AuthorTopic: Civilization and Collapse  (Read 1554 times)

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Civilization and Collapse
« on: February 13, 2017, 05:44:23 AM »


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Published on Momentum Institute on Fenruary  11, 2017






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Offline RE

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David Korowicz Resurfaces!
« Reply #1 on: February 13, 2017, 05:49:14 AM »
David was one of the first Podcasts Monsta and I did on Soundcloud.  He's the guy that wrote the long papers on Tipping Points and Financial Cross Contagion.  He's a Theoretical Physicist.

Great talker, Irishman with the Gift of the Blarney.

RE
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Offline Farmer McGregor

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Re: Civilization and Collapse
« Reply #2 on: February 13, 2017, 09:22:21 PM »
Quote
For millennia, life was food insecure, with low surpluses and low population density. But nowadays, there are far more people, who buy their daily bread in supermarkets, with trucks, energy, packaging, etc. We donít know every connection of the highly complex and interdependent system which is behind. This system is very opaque, and fast speed, with very high level of coordination.


Interesting stuff.  Immediately brings to mind two books.  The first, Joel Salatin's Folks This Ain't Normal wherein he discusses how less than a hundred years ago you could walk into any town or village and ask "Where's the food?" and you would be shown into the pantry, the root cellar, the larder (few folks even know that word these days) and maybe get directed out into the yard or pasture where some of the food was still walking around.  Ask that question in any town in this country today -- including farm towns and even homes on farms! -- and you'll be sent to the local supermarket.  As Joel says, folks, this ain't normal!

Book two: The End Of Food by Paul Roberts.  This book is right on with the article quote that begins this response.  The industrial food system in this nation is far more precarious than people realize.  Fuel disruptions like the ones us old farts remember back in the 70's could quickly leave grocery stores empty.  Shoot, we've had snowstorms that shut down the interstate highways into our area for a few days that resulted in depleted grocery stocks.

Re-localization of food production ought to be a national priority on the level of the Manhattan Project.  Our effort to provide electric vehicles, bunkers, alternative energy systems and all the other cool toys on our doomsteads becomes fairly pointless if we are starving.  The importance of securing a stable, reliable local food supply is paramount.
For years we have let ourselves believe that as long as we have money we will have food. This is a mistake. The government will bring forth no food by providing hundreds of billions of dollars to the agribusiness industry.  --Wendell Berry after the 2008 crash

Offline RE

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Re: Civilization and Collapse
« Reply #3 on: February 13, 2017, 09:40:08 PM »
Quote
For millennia, life was food insecure, with low surpluses and low population density. But nowadays, there are far more people, who buy their daily bread in supermarkets, with trucks, energy, packaging, etc. We donít know every connection of the highly complex and interdependent system which is behind. This system is very opaque, and fast speed, with very high level of coordination.


Interesting stuff.  Immediately brings to mind two books.  The first, Joel Salatin's Folks This Ain't Normal wherein he discusses how less than a hundred years ago you could walk into any town or village and ask "Where's the food?" and you would be shown into the pantry, the root cellar, the larder (few folks even know that word these days) and maybe get directed out into the yard or pasture where some of the food was still walking around.  Ask that question in any town in this country today -- including farm towns and even homes on farms! -- and you'll be sent to the local supermarket.  As Joel says, folks, this ain't normal!

Book two: The End Of Food by Paul Roberts.  This book is right on with the article quote that begins this response.  The industrial food system in this nation is far more precarious than people realize.  Fuel disruptions like the ones us old farts remember back in the 70's could quickly leave grocery stores empty.  Shoot, we've had snowstorms that shut down the interstate highways into our area for a few days that resulted in depleted grocery stocks.

Re-localization of food production ought to be a national priority on the level of the Manhattan Project.  Our effort to provide electric vehicles, bunkers, alternative energy systems and all the other cool toys on our doomsteads becomes fairly pointless if we are starving.  The importance of securing a stable, reliable local food supply is paramount.

:hi: to the Diner FM!

I agree with this sentiment 100%.  EVERYBODY shoud be involved in food production for themselves and their communities in some way.  Personal indoor hydroponics, raised beds in the windows, potato towers on the porch personally.  EVERYBODY in the suburbs should have chickens in the back yard.

On the community level, Aquaculture ponds and Permaculture Food Forests focusing on perrenials.  Hamanure collection, composting and no more flush toilets!

All this could be done without a huge input of money.  We need SUN☼Communities!

RE
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Offline Farmer McGregor

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Re: Civilization and Collapse
« Reply #4 on: February 13, 2017, 10:11:54 PM »
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On the community level, Aquaculture ponds and Permaculture Food Forests focusing on perrenials.
I would love to discuss the practicalities of these concepts, especially relative to my home geography.  Years of working toward actually putting up a winter's supply of food have given me a lot to say about them.
Quote
Hamanure collection, composting and no more flush toilets!
Amen and Hallelujah, Brother! to that.  Reasons: 1. Soil fertility -- critical to survival.  2. Sh*tting in our drinking water is majorly stupid.  3. Hundred year old septic tank could fail any time (a personal problem).
Quote
We need SUN☼Communities!
Umm, hate to display my ignorance (pronounced 'igorance' or 'ignance' to sound appropriately ignorant) but what is this about?
--Greg
For years we have let ourselves believe that as long as we have money we will have food. This is a mistake. The government will bring forth no food by providing hundreds of billions of dollars to the agribusiness industry.  --Wendell Berry after the 2008 crash

Offline RE

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Re: Civilization and Collapse
« Reply #5 on: February 13, 2017, 10:19:28 PM »
Quote
We need SUN☼Communities!
Umm, hate to display my ignorance (pronounced 'igorance' or 'ignance' to sound appropriately ignorant) but what is this about

You haven't Snooped enough.  :icon_mrgreen:

Go to the SUN☼ Board here on the Forum
http://www.doomsteaddiner.net/forum/index.php/board,58.0.html

and the SUN☼ Website at
http://sun4living.com

RE
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Offline Farmer McGregor

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Re: Civilization and Collapse
« Reply #6 on: February 13, 2017, 10:38:41 PM »
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You haven't Snooped enough, etc.
True.  Will remedy at first convenience.
There's an awful lot to snoop through.
Gonna take some time, which I don't have much of.
'Specially once spring gets springin'.
For years we have let ourselves believe that as long as we have money we will have food. This is a mistake. The government will bring forth no food by providing hundreds of billions of dollars to the agribusiness industry.  --Wendell Berry after the 2008 crash

Offline RE

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Re: Civilization and Collapse
« Reply #7 on: February 13, 2017, 10:43:21 PM »
Quote
You haven't Snooped enough, etc.
True.  Will remedy at first convenience.
There's an awful lot to snoop through.
Gonna take some time, which I don't have much of.
'Specially once spring gets springin'.

Well, once our PDC certificate holders JDW, Eddie and LD get hold of this thread, they will likely fill you in more and be able to discuss your local issues better than me.  I'm a coordinator, I'm not an expert myself on these topics.

RE
« Last Edit: February 13, 2017, 10:45:10 PM by RE »
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