Doomstead Diner Newz Channels => Surveys => Topic started by: Eddie on May 04, 2018, 10:23:22 AM

Title: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Eddie on May 04, 2018, 10:23:22 AM
As the administrator of this site lies struggling for his life in the hospital today (And no, I am not exaggerating....if you want to tell him something now would be a good time to do that by Diner PM, or him drop a thank-you note.), I am just thinking back to how I came upon this site, and what kept me coming back in spite of all the "negative waves" I received from a lot of people in the beginning (including RE).

I have to give RE credit. In spite of frequent bitching by the "freedom of speech" crowd, it was the editorial policy here of "Say anything you want, but be prepared to back it up or be deluged with a boatload of truth" that attracted me in the first place and has kept me coming back. I have often heard things here from a bunch of fairly smart people that made me rethink my own preferred narratives...and believe it or not, caused me to modify my views from time to time.

Over the five years I've been checking in on most days here, a long string of preppers, survivalists, eco-terrorists-in-training, revolutionaries and malcontents have fought it out with those who wanted to come here and argue that the world was in fact NOT actually going to hell in a handbasket and everything's fine.

I don't know what happens now if RE bites the dust. I expect this site will fold, or at best become a dead site. I hope it stays up, and I will try to help with that. This site is RE's real monument, and not the fancy tombstone he's had so much fun creating (although I don't begrudge him the fun he's obviously had getting that silly thing made.)

I'm not sure what I'll do with my time. I discovered years ago that I wasn't likely to become a famous blogger (missed the time window, if nothing else) and so I found a place to write here on the forum, mostly behind the curtain. Not sure who I'll argue with now. RE is the best person I ever found to argue with. Always willing to go to the mat over just about anything, and not always right (although always certain).

That's important. Who wants to argue with somebody who's always right? Like arguing with God, it's a low-pay-off proposition, and gets old really fast. RE is wrong often enough for me to enjoy the verbal sparring and maybe win one every once in a while, and I like that.

But...what I wanted to do is take a survey, and ask for you to please vote, and more especially to comment in more detail, about when you became collapse aware. What made "the lights come on" for you? When was that? Where were you? Did it change your life at all?

I know exactly when the lights came on for me. It was when I read Ruppert's PO book at Christmas in 2010. Since then my outlook has changed radically and my way of life, if not radically, at least noticeably. I have not changed the world, nor was it ever my intention to do so. I'm primarily a selfish fuck whose interest is staying alive and maybe doing something to better the circumstances of my own somewhat spoiled (but still decent) kids and any children they might have. I came here after getting tired of the (mostly) alt.right commentariat on Jim Quinn's site The Burning Platform. It was RE's Diner proselytizing that did it. Advertising works, for better or worse.

RE has always said the lights came on for him when Lehman went belly-up in 2008.

So, when did the lights come on for you?

A lot of people read this forum who have never written a word here. I know that. (Thanks for reading, btw.) If you don't want to comment, at least vote in the poll. Your location will not be tracked (unless it already is) and nobody from here will try to sell you anything (Unless you're local and you'd like to get a great deal on a pig. In that case PM me instead of RE.)

The poll might not have every possible scenario covered. That's why the comments are important. Please take the time to comment, even if you never comment. I never conducted  a poll before, either.

Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Surly1 on May 04, 2018, 12:00:49 PM
As the administrator of this site lies struggling for his life in the hospital today (And no, I am not exaggerating....if you want to tell him something now would be a good time to do that by Diner PM, or him drop a thank-you note.), I am just thinking back to how I came upon this site, and what kept me coming back in spite of all the "negative waves" I received from a lot of people in the beginning (including RE).

RE is almost certainly the irreplaceable man as it refers to DD. It is difficult to imagine a Diner without him, so I choose not to do it. I sincerely hopes he outlives me. I am hoping today's exertions will oead to a new level of medical insight for him.


I don't know what happens now if RE bites the dust. I expect this site will fold, or at best become a dead site. I hope it stays up, and I will try to help with that. This site is RE's real monument, and not the fancy tombstone he's had so much fun creating (although I don't begrudge him the fun he's obviously had getting that silly thing made.)

I am certainly committed to keeping the doors open for a while as well.


But...what I wanted to do is take a survey, and ask for you to please vote, and more especially to comment in more detail, about when you became collapse aware. What made "the lights come on" for you? When was that? Where were you? Did it change your life at all?

I know exactly when the lights came on for me. It was when I read Ruppert's PO book at Christmas in 2010. Since then my outlook has changed radically and my way of life, if not radically, at least noticeably. I have not changed the world, nor was it ever my intention to do so. I'm primarily a selfish fuck whose interest is staying alive and maybe doing something to better the circumstances of my own somewhat spoiled (but still decent) kids and any children they might have. I came here after getting tired of the (mostly) alt.right commentariat on Jim Quinn's site The Burning Platform. It was RE's Diner proselytizing that did it. Advertising works, for better or worse.

RE has always said the lights came on for him when Lehman went belly-up in 2008.

So, when did the lights come on for you?

About the same as you, maybe a couple of months earlier. I started reading TBP in I think 2010, and encountered RE and his rants. We found after a while that we shared a similar POV, as those posters left of Mussolini found TBP rough sledding, between Jimbo, Llpoh and, of course, Smokey. Those who complain of "virulence" on the Diner never saw Smokey in midseason form ("...after dumping a load of baby batter into your wife...") Although a gifted writer, Jimbo is a depraved website admin, and was not above rewriting posts to make a point.

Perhaps the exact moment the light came on was when Henry Paulsen went begging for bailouts, and the Congress ignored overwhelming sentiment against such a thing and voted it anyhow. Paulson always portrays himself as a fierce champion of free markets, but has not been above defending the decision to bail out AIG and other Wall Street firms. The wrong people would have taken a haircut. It was then the outlines of the rigged casino began to take shape for me. Along with a head of steam that led to Occupy.
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: RE on May 04, 2018, 12:48:14 PM
Nobody is irreplaceable.  There are times I am sure the Diner would actually do better without me around.  I am good at running off clientele as Surly has noted in the past. lol.

I am glad you guys will try to keep the Diner & SUN up and running for at least a while after I buy my ticket to the Great Beyond.  I told Brian that some of the money I leave behind should be used to pay the Diner Bills.  You guys will need to figure out how you pay ASO and the internet registrations.  It's not hard.

I don't think I will die today now that what was making me deteriorate so fast was caught, at least the symptom of severe anemia  if not what is causing it and the lack of appetite problem.  We'll see if the scope turns up anything.

LONG LIVE THE DOOMSTEAD DINER!

RE
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Surly1 on May 04, 2018, 01:08:26 PM
Nobody is irreplaceable.  There are times I am sure the Diner would actually do better without me around.  I am good at running off clientele as Surly has noted in the past. lol.

I am glad you guys will try to keep the Diner & SUN up and running for at least a while after I buy my ticket to the Great Beyond.  I told Brian that some of the money I leave behind should be used to pay the Diner Bills.  You guys will need to figure out how you pay ASO and the internet registrations.  It's not hard.

I don't think I will die today now that what was making me deteriorate so fast was caught, at least the symptom of severe anemia  if not what is causing it and the lack of appetite problem.  We'll see if the scope turns up anything.

LONG LIVE THE DOOMSTEAD DINER!

RE

I was going to say, "spill your guts," but that might be bad timing and worse taste. There's got to be more. We'll wait.
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Eddie on May 04, 2018, 01:27:47 PM
If you aren't bleeding internally, then the problem is that you aren't making enough RBC's. The things that cause that kind of anemia are all bad things. I hope they find a bleed and fix it.

The alternatives comprise a short list and they mostly end in -emia. Leukemia, aplastic anemia, Oh, lymphoma. That one doesn't rhyme.
Or it happens with cancer that metastasizes to your bone marrow. That's how my father went. Once your bone marrow quits, you're a dead man walking. Just sayin'. :)

Leukemia should have already been diagnosed from your blood work if you had had it, which you probably don't. You could have non-Hodgkins lymphoma. Blood work wouldn't show anything. As many scans as you've had surely they would have found any tumors. The premier symptom of lymphoma is enlarged lymph nodes. Dx is by needle biopsy.

No, I don't think today is your day, but I am quite worried. A diagnosis would be helpful.




Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: RE on May 04, 2018, 01:40:06 PM
If you aren't bleeding internally, then the problem is that you aren't making enough RBC's. The things that cause that kind of anemia are all bad things. I hope they find a bleed and fix it.

The alternatives comprise a short list and they mostly end in -emia. Leukemia, aplastic anemia, Oh, lymphoma. That one doesn't rhyme.
Or it happens with cancer that metastasizes to your bone marrow. That's how my father went. Once your bone marrow quits, you're a dead man walking. Just sayin'. :)

Leukemia should have already been diagnosed from your blood work if you had had it, which you probably don't. You could have non-Hodgkins lymphoma. Blood work wouldn't show anything. As many scans as you've had surely they would have found any tumors. The premier symptom of lymphoma is enlarged lymph nodes. Dx is by needle biopsy.

No, I don't think today is your day, but I am quite worried. A diagnosis would be helpful.

I think bone marrow cancer is a good possibility.  My lymph nodes don't seem to be enlarged.

Perhaps we have colon cancer which has metasticized.

RE
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Nearingsfault on May 04, 2018, 06:07:08 PM
I put down before 1980 but I was preconditioned by a few events and where I grew up. I grew up in rural quebec in the 1970's at the tail end of the quiet revolution as we called it. Quebec underwent a rapid change from a rural agricultural roman catholic province to a more urban manufacturing based secular and independence minded hotbed. For a half English half french kid in rural quebec the world seemed to be falling apart from childhood. We had homegrown terrorists planting bombs, a crashing economy oil embargoes a country that seemed about to break apart, and for me personally a family of 9 farm kids as aunts and uncles who were indifferent to their heritage as it vanished. So by the time I discovered mother earth news then harrow smith then appropriate technology magazine then the new alchemists, the nearings  limits to growth, I was already in the right mindset.
Get as well as you can RE
Cheers, David B.
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: jdwheeler42 on May 06, 2018, 03:24:43 AM
If you aren't bleeding internally, then the problem is that you aren't making enough RBC's. The things that cause that kind of anemia are all bad things. I hope they find a bleed and fix it.
Meh... for as long and as little as RE has been eating, my money is on simple iron/B12 deficiency as the cause of the anemia.
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Eddie on May 06, 2018, 08:30:04 AM
I suppose that certainly could be, (and that'd be a good thing). But when you get 2-3 quarts low on the dipstick, it's serious, no matter what's causing it. If it has to do with his inability to eat, maybe a feeding tube would help. I hope you're right.
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: RE on May 06, 2018, 01:35:11 PM
If you aren't bleeding internally, then the problem is that you aren't making enough RBC's. The things that cause that kind of anemia are all bad things. I hope they find a bleed and fix it.
Meh... for as long and as little as RE has been eating, my money is on simple iron/B12 deficiency as the cause of the anemia.

There is no doubt the poor nutrition  over the last year was a major factor in producing the anemia.  What remains an unanswered question is what is causing the lack of appetite and disgust with anything I actually do shove down my pie hole?  Imagine you had the prospect of having to eat shit every day for the rest of your life to stay alive.  Would you do it?   Right now I am forcing down whaever they put in front of me because I wouldn't get out of here if I don't eat.  But it all tastes like literal shit to me.

RE
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Eddie on May 06, 2018, 01:40:31 PM
(https://www.usnews.com/dims4/USNEWS/03228d9/2147483647/thumbnail/640x420/quality/85/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.beam.usnews.com%2Fe7%2F29%2Ff4ae467048d8846d4329516c63dc%2F161013-pegfeedingtube-stock.jpg)

No so bad if you can just load the nutritious shit into a big syringe and squirt it past the pie hole. Better than dying of malnutrition.
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Ka on May 06, 2018, 01:57:59 PM
Being in temporary non-lurker mode, I might as well give my story. Somewhere around 2005 I was participating in a forum on Robert Pirsig's metaphysics (the Zen and the Art of Motorcycle Maintenance guy), and on the forum was an Anglican priest named Sam Norton. I looked at his blog, and he had a a lot to say on Peak Oil, which introduced me to The Oil Drum, and The Automatic Earth. From TAE I followed RE, El Gallinazo and Ashvin to the Diner. Had a lot of fun arguing with Ashvin over Christian theology (to many Diners' disgust, but amazingly it was allowed -- thank you RE).

I gave up on any political hope or change when Obama appointed Tim Geithner as treasury secretary.
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Eddie on May 06, 2018, 02:38:16 PM
Thanks for voting and responding, all who took the time. I think the results are quite interesting, already, and I hope for more responses.

Admin, if you get home and read this, make the poll a sticky for a while.  I can never figure out how to do that stuff.
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: RE on May 06, 2018, 03:05:52 PM
(https://www.usnews.com/dims4/USNEWS/03228d9/2147483647/thumbnail/640x420/quality/85/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fmedia.beam.usnews.com%2Fe7%2F29%2Ff4ae467048d8846d4329516c63dc%2F161013-pegfeedingtube-stock.jpg)

No so bad if you can just load the nutritious shit into a big syringe and squirt it past the pie hole. Better than dying of malnutrition.

If I could get one of those installed, I would.  I already asked my PCP about that some time back and she told me first off Medicare won't pay for it and second she didn't know any surgeon who would do it for me, at least here in the FSoA.  Maybe they would do it down in Panama? ???  :icon_scratch:  The only way she said they do it up here is if you are on your death bed and basically unconscious and they have to force the food into you.

Preferable of course would be to find the cause of the problem and solve that one so I could go back to enjoying eating as much as I enjoy looking at pics of great food.

RE
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: jdwheeler42 on May 08, 2018, 04:09:32 PM
If you aren't bleeding internally, then the problem is that you aren't making enough RBC's. The things that cause that kind of anemia are all bad things. I hope they find a bleed and fix it.
Meh... for as long and as little as RE has been eating, my money is on simple iron/B12 deficiency as the cause of the anemia.

There is no doubt the poor nutrition  over the last year was a major factor in producing the anemia.  What remains an unanswered question is what is causing the lack of appetite and disgust with anything I actually do shove down my pie hole?  Imagine you had the prospect of having to eat shit every day for the rest of your life to stay alive.  Would you do it?   Right now I am forcing down whaever they put in front of me because I wouldn't get out of here if I don't eat.  But it all tastes like literal shit to me.
Not too hard to imagine... when I was on chemo everything had a metallic taste.  And made me sick to my stomach.  And I was losing about 5 pounds a week.  I was forcing myself to eat because they were threatening to put one of those feeding tubes in me.  My saving grace was knowing that the chemo would stop and things would eventually get better -- although I had no idea just how long it would take.  My chemo ran from end of April to beginning of June, stuff didn't start tasting good until October.  And nothing is quite the same as before.
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: freedom on June 14, 2018, 09:22:14 PM
It's been a gradual awakening, to be sure.

It began in the late 80s when I worked with Greenpeace on the criminal practices of Waste Management; then went to work on radioactive waste issues with an organization called Don't Waste US; began reading Matt Savinar's forum Life After the Oil Crash, Matt Simmons, Michael Ruppert's website From the Wilderness and his eye-opening book Crossing the Rubicon, John Pilger, Bruce Gagnon and The Global Network Against Weapons & Nuclear Power in Space, Noam Chomsky, Chris Hedges @ truthdig, Guy McPherson and Climate Change, the Organic Consumers Association (and its expose of the food industry's control over what we eat), and most importantly, the World Socialist Web Site ... reading, reading, reading ... and watching, i.e., films on Vietnam, Salvador, Ukraine, Syria, this country's relentless bombing, invading, destroying country after country, overthrowing governments, etc etc etc.

It's been a 30-year study of social inequality, the pursuit of escalating wars, the struggles of the working class, the silencing and vilification of whistleblowers (Assange/Snowden etc.), Wall Street's financial fraud, and so much more.

Well, you get the picture.

It's not a wonder that the ruling class is censoring the Internet.

Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: RE on June 14, 2018, 09:28:38 PM
It's been a gradual awakening, to be sure.

It began in the late 80s when I worked with Greenpeace on the criminal practices of Waste Management; then went to work on radioactive waste issues with an organization called Don't Waste US; began reading Matt Savinar's forum Life After the Oil Crash, Matt Simmons, Michael Ruppert's website From the Wilderness and his eye-opening book Crossing the Rubicon, John Pilger, Bruce Gagnon and The Global Network Against Weapons & Nuclear Power in Space, Noam Chomsky, Chris Hedges @ truthdig, the Organic Consumers Association (and its expose of the food industry's control over what we eat), and most importantly, the World Socialist Web Site ... reading, reading, reading ... and watching, i.e., films on Vietnam, Salvador, Ukraine, Syria, this country's relentless bombing, invading, destroying country after country, overthrowing governments, etc etc etc.

It's been a 30-year study of social inequality, the pursuit of escalating wars, the struggles of the working class, the silencing and vilification of whistleblowers (Assange/Snowden etc.), Wall Street's financial fraud, and so much more.

Well, you get the picture.

It's not a wonder that the ruling class is censoring the Internet.

:hi: to the Diner Freedom!  :icon_sunny:

RE
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: freedom on June 14, 2018, 09:31:36 PM
merci beaucoup ... it's nice to be among like-minded people  :icon_sunny:
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: agelbert on June 15, 2018, 09:43:38 AM
When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?

It's been a gradual awakening, to be sure.

It began in the late 80s when I worked with Greenpeace on the criminal practices of Waste Management; then went to work on radioactive waste issues with an organization called Don't Waste US; began reading Matt Savinar's forum Life After the Oil Crash, Matt Simmons, Michael Ruppert's website From the Wilderness and his eye-opening book Crossing the Rubicon, John Pilger, Bruce Gagnon and The Global Network Against Weapons & Nuclear Power in Space, Noam Chomsky, Chris Hedges @ truthdig, Guy McPherson and Climate Change, the Organic Consumers Association (and its expose of the food industry's control over what we eat), and most importantly, the World Socialist Web Site ... reading, reading, reading ... and watching, i.e., films on Vietnam, Salvador, Ukraine, Syria, this country's relentless bombing, invading, destroying country after country, overthrowing governments, etc etc etc.

It's been a 30-year study of social inequality, the pursuit of escalating wars, the struggles of the working class, the silencing and vilification of whistleblowers (Assange/Snowden etc.), Wall Street's financial fraud, and so much more.

Well, you get the picture.

It's not a wonder that the ruling class is censoring the Internet.




 (http://www.clker.com/cliparts/c/8/f/8/11949865511933397169thumbs_up_nathan_eady_01.svg.hi.png) Exactly right! Thank you for telling it like it is.

I also welcome you.  (http://www.createaforum.com/gallery/renewablerevolution/3-301014181908.gif) (http://www.createaforum.com/gallery/renewablerevolution/3-141113185701.png)
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: agelbert on June 15, 2018, 10:22:13 AM
When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?

I first became aware that Business as Usual (BAU) was a death sentence for human civilization by reading Counterpunch in the late 1990's.

I continue to be suspicous of the peak oil movement simply because it is a back door defense of massive price hikes in fossil fuels. The very idea that fossil fuels are "precious to civilization" is the height of Orwellian discourse. Yes, they boosted the standard of living for a period of time, but the COST of that boost has been, and increasingly is, degraded democracy, a SEVERELY degraded biosphere, strife, misery, slave wages, more wars, more pollution and eventual collapse. Fossil fuels were NEVER a "free lunch".

(http://butthatsnoneofmybusiness.com/wp-content/uploads/2016/01/lobbyists.jpg)

I will ALWAYS refuse to accept the BULLSHIT that those massively polluting fossil fuels are "precious" AND "indispensable" to the survival of human civilization.

(http://renewablerevolution.createaforum.com/gallery/renewablerevolution/3-120118181944.png)

I refuse to allow the peak oil meme to become a convenient "supply and demand" manufactured artificial scarcity excuse for the Profit over Planet BASTARDS 🐉🦕🦖 😈 👹, who got us into this mess in the first place, to profit even more.

 
(http://renewablerevolution.createaforum.com/gallery/renewablerevolution/3-050517161058.png)

(https://img.ifcdn.com/images/d273dcf4828ebb04f55f650ce7e7b61133f10a0bc872adf4b502fdebf24a20a4_1.jpg)

(http://renewablerevolution.createaforum.com/gallery/renewablerevolution/3-240318144053.png)


(http://renewablerevolution.createaforum.com/gallery/renewablerevolution/3-240318143912.png)

(http://www.createaforum.com/gallery/renewablerevolution/3-181015183028.png)

(http://renewablerevolution.createaforum.com/gallery/renewablerevolution/3-230717132319.png)

(http://renewablerevolution.createaforum.com/gallery/renewablerevolution/3-240318144202.png)

Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Cam on November 11, 2019, 03:15:39 PM
I first became aware less than two months ago on September 13th, 2019 (yes Friday the 13th, what a coincidence right?). I'm in my last year of university up in Ontario, Canada, and this news blew me out of the water.

I found out through George Mobus' Question Everything. For a few weeks I cycled between "Wow this sucks" and "This is just a bad dream".  I went through (and am still processing now) some of the stages of grief, as this knowledge has taken away most of what would have been my life plans. I was planning on investing in index funds ("The market has been growing since the 1800's, why would it stop now?" I used to say), living frugally, and retiring early. Then I was going to start a family.

I no longer plan on having a family, and my money is no longer in the stock market. Things are still very much up in the air for me.  For now I am focusing on finishing my degree and enjoying each day as much as possible. I am glad to have found so many people who see what I now see. I sometimes feel crazy when I go about my business and see everyone just relaxing as if all this was going to continue indefinitely. So this is comforting to have a group to chat with, even if it is through a screen. All the best.
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: RE on November 12, 2019, 03:36:39 AM
It's been a gradual awakening, to be sure.

It began in the late 80s when I worked with Greenpeace on the criminal practices of Waste Management; then went to work on radioactive waste issues with an organization called Don't Waste US; began reading Matt Savinar's forum Life After the Oil Crash, Matt Simmons, Michael Ruppert's website From the Wilderness and his eye-opening book Crossing the Rubicon, John Pilger, Bruce Gagnon and The Global Network Against Weapons & Nuclear Power in Space, Noam Chomsky, Chris Hedges @ truthdig, Guy McPherson and Climate Change, the Organic Consumers Association (and its expose of the food industry's control over what we eat), and most importantly, the World Socialist Web Site ... reading, reading, reading ... and watching, i.e., films on Vietnam, Salvador, Ukraine, Syria, this country's relentless bombing, invading, destroying country after country, overthrowing governments, etc etc etc.

It's been a 30-year study of social inequality, the pursuit of escalating wars, the struggles of the working class, the silencing and vilification of whistleblowers (Assange/Snowden etc.), Wall Street's financial fraud, and so much more.

Well, you get the picture.

It's not a wonder that the ruling class is censoring the Internet.

:hi: Cam!

How did you find out about the Diner? ???

RE
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Surly1 on November 12, 2019, 03:53:33 AM
I first became aware less than two months ago on September 13th, 2019 (yes Friday the 13th, what a coincidence right?). I'm in my last year of university up in Ontario, Canada, and this news blew me out of the water.

I found out through George Mobus' Question Everything. For a few weeks I cycled between "Wow this sucks" and "This is just a bad dream".  I went through (and am still processing now) some of the stages of grief, as this knowledge has taken away most of what would have been my life plans. I was planning on investing in index funds ("The market has been growing since the 1800's, why would it stop now?" I used to say), living frugally, and retiring early. Then I was going to start a family.

I no longer plan on having a family, and my money is no longer in the stock market. Things are still very much up in the air for me.  For now I am focusing on finishing my degree and enjoying each day as much as possible. I am glad to have found so many people who see what I now see. I sometimes feel crazy when I go about my business and see everyone just relaxing as if all this was going to continue indefinitely. So this is comforting to have a group to chat with, even if it is through a screen. All the best.

Hi Cam, welcome.

All of us here have come to a similar realization at some point and have thought similar things. It's easy for folks to believe that tomorrow is going to look pretty much like today when today looks pretty much like yesterday.

We've known everything we need t know about resource consumption and growth for the last 40-50 years. But such knowledge is bad for quarterly profits.

(http://renewablerevolution.createaforum.com/styles/renewablerevolution/catimgs/11.jpeg)
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: K-Dog on November 12, 2019, 05:18:46 AM
I first became aware less than two months ago on September 13th, 2019 (yes Friday the 13th, what a coincidence right?). I'm in my last year of university up in Ontario, Canada, and this news blew me out of the water.

I found out through George Mobus' Question Everything. For a few weeks I cycled between "Wow this sucks" and "This is just a bad dream".  I went through (and am still processing now) some of the stages of grief, as this knowledge has taken away most of what would have been my life plans. I was planning on investing in index funds ("The market has been growing since the 1800's, why would it stop now?" I used to say), living frugally, and retiring early. Then I was going to start a family.

I no longer plan on having a family, and my money is no longer in the stock market. Things are still very much up in the air for me.  For now I am focusing on finishing my degree and enjoying each day as much as possible. I am glad to have found so many people who see what I now see. I sometimes feel crazy when I go about my business and see everyone just relaxing as if all this was going to continue indefinitely. So this is comforting to have a group to chat with, even if it is through a screen. All the best.

I had to go see what George has been up too and see he is sipping the anti-Capitalist tea.  I'm not being critical but I needed to see if you had been influenced by something recent.

Don't go off the deep end with your new knowledge.  You are entering a world of people who follow conclusions sometimes at their peril.  We have propensities to go off the deep end with our thinking.  Total ignorance or excessive sensitivity.  Blue pill red pill, I know my choice.  The good news for you is you sound like you are not too enmeshed in other peoples lives yet so you can actually pick a lifestyle consistent with what you now know.  Two months is not a long time and I don't think anyone in the doom world is predicting the future right so beware the conclusions, all of them. 

Once people start starving I think the whole game changes.

As someone who has been into this shit for decades I'm proof you can come out of this whole.  Relax, you were raised in a culture of empty values and now you are finding some.  Once you have it figured out you will be back on track in a good way.
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Nearingsfault on November 12, 2019, 05:34:00 AM
I first became aware less than two months ago on September 13th, 2019 (yes Friday the 13th, what a coincidence right?). I'm in my last year of university up in Ontario, Canada, and this news blew me out of the water.

I found out through George Mobus' Question Everything. For a few weeks I cycled between "Wow this sucks" and "This is just a bad dream".  I went through (and am still processing now) some of the stages of grief, as this knowledge has taken away most of what would have been my life plans. I was planning on investing in index funds ("The market has been growing since the 1800's, why would it stop now?" I used to say), living frugally, and retiring early. Then I was going to start a family.

I no longer plan on having a family, and my money is no longer in the stock market. Things are still very much up in the air for me.  For now I am focusing on finishing my degree and enjoying each day as much as possible. I am glad to have found so many people who see what I now see. I sometimes feel crazy when I go about my business and see everyone just relaxing as if all this was going to continue indefinitely. So this is comforting to have a group to chat with, even if it is through a screen. All the best.
hi cam,
On finances there is plenty to "invest" in that has nothing to do with markets and convention. I like Nicole Foss myself when it comes to money... She seems pretty much out of the game at this point but I saw her speak a few times and it affected me.in brief:
1 p
Avoid all debt if possible. Repay it as fast as possible even if there are so many voices around you telling you to invest in the market while carrying it... crazy
2 accumulate a financial nest egg of a minimum of 6 months of your total expenses.
3 Invest in food. Personally I prefer a revolving pantry of things I already eat just much more of them then most folks.
4 have a reserve of cash whether that is part of your nest egg or not is your call
5 invest in yourself activities that will be of use in a changed world. Good gear to do those activities.
6 cultivate the relationships with the type of people you want to become. Friendships are hard work at first if the person is of worth. Easy friendships dont challenge you to grow.

Boy that was pretty preachy...
Cheers...
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: RE on November 12, 2019, 06:58:48 AM
I first became aware less than two months ago on September 13th, 2019 (yes Friday the 13th, what a coincidence right?). I'm in my last year of university up in Ontario, Canada, and this news blew me out of the water.

I found out through George Mobus' Question Everything. For a few weeks I cycled between "Wow this sucks" and "This is just a bad dream".  I went through (and am still processing now) some of the stages of grief, as this knowledge has taken away most of what would have been my life plans. I was planning on investing in index funds ("The market has been growing since the 1800's, why would it stop now?" I used to say), living frugally, and retiring early. Then I was going to start a family.

I no longer plan on having a family, and my money is no longer in the stock market. Things are still very much up in the air for me.  For now I am focusing on finishing my degree and enjoying each day as much as possible. I am glad to have found so many people who see what I now see. I sometimes feel crazy when I go about my business and see everyone just relaxing as if all this was going to continue indefinitely. So this is comforting to have a group to chat with, even if it is through a screen. All the best.
hi cam,
On finances there is plenty to "invest" in that has nothing to do with markets and convention. I like Nicole Foss myself when it comes to money... She seems pretty much out of the game at this point but I saw her speak a few times and it affected me.in brief:
1 p
Avoid all debt if possible. Repay it as fast as possible even if there are so many voices around you telling you to invest in the market while carrying it... crazy
2 accumulate a financial nest egg of a minimum of 6 months of your total expenses.
3 Invest in food. Personally I prefer a revolving pantry of things I already eat just much more of them then most folks.
4 have a reserve of cash whether that is part of your nest egg or not is your call
5 invest in yourself activities that will be of use in a changed world. Good gear to do those activities.
6 cultivate the relationships with the type of people you want to become. Friendships are hard work at first if the person is of worth. Easy friendships dont challenge you to grow.

Boy that was pretty preachy...
Cheers...

I did several Interviews with Nicole.  You can find them on Diner YouTube and Diner Soundcloud.

I hit 6 out of 6 of the above Investments.  :icon_sunny:

I would add to that

7- Move to a Remote Location with good Resources

8- FORM COMMUNITY!

RE
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Nearingsfault on November 12, 2019, 04:31:04 PM
I first became aware less than two months ago on September 13th, 2019 (yes Friday the 13th, what a coincidence right?). I'm in my last year of university up in Ontario, Canada, and this news blew me out of the water.

I found out through George Mobus' Question Everything. For a few weeks I cycled between "Wow this sucks" and "This is just a bad dream".  I went through (and am still processing now) some of the stages of grief, as this knowledge has taken away most of what would have been my life plans. I was planning on investing in index funds ("The market has been growing since the 1800's, why would it stop now?" I used to say), living frugally, and retiring early. Then I was going to start a family.

I no longer plan on having a family, and my money is no longer in the stock market. Things are still very much up in the air for me.  For now I am focusing on finishing my degree and enjoying each day as much as possible. I am glad to have found so many people who see what I now see. I sometimes feel crazy when I go about my business and see everyone just relaxing as if all this was going to continue indefinitely. So this is comforting to have a group to chat with, even if it is through a screen. All the best.
Another Ontario person... I Just noticed...
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: RE on November 12, 2019, 06:13:17 PM
I first became aware less than two months ago on September 13th, 2019 (yes Friday the 13th, what a coincidence right?). I'm in my last year of university up in Ontario, Canada, and this news blew me out of the water.

I found out through George Mobus' Question Everything. For a few weeks I cycled between "Wow this sucks" and "This is just a bad dream".  I went through (and am still processing now) some of the stages of grief, as this knowledge has taken away most of what would have been my life plans. I was planning on investing in index funds ("The market has been growing since the 1800's, why would it stop now?" I used to say), living frugally, and retiring early. Then I was going to start a family.

I no longer plan on having a family, and my money is no longer in the stock market. Things are still very much up in the air for me.  For now I am focusing on finishing my degree and enjoying each day as much as possible. I am glad to have found so many people who see what I now see. I sometimes feel crazy when I go about my business and see everyone just relaxing as if all this was going to continue indefinitely. So this is comforting to have a group to chat with, even if it is through a screen. All the best.
Another Ontario person... I Just noticed...

Hoping Cam returns! 🤞   I upgraded to Member status so the posts will go up with out Moderation.

RE
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: Cam on November 13, 2019, 05:13:18 AM
@Surly1 Thanks for the support. It is crazy to me how many warnings we've ignored so far! The Limits to Growth in 1972, The World Scientists' Warning to Humanity in 1992, another letter in 2017 signed by 15,000 scientists around the world, and ‘World Scientists’ Warning of a Climate Emergency’ right here in 2019 signed by 11,000 scientists. It's wild to me what we're willing to ignore to continue growing. Also I like that comic. Sad but also makes me chuckle.

@RE I think I found it on George's blog roll. Glad I did! And thank you for the tips, I will keep these in mind  :)

@Nearingsfault Thank you for all these ideas. I will definitely be learning from Nicole Foss over Christmas break (school is real busy right now and I can't afford many distractions). As far as Ontarians go, are there a lot of us in the Diner?

@KDog When I first learned about all this it was a slap in the face when I read conclusions people were drawing. I am trying to be more careful now as I got into a rut where all I was putting into my head was predictions of collapse and human extinction. Not that I am disputing those, but focusing all my mental energy on that stuff was pretty draining. This past summer I learned about Stoicism and I know that is going to help me along the way. Thank you for the encouragement, it really helps!
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: RE on November 13, 2019, 05:24:22 AM
@Surly1 Thanks for the support. It is crazy to me how many warnings we've ignored so far! The Limits to Growth in 1972, The World Scientists' Warning to Humanity in 1992, another letter in 2017 signed by 15,000 scientists around the world, and ‘World Scientists’ Warning of a Climate Emergency’ right here in 2019 signed by 11,000 scientists. It's wild to me what we're willing to ignore to continue growing. Also I like that comic. Sad but also makes me chuckle.

@RE I think I found it on George's blog roll. Glad I did! And thank you for the tips, I will keep these in mind  :)

@Nearingsfault Thank you for all these ideas. I will definitely be learning from Nicole Foss over Christmas break (school is real busy right now and I can't afford many distractions). As far as Ontarians go, are there a lot of us in the Diner?

Did you see my recent Vid Interview with George?  He, K-Dog and myself also met up down in Seattle for a Doomer Dinner while I was there a few months ago.  It's up on Diner YouTube.

Far as active, participating Diners are concerned, NF is the only one from Ontario.  C5 hails from Nova Scotia.  We have many Hosers from the Great White North as Blog Readers though.

RE
Title: Re: When Did You Become Aware Of The Ongoing Collapse of Civilization?
Post by: RE on November 13, 2019, 05:29:31 AM
Here's the Interview with George in case you can't find it on the Utoob channel.

http://www.youtube.com/v/BlFU6sXn880

RE