.

The POINT Az was trying to make was that he was rewarded with BILE. I explained, in my post, that attacking the validity of an opponent's allegations is what lawyers DO. But when they see that their methodology is being exposed, they then attack anyone trying to expose it by attempting to sidestep the attack the messenger bullshit they are engaging in with claims of the new poster's hypocrisy.

This is most clever. It steers the thread away from the Machiavellian dismissal of Az's discussion of Hopi prophesies (etc.) to an attempt to silence anyone, like me, who disagrees with some of Az's beliefs, but agrees with the importance of taking seriously the validity of the scholarship on Hopi prophesies and anything else Az says.

Any charge of using unethical debating sophistry can also be countered with sophistry. That is the "beauty" of being an accomplished goal post mover. The previous paragraph can be parsed into sections with witty remarks like "Projection here", "Paranoia over here", "hypersensitivity there", "I never said that" AND, "where do you get this stuff?". All those remarks are MORE attack the messenger type verbal guided missiles that continue to serve the main purpose of the sophist; that is, to avoid treating the opponent as a credible person, that whether they are right or wrong, must be given respect.

The sophist will vociferously deny the above charge and claim they consistently provide all debating opponents with respect, as is their Christian duty. They will ask for a record of examples of their alleged "lack of respect". They claim these charges are ridiculous. When a detailed and irrefutable list is not quickly produced, they accuse the accusers of being out to lunch.

If that doesn't work, a clever sophist, when faced with a group of people pointing out his sophistry, will claim he is being unfairly victimized and refuse to continue the discussion. He will pick up his marbles and go home because level verbal playing fields are not something sophists are fond of.

The legal "profession" was founded on sophistry (lawyers will vociferously deny this and claim it's all about providing the wonderful legal system we "enjoy today" that evolved from "humble beginnings"  ). The Sophists claimed that any side of an argument could be won, if argued "effectively" (regardless of whether it is true or not). Lawyers are about wining arguments.

Ashvin is a lawyer.


Obviously, the above cartoonish representation of bats debating has nothing to do with bats. Bats, due to their fondness for fruit, do not engage in fruitless debates.  ;D
Leges         Sine    Moribus      Vanae   
Faith,
if it has not works, is dead, being alone.

Offline azozeo

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #27 on: June 21, 2016, 04:21:53 PM »
A stellar performance maestro  :icon_sunny:      AG  :emthup:
I know exactly what you mean. Let me tell you why youíre here. Youíre here because you know something. What you know you canít explain, but you feel it. Youíve felt it your entire life, that thereís something wrong with the world.
You donít know what it is but its there, like a splinter in your mind

Offline RE

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #28 on: June 21, 2016, 04:38:19 PM »
Play-by-Play call of the debate so far...

We haven't yet addressed the subject matter of Hopi philosophy.
Opponents are sparring on the meta-topic of sophistry in argument,
AZ has been denigrated as being clothed in Tin Foil.
Watson is accused of Sophistry.
Lawyers as a class have been denigrated as scumbags.


Awaiting Round 4.  No knockouts yet.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/JZEIMQ42-oU" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/JZEIMQ42-oU</a>

RE
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Offline azozeo

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Re: Godless Universe: A Physicist Searches for Meaning in Nature
« Reply #29 on: June 21, 2016, 04:52:07 PM »
Yes,
Let's get back to Ashvin completing his thoughts on naturalist Hopi's ...
I know exactly what you mean. Let me tell you why youíre here. Youíre here because you know something. What you know you canít explain, but you feel it. Youíve felt it your entire life, that thereís something wrong with the world.
You donít know what it is but its there, like a splinter in your mind

 

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