Lifetime of a Modeler

[RE]

I started Modeling very early in life, it was my dad the Pigman's hobby.  Building Model Planes, like Hardy Kruger in The Flight of the Phoenix.  Replicas of planes made from plastic parts that hung from fishing line in my room, and balsa wood and tissue paper planes that actually flew, using tiny internal combustion engines.  Most of them were Line controlled and only flew around in circles, but eventually we did do some R/C ones as well after the divorce and when I had my weekly weekend visits with him and when I was in Oz with him for my vacations while he was down there.

The Balsa planes were the most fun, and it was the first time I ever got "high", on the dope you  used to stiffen up the tissue paper you used to cover the aircraft.  LOL.  Takes endless hours to build one of these models, weeks of time generally speaking.  Then, at least half the time you crash it the first time you fly it!  lol.  I think I had only 3 or 4 of them that lasted for more than 10 flights.

After the planes, I got into building model Geodesic Domes and model cities.  Then models for various inventions.  All physical models until the 1990s when the first 3D CAD design programs came out.

When I became a High School Physics Teacher, Model Building was my main Lab for the students.  We built Suspension Bridges, miniature hoists, and then once I got into Doom, we built Trebuchets too! lol.  The biggest one we built was about 1/4 real scale using 2X4s and stood around 10' tall.  We used weight plates from the gym for the counterweight, and the thing could hurl a water balloon around 100'!  LOL.

The thing is here though, Modelers get no respect unless their models have been scaled up to "real life" size, as Hardy Kruger found out in Flight of the Phoenix.  For those of us with ideas and little money though, models are the only way to test our ideas.  3D CAD programs made this even easier to do, at least in design form although you still need to make physical miniatures to test them out.

I still love to model, and it annoys me when my modelling ideas are not respected because I don't have the means to execute full size applications of the model.  It is that disrespect I get on the Diner all the time, and I will not tolerate it anymore.

BTW, Flight of the Phoenix was probably the movie I watched the most times full through, even more than Last of the Mohicans.  This because it was the only movie they had on the freighter ship my mom and I came back from Brazil on with all the furniture we bought there.  12 days on that ship as I recall, and the same movie played every night.  lol.

Here's the full movie.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/AxJNxrZCboY" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/AxJNxrZCboY</a>

RE

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[Eddie]

I wish you could teach at teacher daughter's summer camp. Those kids would get so much out the kind of things you did with your students. I think I told you that she has been teaching a class for a couple of years on Rube Goldberg devices, which has been pretty cool. They have done the trebuchet build too, but nothing of the size you described. A suspension bridge would be an awesome project.

I don't have the time, or I'd volunteer to teach them photovoltaics. I think all kids now should be taught how to generate power..

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[jdwheeler42]

When I became a High School Physics Teacher, Model Building was my main Lab for the students.  We built Suspension Bridges, miniature hoists, and then once I got into Doom, we built Trebuchets too! lol.  The biggest one we built was about 1/4 real scale using 2X4s and stood around 10' tall.  We used weight plates from the gym for the counterweight, and the thing could hurl a water balloon around 100'!  LOL.

So, how big would a Trebuchet have to be to get a full-grown Mangalitsa airborne? 

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[Eddie]

Pretty fucking huge, I'd expect. Think 500 pound payload.

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[luciddreams]

I still love to model, and it annoys me when my modelling ideas are not respected because I don't have the means to execute full size applications of the model.  It is that disrespect I get on the Diner all the time, and I will not tolerate it anymore.


RE

Yo cool your jets there homey! 

Not every idea that falls out of your mouth is a good one.  You should expect people to challenge you.  Saying that you "will not tolerate it anymore," is some harsh language. 

Maybe you should elaborate what you are talking about.  I mean you did pitch the idea that I get robotic mowers to use professionally on my clients property, and that I use a fleet of batter powered mowers!!!  I don't think I challenged you on that, but no way it would work.  I'm just using it as an example of an idea that you've had that wasn't a very good one (although I realize you will likely still argue that point). 

Most of your ideas are pretty good, at least nifty and well thought out, but that doesn't equate to ideas that should actually be done.  Inventing is great and all, but how many inventions were great ideas that never went anywhere?  Failure is just a part of that game I would suspect, and I would also suspect that "modelers" suffer the same fate. 

I did models when I was a teen, mostly airplanes (hanging from fishing line) and tanks.  But I also built some transparent ICE motors where you could watch the inner workings by cranking a crank shaft.  This was one of the things my father actually did for me.  He was 48 state truckin' and came through SC often for a couple of years.  He actually made the effort to stop and spend time with me.  I built a full 4 cylinder motor over a couple of months that we started together and I often called him to ask questions about what color shit should be and what exactly was going on with the physics.  I think I was 12/13 at the time.  Very fond memories of my father, and they are precious few. 

Now we don't have anything to do with one another, which is sad.  I've apologized for shit I didn't even need to apologize about just to bury the hatchet and he's just being fuckin' obstinate.  It's a sad story. 

But yeah, maybe you should splain some about what the hell you mean by not going to tolerate anymore.  I just don't want some of our newer members gettin' scared off by a tyrant.  Granted, you pay the bills...I'm just sayin'

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[RE]

Yo cool your jets there homey! 

Not every idea that falls out of your mouth is a good one.  You should expect people to challenge you.  Saying that you "will not tolerate it anymore," is some harsh language.

I would have been happy to discuss it and elaborate on it, but the idea was dismissed and ignored.  It's finished in any event.  I'm not going to pitch any more ideas at Eddie.

RE

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[Eddie]

It was not my intention to cast aspersions on your ability to come up with a good model. My point, the one I was trying to make (I obviously failed) was to just point out that most microhydro turbines need a lot of head to make much power, and that low head turbines require a different approach.

You can't change the elevation of your property to make it more suitable. You have to work with what you have. I have a low head but reasonable flow (at the moment.) As you know that could go to zero and make the whole idea moot, and that well might happen.

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[RE]

It was not my intention to cast aspersions on your ability to come up with a good model. My point, the one I was trying to make (I obviously failed) was to just point out that most microhydro turbines need a lot of head to make much power, and that low head turbines require a different approach.

You can't change the elevation of your property to make it more suitable. You have to work with what you have. I have a low head but reasonable flow (at the moment.) As you know that could go to zero and make the whole idea moot, and that well might happen.

You also ignored the idea of putting up a suspension bridge to replace the low water bridge Gene built to reduce the environmental impact in the same thread.  Then going back a few months there was some idea I had (can't remember what it was) and your response was I should go ahead and build it before you would try it.  I spent a good 2 hours writing the post and drawing the diagram and digging up the videos for using the trolling motors (which granted was not a good application and alternators needed to be in their place).  They might be less efficient than the system you are looking at, but because the propellers are at depth they get more pressure.  So I am done now with discussing such ideas with you.  It never goes anywhere.

RE

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[Eddie]

Let it go then. Sorry.

I never replied to the idea of a suspension bridge.

It would be way cool, but my guess is that it would cost in excess of half a million dollars to build. For cars, I mean.

The low water bridge will probably have to do. I have better projects to spend money on. It's just that we always have to choose. It's a good idea, but that's not a good site. It's too flat. To get high enough to be flood safe, it'd be a quarter mile long. You need a gorge to build your bridge.

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[RE]

Let it go then. Sorry.

I never replied to the idea of a suspension bridge.

It would be way cool, but my guess is that it would cost in excess of half a million dollars to build. For cars, I mean.

The low water bridge will probably have to do. I have better projects to spend money on. It's just that we always have to choose. It's a good idea, but that's not a good site. It's too flat. To get high enough to be flood safe, it'd be a quarter mile long. You need a gorge to build your bridge.

It wouldn't need to be that long because it doesn't need to lift the surface  that high above the water to reduce the environmental impact.  It also could be a trestle type bridge or a hybrid.  It also would not cost anywhere near $500K to build.  But this again illustrates why discussing such things with you is a pointless exercise.

RE

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[Eddie]

Guess so.

I don't think you realize how expensive building costs have become. The bridge has to be above the flood plain...maybe 6-8 ft higher than the low water bridge. Which would have to be demolished to change anything. And it's stout. It'd cost maybe 50K to remove.

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[Palloy2]

I made a balsa wood and tissue paper plane, about 24" wingspan with rubber band driven propellor, encouraged by my father.  Then we went to a well-known windy ridge and launched into the wind.  It climbed rapidly, really high, and then turned downwind and disappeared off into the distance.  It had an address/phone label on the wing, and a few days later someone called to say they had found it in their backyard, all broken up.  We went round to get it back, and it really was smashed to bits.

Since it was only powered by the rubber band for a few seconds, and then it became a glider, I decided my next one would be a hand-launched glider, avoiding the need to build the fuselage strong enough to withstand the tension of the band and the drag of the propellor.  And the wing should have either a shallow V shape or better still a parabolic shape for self-correction of rolling.  My father referred me to the encyclopedia.  There I learned that most planes are built the wrong way round - instead of the large wing at the front and the stabiliser at the back, requiring a weight to be added at the extreme front, they should have the stabiliser at the front and that would obviate the need for added weights. 



So why don't they build real planes like that? - well because most designs have the engine at the front (too much weight) so put the  stabilsers at the back to counteract that, and the materials don't lend themselves to being made into graceful curves.  These limitations don't apply to simple gliders.

That was probably how come I later ended up studying Maths and Aeronautical Engineering at university.  Building models is fun, but for serious work you need computer models first, and computer programming is MUCH more fun.

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[RE]

Guess so.

I don't think you realize how expensive building costs have become. The bridge has to be above the flood plain...maybe 6-8 ft higher than the low water bridge. Which would have to be demolished to change anything. And it's stout. It'd cost maybe 50K to remove.

$50K to remove the current bridge?  Rent a Caterpillar back hoe and scoop it out of there!  Or dynamite it.  How much do a few sticks of dynamite cost these days?

Go to Home Depot and price out steel pipe, lumber and steel cable.  You can buy a shit load of that stuff for $50K.  You will need to model it first though to get a good estimate on these materials.

The reason construction costs are so high is if you hire construction companies, they wanna make a big PROFIT!  You shave a lot of this cost off if you DIY.

RE

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[RE]

When I became a High School Physics Teacher, Model Building was my main Lab for the students.  We built Suspension Bridges, miniature hoists, and then once I got into Doom, we built Trebuchets too! lol.  The biggest one we built was about 1/4 real scale using 2X4s and stood around 10' tall.  We used weight plates from the gym for the counterweight, and the thing could hurl a water balloon around 100'!  LOL.

So, how big would a Trebuchet have to be to get a full-grown Mangalitsa airborne? 

Depends how big the Pigman is and how far you want to throw him.  Lloyd Blankfein probably comes in around 200 lbs.  For a longer throw, you need a longer swing arm.  If your Pigman is 200lbs, and your lever ratio between the Pigman end and the counterweight end is 4:1, you need 800 lbs of counterweight just to balance it.  You won't get any acceleration out of that.  So minimum I would say of sand ballast would be 1600 lbs.   To get some reasonable distance,I would say you would need a Trebuchet around 30" tall.

Here's a Trebuchet launching a Car, a Piano and an Incendiary Drum. 

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/JQLYHt-DM0Q" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/JQLYHt-DM0Q</a>]

RE

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[luciddreams]

I'm currently designing my second professional permaculture design!  Like, for money!

Seriously RE, for as much shit as you dish out, and warn people of having to put up with...

Eddie loves you man, just, not every idea you have is going to happen.  Keep pitchin' the ideas, and maybe one day you'll pitch one that will stick.  If you don't pitch the ideas than nothing will ever stick.  Besides, you know you enjoyed the time you spent modeling your trolling motor hydroelectric dam.   

Have a drink of Glenlivet and a smoke or two and get over it. 

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