AuthorTopic: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil  (Read 7310 times)

Offline RE

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Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« on: September 29, 2012, 02:14:09 AM »
The latest AutoBio off the Keyboard of RE, Coming of Age in the Age of Oil now UP on the Diner Blog!   :icon_mrgreen:



Can't WAIT to see what kind of response this one gets.  I AM Curious! LOL.

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Offline Surly1

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #1 on: September 29, 2012, 05:30:18 AM »
Ah, the madness of youth.

As you note, the age of that sort of discretionary income, freedom to travel, open borders, and easily available recreation coming to an END with the Age of Oil. A piece as wistful as it is enlightening.
"...reprehensible lying communist..."

p01

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #2 on: September 29, 2012, 06:00:49 AM »
Your generation has lived like GODS, RE ...GODS. At least all this opulence was not (completely  ;D) wasted on you, as it was on the vast majority of them, and since you don't have any children, I'd say you shouldn't even lose any sleep about it! If there's a single morality that's worth considering, it should be to ensure one's children's survival, something like the seven generation sustainability law. Every other moral concept is utter bullshit, and at this point future generations are screwed beyond anything imaginable, anyway.

Offline monsta666

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #3 on: September 29, 2012, 10:11:09 AM »
Makes you wonder if RE should take a long 6 week break and do a second tour of Euroland chasing some sweet Swedish tail!

Going to the end point, much is said about the ways of maintaining some semblance of industrial life. The debate often centres on renewables, EV's or rail/public transit. I am of the belief that the automobile lifestyle is a unsustainable living arrangement regardless of what guise it takes. The energy required to produce a car is to high and that is before we even consider the costs of maintaining the system. If some action is to be pursued I would say rail but again this has its own issues. I do think that some form of mechanised transport has to be maintained even if it is unsustainable lest we have an even bigger and sudden collapse than would otherwise happen.

Let us assume for whatever reason that you were it and the people chose you as the leader and you could whatever you wanted in terms of national policy what policies would you pursue in terms of transportation. Me personally, I would lean towards rail, ships or other public transit that can provide greater bang for buck. I know it is unsustainable but just think without it how would food and other critical supplies be transported and how would critical infrastructure such as nuclear power stations be maintained without the use of mechanised transport/tools?

Offline RE

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #4 on: September 29, 2012, 10:34:13 AM »
Your generation has lived like GODS, RE ...GODS. At least all this opulence was not (completely  ;D) wasted on you, as it was on the vast majority of them, and since you don't have any children, I'd say you shouldn't even lose any sleep about it! If there's a single morality that's worth considering, it should be to ensure one's children's survival, something like the seven generation sustainability law. Every other moral concept is utter bullshit, and at this point future generations are screwed beyond anything imaginable, anyway.

Filed under "Live Fast, Die Young, Leave a Good Looking Corpse", cross referenced under "Gas, Grass or Ass, Nobody Rides for Free" under the RE Dewey Decimal System. :D

Actually though, it was the generation just prior that really got the full 9 yards, those who are around 70-80 years old now.  You know who you are here. ;)  Those that survived anyhow, since numerous of them got nailed in Korea and Vietnam.

More on this later, got a busy day ahead.

BTW P01, you might as well rejoin, you post more often than most Diners.  LOL.

RE
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Offline Karpatok

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #5 on: September 29, 2012, 11:06:02 AM »
   Sex, Drugs,and Rock and Roll! Lets hear it for free love! Without the love and strings attached of course. Boy those transatlantic tickets were cheap then. Who says we haven't had inflation? Far as Monsta666's inquiry goes, a great many Europeans never indulged themselves in automobiles because there was such excellent public transportation, Something the American proles could never get through their dim skulls while they served their masters. Another reason why I would never ever refer to Europeans as Eurotrash.

Offline Karpatok

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #6 on: September 29, 2012, 11:58:18 AM »
Furthermore, not to mention Germany whose rails were the finest for commuting, inEastern Europe,the part of Europe that I was most familiar with, most people could not afford automobiles because their country had been held back from the "glorious development " in the West. Remaining in small settlements and "undeveloped" they remained close to the land, animals, nature, clean water, un GMOed fake food, their ancient traditions and practices, without all the stress of "foreigners " being forced upon them by those know it all academic do gooders insisting on a forced acceptance of multiculturalism, an imbecilic and delusional ideal if there ever was one.When the dirty polluted cities have fallen, these same settlements will continue on with their lives as they have done for millenia. In the dumbed down US OTOH, where nobody knows which way is up, where nobody remembers yesterday much less one hundred years ago and where very few even know what real soil is, who knows what will happen. Starvation I guess, and I really could care less. Because you reap what you sow. 

Offline g

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #7 on: September 29, 2012, 01:52:40 PM »
   Sex, Drugs,and Rock and Roll! Lets hear it for free love! Without the love and strings attached of course. Boy those transatlantic tickets were cheap then. Who says we haven't had inflation? Far as Monsta666's inquiry goes, a great many Europeans never indulged themselves in automobiles because there was such excellent public transportation, Something the American proles could never get through their dim skulls while they served their masters. Another reason why I would never ever refer to Europeans as Eurotrash.
Boy oh boy what inflation there has been. Germany had American Express offices where we soldiers used to go and turn in 1 dollar for 4 Marks and 40 Pfennig. We would go to the Ring Hotel, the classiest eating place in town, and order a fillet Mignon dinner, the works, salad and all for something like 3 Marks 80 Pfennig, yes less than a buck in other words. They had the worlds greatest selection of fresh daily made unpasteurized beers, I can still ta st their fresh wholesome bursting flavor. The piss they sent over here was called export beer, and the loaded it with chemicals, 4 times the amount of alcohol so it would have a 1 year shelf life. RE you would have been in heaven over there drinking the suds, make a bottled Heineken taste like mild tepid tea.

Then there was the train system and you had to see it to believe it. You know the saying set your clock by it. In the case of the German trains you could set the second hand, not just the minute, and that's no exaggeration or bull shit. When you wanted to go somewhere far off the main path you grabbed a cab. They were all the same, and they were everywhere, no waiting, nice roomy black Mercedes with fairs so cheap I cannot even remember them,  a few pieces  of pocket change would take you anywhere in style and comfort with a friendly driver to bull shit with that always took great pride and care of his Taxi. It was really remarkable.

In closing I have to mention the Italians that opened cafes all over he place. Imagine a twelve inch pizza with a pint of beer or a glass of Dago red for about 1 Mark, yeah two bits, and it was fresh home made dough for the pizza. Sure you get the picture.

Getting back to Fort Dix NJ after that, and spending a week in NYC before heading home, and seeing what had become of the dollar, which still had decent buying power in the 1960's was a very influential factor in turning me into a true Gold Bug and life long disciple of the precious yellow.

Offline RE

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #8 on: September 29, 2012, 04:57:04 PM »
Boy oh boy what inflation there has been.

Actually, this was the result of deflation of the Deutchmark over the last 50 years since the end of WWII.  It was seriously devalued at the conclusion of the War, resulting in the dollar prices of everything there being extremely cheap.  As the Kraut Industrial infrastructure was rebuilt, D-marks eventually reached parity with the Dollar and even surpassed it for a while as I recall before the introduction of the Euro.  This was true of all the Northern European countries currencies, which was why by the 1970s it was expensive for me to hang out in Stockholm, but still incredibly cheap to hang out in Barcelona or Venice.

Far as the rail network is concerned, that is the result of the timing of the Industrial Revolution and its location.  The steam engine was invented in around 1750 in England and Industrialization occurred rapidly from there, while in the FSoA most of the continent was still unexplored by European thieves.  The whole European Continent was laid out for Rail long before the Automobile existed.  Anyhow, rather than subsidizing Automobiles, the Europeans have been subsidizing their Rail system, which really is the reason that Gas is so much more expensive there than here (like double the price).  The difference is all taxation, and the taxation is used to subsidize the railroads.  As fewer people drive less miles in Europe, this whole scheme will rapidly fall apart, making it quite difficult on the economic level to keep the railroads running.

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Offline monsta666

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #9 on: September 29, 2012, 05:17:02 PM »
Far as the rail network is concerned, that is the result of the timing of the Industrial Revolution and its location.  The steam engine was invented in around 1750 in England and Industrialization occurred rapidly from there, while in the FSoA most of the continent was still unexplored by European thieves.  The whole European Continent was laid out for Rail long before the Automobile existed.  Anyhow, rather than subsidizing Automobiles, the Europeans have been subsidizing their Rail system, which really is the reason that Gas is so much more expensive there than here (like double the price).  The difference is all taxation, and the taxation is used to subsidize the railroads.  As fewer people drive less miles in Europe, this whole scheme will rapidly fall apart, making it quite difficult on the economic level to keep the railroads running.

RE

I think everyone in this forum would agree that both forms of transportation are unsustainable but which form should be selected as society begins its downward decent? Oh and to keep things open any suggestions outside rail or automobile can be elected.

As for the relative costs of transportation, sure taxes and subsidies have served to distort the true prices of each form of transport but at some point both forms (rail and automobile) were the same price more or less. The decision to tax or subsidise each form of transport largely came about as a conscious decision when the price were the same or at least much more similarly aligned. I think the main reason for the decision was due to the relative abundance of each resource present in the continent. I feel the real reason the Europeans taxed cars and subsidised rail was not so much to do with Europe being more green but because oil was less readily available thus making the automobile paradigm a much less feasible option in Europe than it was in the US.

Further evidence of this behaviour can be seen with Japan who followed a similar path to the Europeans because like the Europeans, the Japanese did not have huge oil resources. If Japan or Europe had plenty of oil I think they would have gone the way of the car like the Americans and like the Americans these decisions would be reflected in how they priced/taxed/subsidised each form of transport.

To summarise, what I am basically saying is these price signals came about from decisions initially taken from society. The price distortions came later and these merely reinforced those earlier decisions making it less feasible to make a switch/transition (which is a good thing for the pigs that benefit from the status quo). This applies even when it becomes obvious that the current paradigm is far inferior than the alternative.
« Last Edit: September 29, 2012, 05:22:14 PM by monsta666 »

Offline g

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #10 on: September 29, 2012, 05:27:01 PM »
Quote Monsta666 "To summarise, what I am basically saying is these price signals came about from decisions initially taken from society. The price distortions came later and these merely reinforced those earlier decisions making it less feasible to make a switch/transition (which is a good thing for the pigs that benefit from the status quo). This applies even when it becomes obvious that the current paradigm is far inferior than the alternative."

They sure know how to protect their turf Monsta, makes you really wonder where we would be today without their constant stifling of innovation.                                             

Offline RE

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RE's Greenie Sustainable Transportation System
« Reply #11 on: September 29, 2012, 06:16:50 PM »
Let us assume for whatever reason that you were it and the people chose you as the leader and you could whatever you wanted in terms of national policy what policies would you pursue in terms of transportation. Me personally, I would lean towards rail, ships or other public transit that can provide greater bang for buck. I know it is unsustainable but just think without it how would food and other critical supplies be transported and how would critical infrastructure such as nuclear power stations be maintained without the use of mechanised transport/tools?

RE as Dictator-for-Life!  There's a scary thought.  LOL.

OK, I will Morph into Agelbert to answer this.

I long ago came up with the idea of Marrying Trians with HPVs, aka Human Powered Vehicles.  Here is an example of one:


The train would be configured so you could actually ride your HPV onto the train with slots on both sides of the train one for entrance one for exit.

Said HPVs don't have to be 100% Human Power, they can have Electric Assist.  Typical speeds such an HPV can maintain with a well conditioned Cyclist are around 40-50 mph, but there are some astounding records also

Quote

In 2009, Sam Whittingham pedaled a streamliner (a fully faired recumbent) for 200 m (660 ft) at 133.284 km/h (82.819 mph) in the Varna Tempest.

Greg Kolodziejzyk set two world records recognized by both the International Human Powered Vehicle Association and Guinness (TM) World Records on July 17, 2006 on a race track in Eureka, California. The first record is for the most distance traveled in 24 hours by human power 1,041 km (647 mi), and the second for the worlds fastest 1,000 km time trial (23 hours, 2 minutes).

Most of the Rail Network would be used for Food Transportation, not People Moving.  All Food Distribution Nodes would be along the rail network, people would ride their HPVs to the train stations to pick up their groceries.

The Trains would get most of their power from Windfarms built along the Rail track, and this would be the only line of Electricity, no Grid.  If you had electric assist for your HPV, you could charge it at the train stations or on the train.  All Home Electricity is decentralized, utilizing Stirling Engines, Wind and micro Hydro Vivace technology where moving water is available.

The main difficulty is in maintenance of the roads for the HPVs, which need to be pretty smooth to ride at any speed, as well as maintenance issues for the rail network.  However, the energy consumption for moving stuff and people around would be vastly reduced, to probably 1/10th what it currently is.  This would make the remaining fossil fuels last a lot longer.

Sadly, RE is not going to be appointed Dictator-for-Life, so you won't get this Green Renewable System.   You will get Obomney or Robama glazing over MENA instead.

RE
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Offline RE

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #12 on: September 29, 2012, 11:14:44 PM »
Your generation has lived like GODS, RE ...GODS. At least all this opulence was not (completely  ;D) wasted on you, as it was on the vast majority of them, and since you don't have any children, I'd say you shouldn't even lose any sleep about it! If there's a single morality that's worth considering, it should be to ensure one's children's survival, something like the seven generation sustainability law. Every other moral concept is utter bullshit, and at this point future generations are screwed beyond anything imaginable, anyway.

I mentioned earlier in my short reply to this comment that although MY Generation, the Mid to Late Boomers certainly has had a great ride up until now, really its the Silent Generation, those who were children at the time of WWII who really got the Maximum Bennies of "Living Like Gods" if they happenned to be born in the right place on the Planet for hitching a Ride on the Industrial Train.

Said folks are 75  now and mostly dieing off, although of course due to modern medicine and so forth there are more than usual still ambulating and keyboarding also.  Its tough to lay Blame on people who are mostly DEAD already or soon to be Dead, so the Succeeding Generations of GenX, GenY and Millenials are already heaing the Blame on the Boomers as the Profligate and Selfish Generation that is Proximally Responsible for the the ongoing Crash of Industrial Civilization.

To se that Blame Game in action, all you need to do is read Jimbo on The Burning Platform  for a while, where he excoriates Boomers on a regular basis, identifying himself with the GenX crowd.  Fact is that Jimbo is really a Boomer himself, his birthdate puts him at the Tail End of the Boomer Generation by most definitions, not GenX.

Fact also is though that not only are the Boomers not "responsible" for this, neither really are the Silents, though they certainly were the ones to gear up Industrialization, build the first Nuke Power Plants etc.  Boomers weren't graduated up yet an in high enough positions of Power to send us down that road.  Tricky Dick Nixon who took the FSofA off the "Gold Standard" fabricated up at Bretton Woods for example was no Boomer, he was born in 1913 which I believe makes him part of the "Greatest Generation", the ones who fought WWII.

Hard to find anyone to Finger as more responsible for Morris Berman's WAFER ideas than Tricky Dick.  No more Corrupt Politician ever existed anywhere in any time I suspect.  However, even fucking Dick Nixon isn't "responsible", because you can predate him with the Corrupt Assholes who pushed through the Federal Reserve Act and the IRS in 1913, only briefly after Dick had popped out of his mom's vaginal canal before the Christmas Congressional break.  He wasn't at Jekyll Island, he was at the time a peaceful child sucking milk from mom's tits.

Were THOSE guys the responsible ones?  Of course not, you can keep going back this way right to the beginning of the Industrial Revolution, and then if you are real SERIOUS about tracing back BLAME you could lay it on the first Dickhead who claimed a parcel of land as his OWN and started planting Millett on it, around 10,000 years ago I believe.

Far as the Silents and the Boomers go, those who hooked on at some level to the Gravy Train were the BENEFICIARIES of this Millenia long "Progress to Modernity", but in general the average J6P is not RESPONSIBLE for this, said J6P never had any CHOICE in this matter really.  The DIRECTION of society has always come from a few Elite at the top who always directed society to best serve their own interests.

Far as the Early Boomers go, for the most part I suspect their Bennies will hold up long enough for them to hit 70 or so, but mid-to-late Boomers are likely to see theirs disappear here along with Bernie Madoff's and John Corzine's disappearing Money acts.  So although we got a nice ride there at the tail end of the Age of Oil, the End Game will not be Pretty for these folks, myself included in that mix.  One of the reasons I don't really worry about my Bad Health all that much, because if I Die Sooner rather than Laker it mainly means I won't Suffer so much before I buy my Ticket to the Great Beyond.

As all of us Boomers eventually make our way to the Great Beyond, will the succeeding Generations continue to Blame this generation for the Sewer of a World they inherited?  Possibly, but hopefully after THEY pass into the Great Beyond also, eventually whoever does survive will realize this was not the "Fault" of one particular Generation and it's Greed and Selfishness.  This has been Ongoing since Ag first hit the Scene, which basically amounts to the Exit from the Garden of Eden.

For myself, do I feel GUILTY about the fact I lived this life for so long as I did?  Not in the least, in fact I am glad I got lucky enough to enjoy as much of the Bennies of this period as I did.  I never had to go fight in a War and kill some other people.  I got to drink really good Beer at several Breweries in Europe on ANOTHER trip I made there touring Breweries.  :icon_mrgreen:  $2 for the Tour of the Brewerie, at the end you could drink Beer for as long as you could still stand up.  :icon_mrgreen:

For the most part also, I had to WORK at some Un-God-like Jobs for months or years to get a few weeks of God-Like living.  I walked away from being able to live like a God Full Time when I walked away from Wall Street, and because of that I sorta stayed a MENSCH for my whole life, and I am glad I did that also.

Any GUILT for my trip in Europe Coming of Age in the Age of Oil? HELL NO.  Nor do I have any guilt for my years cruising on my BMW R100RT Motorcycle either. Nor any GUILT for driving around my Ford Explorer SUV today, or eating Rib-eye Steaks I BBQ up coated with High Fructose Corn Syrup BBQ sauce from Cows fattenned up on GMO Corn in Chicago Feedlots either.   This is life at the end of the Age of Oil, if you are fortunate enough to still have a Job or enough Money that still works to be able to afford it.  The Fatty Foods, the Cigarettes and the Beer are gonna Kill me Soon, sho'nuff there.  What of it?  I got my ride, I got my Adventure in the Age of Oil.

I got my Swedish Girl too.  I got my MEMORIES and I take those with me to the Great Beyond, and leave a few behind here on the Internet until it Goes Dark, and then in the Memories of those who read what I wrote before they also get their Tickets.

That's how it GOES.  Everybody Knows
.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/v/PuuCezrAUKk" target="_blank" class="new_win">http://www.youtube.com/v/PuuCezrAUKk</a>

RE
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p01

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #13 on: September 30, 2012, 08:58:08 AM »
Who said anything about blame, RE? There's no blame, as it will be no blame when the young will have their way with the old. Blame? What a strange concept. They will do it because they can, just like the generation before had done it because they could. As I said above, the only moral concept that would separate us from yeast, would be ensuring the perpetuation of the species. When this is compromised, all bets are off.

Offline Karpatok

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Re: Coming of Age in the Age of Oil
« Reply #14 on: September 30, 2012, 12:06:14 PM »
In the interest of full disclosure in this so often atmosphere of the confessional, if you don't believe you will be around to collect the social security due you, or rather social security won't be around by the time you are eligable

 

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