TSHTF Podcast with Nicole Foss, Raul Ilargi Meijer & RE

logopodcastOff the microphones of Nicole Foss, Raul Meijer & RE

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Aired on the Doomstead Diner on August 9, 2015

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Discuss this Interview at the Podcast Table inside the Diner

Recently, Nicole Foss of The Automatic Earth returned to blogging after taking something of a hiatus over the last year.  I caught one of her recent pieces on the situation in China, and her partner Raul Meijer has been covering the situation in Greece extensively.

Besides the two ongoing clusterfucks of China & Greece, there's quite a bit of ongoing collapse related to climate, the recent publication by James Hansen on Sea Level Rise, and of course the Encyclical by the Vicar of Christ on Earth, His Holiness Pope Francis, Chief Spokesperson for some 1.2B members of the Holy Roman Catholic Church, not to mention all the hubbub about Near Term Human Extinction…. clearly no shortage of Collapse Topics to discuss! 🙂

It's been nearly 2 years since I first got together with Nicole to talk about Energy & Inflation & Deflation.  So this seemed like a good time to do an update, and I nailed her down for another chat this week.  She happens to be visiting with Raul in the Netherlands, so as a bonus in this conversation we got his input as well.

http://momsgrilledcheesetruck.com/wp-content/uploads/2013/03/Just-The-Facts-Maam-Moms-Grilled-Cheese-Truck.jpgNow, for those of you expecting to get the normal "Just the Facts, Ma'am"  type of presentation from Nicole in this Podcast, you may be slightly disappointed.   There definitely are a lot of facts jammed into this hour of KollapsnikTM chat.  However, because Nicole was chatting with both me and Raul, we kind of went off the rails a few times, and hilarity ensued.   I decided to leave some of it in there for a little entertainment value. 🙂  The stuff I cut out is even funnier, but sadly not for public consumption.  LOL.

Additionally, Nicole currently has a DVD in post production, discussing parameters of where you want to live, what kind of choices you can make moving ahead and so forth.  We currently have up a Doomstead Diner SurveyTM on places you DON'T want to live, still OPEN.  We'll have a new survey up next week on places you DO want to live.

Anyhow, crack open a bottle of your favorite beverage and enjoy the latest in Collapse from the Collapse CafeTM on the Doomstead Diner and the folks from The Automatic Earth.

Snippets:

 Nicole:

Just that the people need to understand that this is the model that we've been suggesting as to what's going to happen is not a theory, it's actually happening exactly the way we said it would. It's just not happening everywhere at the same time because systems that are predatory pick off the little sick ones first. They work from the periphery towards the center as you said. But where we're seeing things move more and more to the center now. And China has been the the global engine of liquidity for the last while,  and drives demand for absolutely everything.  That's now tipping over the edge and we are going to see those same consequences manifesting in countries in the center that do not see themselves as being in any way comparable to Greece, but they are, they're just not there yet.  The same dynamic ends up operating there. But when we tell people what's happening people, they tend to think "oh well that's just my theory", but it's not a theory,  it's actually happening and will in the future a lot more places…

RE:

Yeah it's an ongoing phenomenon it's definitely not something that is projected or happening in the future or something like that,  collapse is ongoing now,  it's happening and you can watch.  You can watch it  progress, you can see all the different places where it manifests itself. Greece is one of course and Puerto Rico now as well…

Raul:

Civil War…That makes me think…  People think the French are very good at protests right?   But they haven't seen the Chinese.  The Chinese do protests like nobody else does. (RE: Yea…they get serious about it…) because it's very bloody, very violent and I've been writing about this for years. I don't see how China can not end up in that kind of thing…

For the rest, LISTEN TO THE INTERVIEW!!!

25 Responses to TSHTF Podcast with Nicole Foss, Raul Ilargi Meijer & RE

  • endofmore says:

    A fascinating set of points of view–particuluarly from Nicole—we seem to speak the same language.

    But to define 'inflation', which seemed to be the subject of argument. Inflation is different for every individual. If I'm a peasant who buys flour to bake my own bread–via heat of course– and the cost of the flour and fuel rises, then the cost of the final product—essential bread, is drastically increased. If my wage (which is energy dependent) increases pro rata, then there is no inflation. If on the other hand, my income doesn't rise (because the energy that supports my wage isn't available), then the cost of my food is inflated. If the cost of flour and fuel goes on rising, with no wage increase (energy input), then ultimately the cost of essential food intake exceeds my income, and I starve.

    Which is just a long winded way of repeating what Charles Dickens said 150 years ago

    On the other hand if I'm earning $100,000 a year, then food/energy inflation isn't noticeable —and it is food inflation which is most critical

    interesting thoughts on China—ultimate problem unrest and breakup—just like USA, because like the USA it's just too big to hold together when there's no energy to maintain connective systems—transport–military and so on,

    must devolve into warlordism, which it was up to 100 years ago or so.

    You cannot pump oil just to supply the military—because the military functions on taxation, also the military functions by ongoing oil driven maintenance etc. A powerful military can only function in a prosperous society. Get that out of balance and you finish up with a world full of North Koreas, which I read yesterday has reduced its food ration to 316 grams (assume per day) when that collapse hits it's going to get very unpleasant indeed

     

    • RE says:

      They use a very specific definition of Inflation and Deflation, which is not what most people think of when they experience the phenomena in their daily lives.  They're talking about it on the gross monetary level of money supply and credit with respect to available goods & services, not the actual price any particular thing comes in at.  It's a good definition from the POV of trying to elucidate what is going on overall, but not so good if you want to look at how it affects a given individual and given location.  You can have both effects occuring in different places, especially if you consider that different currencies may be used in those different places.  It can manifest as a relative difference in how the currencies are valued against each other.

      Everyone agrees the system (including Nation-States like the FSoA) will end up breaking up.  Figuring the timeline on that and precisely what type of organizations will replace them is a much harder thing to do.

      Far as just pumping oil to supply the military, that can go on as long as the military is capable of maintaining control over the whole system, including the fields it is pumped from and the refineries where it is turned to usable product, and the transportation and logistics they need to move it around.  That can persist a bit longer than the consumer based economy, but not by a great length of time.

      RE

    • Endofmore says:

      I agee—the military can go on pumping up to a point, and no one knows when that is of course

      Just like ISIL in a sense, still managing to extract some oil for their military needs.

      but of coure the oil technology system ultimately needs a backup of complex industry, which itself will be in fail mode. the military cant man and maintain every aspect of the supply-production system unless they conscipt everybody

       

      oops—did i just say feudalism?

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  • I found myself, once again, favourably impressed by Nichole Foss. (It amused me to consider the strange attractions of the human heart that she is able to work well with Raul Ilargi Meijer, who provided some interesting technical comments at the beginning of that recording, but then appeared to be petulant, in my opinion.)

    I hope that their "wild-assed guess" that the price of oil dropping to twenty dollars a barrel would not come true, because I would personally find that to be embarrassing. Despite being intellectually aware of the mathematics of exponential functions, I continue to be justifiably accused of this:

    "The greatest shortcoming of the human race is our inability to understand the exponential function."

     

    — Al Bartlett

     

    I continue to be SURPRISED by things developing at exponential rates. I continue to be SURPRISED by the wildly "counter-intuitive" results of human systems being based upon ENFORCED FRAUDS, where everything was controlled by the ability to back up lies with violence, which has the potential for extremely wildly osciallating phenomena when we reach the points where that violence is no longer able to back up those lies. In my view, we can NOT fully comprehend the degree to which the world was being dominated by ENFORCED FRAUDS, which suffers from the profound problems that social successes based on being able to back up lies with violence never stops those lies from still being false. Therefore, AT EXPONENTIAL RATES, there is a head of steam being built up in pressure cookers whose safety values have been welded shut.

    • RE says:

      Roel is kind of a grumpy curmudgeon, and I am an asshole.  LOL.  Nicole has to deal with that if she talks with both of us at the same time.  She's relatively unflappable and can keep going on her spin regardless though, so it works pretty good.  Long as she is there to spin out data, Roel & me don't get on each other's nerves too much and we can more or less stick to topic.  It's an interesting conversational dynamic.

      Far as Oil Price goes, you have to remember the ownership dynamic and how the credit is distributed.  Say you were the first guy to make it to the Big Island of Hawaii in your catamaran rigged sailing canoe.  You are declared King and Owner of Hawaii in gratitude for getting everyone there safely.  You issue out Credit to buy the Pineapples, which there are plenty of at the beginning, and few people. When the supply of pineapples diminishes and the population increases, are you going to issue out more or less credit?  Less obviously, and that's the deflation.  Less credit goes out, less purchasing power…DEFLATION!

      Final price level for a barrel of Oil?  Short on Oil has it around $11.76 in about 5 years.  After that, the extraction of whatever is still left basically halts.  It no longer has an economic value relative to its extraction cost.

      RE

      • Etyerepetyere says:

        I see you censored my very  first comment here .. Thats Ok because that`s when i know i am right "truth is extreme to make it moderate is to lie " you are the ones who are making it moderate .. as of the "asshole"`s comment . Oil extraction will never halt . People have to eat that’s why it will be subsidised and be continued at whatever cost to society because the other alternative would be to lay down and die  and nobody will do that  ..that simple 

        • endofmore says:

          "subsidised" implies money

          But you cannot subsidise a failing oil economy with money, because all money is underpinned by energy—namely oil. 

          That's the whole basis of our 'energy driven' economy (on the global scale). It is necessary to use energy (sinking an oil well) in order to obtain more energy (pumping the oil out); as long as the energy input is less than the energy output, our civilisation can continue. When energy input is greater than energy output, then it's game over.

          it really is that simple.

          • Etyerepetyere says:

            Hitler was making oil out of coal . Even back in those days  to run against the whole freaking world and almost succeseded . South africa was doing the same thing under the apartheid because of economic sanctions and they had a really good working economy  and those were the old days how much more will this be a case today or tomorrow when technology is way way more advanced  than back than  . Energy input is not a problem since there is available energy ressources  plenty in the form of for example coal peat etc they just be  running an inefficient conversion to make usable form of energy in the form of fuel to drive combustion engines to keep up the essential things like agriculture and transport .. Maybe private usage will be curbed and scaled back but this will go on heavily subsidized no matter what because as i said  the other alternative will be to lay down and die . and nobody will do that . The question is how much the planet can take the beating of pollution co2 and methane .. But the smartasses here told us (listen to from minute 31 here ) thats not a worry so  Maybe things are going to be scaled back and thats inconvininient but not the end of the world …Thats how things are 

      • Ed says:

        Not true.  Deflation is the decrease of the money supply or credit relative to resources.  Hence as the supply of pinapples decreases you have to issue less new credit in equal measure.  Result no deflation.  Please keep up.  ps. Nicole Foss is awesome.

  • Endofmore says:

    Of course Hitler was making oil from coal during WW2—for a very short time. I think it was around 150000 B/d

    The problem was he needed slave labour to do it, and left a colossal mess.

    Which corresponds with the apartheid economy—again, the black African workforce were being paid, but their living standards were very poor, they were little better than slaves. They had a 'good working economy'—unless you were a slave working in Hitler's mines or an African working in their mines during apartheid.

    The oil from coal economy was being subsidised with slave energy, not money. In the long term it is unsustainable. They even ran cars on gas derived from wood—practical–sort of–but unsustainable.

    You cannot subsidise energy output with money input

    • Etyerepetyere says:

      I never told you subsidy with money . What i am talking about is producing energy (here in the form of oil ) with surplus energy subsidy like coal . Higher amount  of mass and energy which is unuseable but has an innate of high energy content  to convert to lower amount but useable energy type for specific purposes to keep essential needs and  services  going . Subsidy in this case is not money but tangible pgysical matter energy content . There is no problem with that from the physics prospective . It is sustainable until there is enough coal … there is plenty of that for a few more  centuries . On that timescale this is irrelevant for us .  Also your statement that this process was subsidized by slave labour is absolutely incorrect the roman empire and the Confederate states were subsidised buy slave labour coal to oil process is all mechanized and has still a positive energy surplus until there is coal to convert  The only question is  just how the planet reacts in the form of climatechange and effects because of the pollution it causes  .. But the yahoos in the discussion told us that thats not a problem so it is all good . No worry here 

      • endofmore says:

        you need manpower to extract the coal—hence Hitler's slave labour system

        And no–there isn't enough coal to last for centuries.

        But—i feel a brainpain coming on—my doctor has warned me about that…apparently brick walls are not good for heads—even one as thick as mine.

        So better leave it at that.–I can find better uses for my head.

        • Etyerepetyere says:

          Yes . Manpower  so did the british starting the industrial revolution . They just needed the steam engine (also running on coal to speed up and mechanize the process ) Guess what!that was 250years ago . Now up here in British columbia and Alberta  we have coalmines being run from 50 km s away with one guy in an office with a computer and a joystick speak of human slave labour mining mechanized to a level of ZERO human labour physical input . That can give one a headache . I thought headaches were an excuse for wives to excuse themselves from whatnot ..but there is another use for them i can tell now . Anyway what i wanted to get to was that energy is not the problem whatsoever there is tremendous amount of energy left to run the show . The real question is if the planet can take it because of the pollution . And this is the real problem what was completely ignored and dismissed by these two yahoos namely  of Nicole Foss and this meyer guy . This is the real question anything else is just merely conivinience 

          • Ed says:

            Sorry Etyerepetyere, it's all about energy in relation to population size. Specifically the phase difference between NET fossil energy extraction and  population numbers being unmatched in real time.  ie. a period of time equal to a few decades where the NET fossil energy extraction will decrease at the same time as population continues to increase.   Basically, population numbers cannot respond quick enough to a change in NET energy extraction.  

            I have said it on numerous comments in other places and I'll say it again here.  We, the Human Species, need to build out the fossil energy extenders like 'renewables' and use the little extra time that this gives us to voluntarily reduce our population size.  eg. plan ahead.  There are loads of interesting reasons why this won't happen of course, rooted in basic human behaviour.

  • tagio says:

    RE,

    Thanks for this interview!  I look forward to the new Foss DVD, but if the first recomendation is to move to the Southern Hemisphere to maximize distance from the nukes as your only hope, I am going to be majorly bummed. 

    Good job. 

     

    • Etyerepetyere says:

      You see these two Yahoos are  just in it  for the business they are fearmongering with nuclear war, and what was it ? The chinese and them easterly Indians running the place over looking for a livable place because they are running out of living space of their own making I.E. sensless mindless procreative activities (but i digress) Where was i ?! So they are trying to make you anxiuos for reasons secondary so they can sell you DVDs with their "great" insights and or solutions . But they wont get into hot waters and discuss the real issue .. Climate change and the ablity of the planet to host life  that means the  very existence of life and a living planets survival ? Why ! ? Because thats no business for them if they cant sell you half ass theories and solutions of their own making .. These people are sharlatans ! Nicole Foss shame on you Mejer maki shame on you 

  • "Less credit goes out, less purchasing power…DEFLATION!"

    Yes, the "money" as "credit" is being created out of nothing as debts: governments ENFORCE FRAUDS by privately controlled banks. Hence, we operate through a fundamentally fraudulent financial accounting system, while everyone has been running on those debt engine treadmills. We have been measuring everything with bent rubber rulers, through integrated systems of legalized lies, backed by legalized violence, whose social successfulness has increasingly PARADOXICAL longer term consequences, due to the underlying issue that backing up lies with violence never stops those lies from still being false. Therefore, the degree of social successfulness based upon ENFORCING FRAUDS relentlessly has driven civilization to become more psychotic. Since the political economy is based upon triumphant organized crime, which almost totally gets away with that, the longer term results are that civilization manifests runaway criminal insanities. However, since each short to medium increment continues to be based on the ability to go on backing up lies with violence, as well as that there are deeply ingrained social habits to take that almost completely for granted, in ways which deliberately deny and ignore the degree to which everything is based upon ENFORCING FRAUDS, the underlying fraudulence of civilization has been developing at an exponential rate.

    Too much "money" made out of nothing (with too little disappearing back to nothing):

    INFLATION

    Too little "money" made out of nothing (with too much disappearing back to nothing):

    DEFLATION

    That was the view I heard presented in the audio above from  2-3 minute marks.

    In "normal" times, we were used to the supply of "money" always inflating slightly,

    (compared to the supply of available goods and services to be paid for with that.)

    I still have a hard time thinking about the "new normal" or "paranormal" times …

    Anyway, I went looking for Web site statements being attributed to  "Short on Oil"

    While the basic physical and environmental facts appear to be straightforward …

    (although the details of the data can not be trusted)

    since the political economy is based on ENFORCED FRAUDS,

    the ways that those systems respond to relatively objective facts

    takes us to STRANGE Wonderland Matrix Bizarro World.

    As the interview recording above stated from the 2 to 3 minute mark, they define inflation and deflation in terms of monetary policy. However, that "monetary policy" is actually based upon ENFORCED FRAUDS, due to the history of triumphant organized crime being able to control civilization. Therefore, the issues with respect to the public "money" supply being made out of nothing, and disappearing back to nothing, as debts do, and the relative rates with which those happen, compared to the otherwise relatively constant supply of goods and services, can drive apparent inflation or deflation. However, since all of the monetary policy is due to the best organized gangsters, the international banksters, being able to orchestrate the behavior of national governments through their puppet politicians, who are voted for my enough of the masses of muppets, the existence of their "credit" is based upon the existence and dominance of organized crime controlling civilization, in ways which have always existed, but ways which progress in physical science have enabled to grow bigger and BIGGER at an exponential rate!

    The "solutions" to the problems caused by triumphant organized crime will be more organized crime. Indeed, that is why I recommend the view that the only genuine solutions would have to be better organized crime. The GREAT PARADOXES and widening Grand Canyon Chasms between progress in physical science, without that being surpassed by progress in political science, are due to human energy systems operating in ways which NECESSARILY match the principles and methods of organized crime. However, at the same time, that is CONSISTENTLY done through being as dishonest about itself as possible, which dishonesty becomes the dominant social stories, due to those lies being backed by violence.

    The overall results are that people think about general energy systems in the most absurdly backward ways possible, as illustrated by how the concept of entropy had it meaning inverted by inserting arbitrary minus signs into the entropy equations of thermodynamics and information theory. The Wonderland Matrix Bizarro World that we are living inside of is due to a long history of warfare based upon backing up deceits with destruction morphing to become political economy based upon ENFORCED FRAUDS. Within that context, one can perceive different levels of problems. The FIRST level is that most people do not know, and do not want to know, how and why civilization operates according to the principles and methods of organized crime. The SECOND level is that the few who do recognize the degree to which the real world is being controlled by the biggest gangsters, the banksters, also tend to not know, and to not want to know, how and why civilization operates according to the principles and methods of organized crime.

    The actual "solutions" to the various problems generated by civilization being controlled by organized crime will also NECESSARILY arise out of the applications of the principles and methods of organized crime. Those actual "solutions" will most probably continue to operate through the maximum possible deceits and frauds, and therefore, those "solutions" will continue to most probably be as absurdly backwards as those possibly could be.

    Basically, civilization is dominated by the biggest bullies' bullshit social stories, which are the most absurdly backwards they could become. Those world views are what have allowed and enabled civilization to behave in ways which became increasingly psychotic, runaway criminal insanities. Furthermore, those world views are also how and why the most probable "solutions" for the problems thereby created will also become even more so. The GREAT PARADOXES due to civilization being NECESSARILY controlled by the principles and methods of organized crime, which CONSISTENTLY also does that through lying about that being done as much as possible, while those lies were backed up by violence, has resulted in civilization becoming more criminally insane than is possible to fully comprehend. That is especially the case, due to the root causes being chronic political problems, which must be perpetually resolved, namely the death control systems have always existed, and must necessarily exist, while those developed to actually be done through the maximum possible deceits and treacheries, which also then enable the financialization of the political economy to become more and more totally dominated by ENFORCED FRAUDS.

    By definition, the limits to growth must necessarily mean changes in the death control systems. However, due to the degree that the existing systems are based upon triumphant organized crime, those existing systems have become runaway criminal insanities, and their "solutions" will most probably become even more so. Such craziness will result in more and more wild oscillations in various ways that will probably appear "counter-intuitive!"  As the podcast above reviewed, the debt insanities, provoking death insanities, will most probably work their way from the bottom and the periphery towards the top and the center. Meanwhile, there continues to appear to be nothing which is politically possible about that, since, FIRST, the world necessarily operates death control systems, which back up debt control systems, that work according to the principles and methods of organized crime, while those who became the best at doing that were the best available professional liars and immaculate hypocrites, to the degree that, SECOND, having any saner discussions and resolutions of those problems is practically impossible.

    Human beings have managed to achieve EXTREMELY PARADOXICAL systems of artificial selection, which were driven by the surrounding systems of natural selection. Human intelligence was originally the internalization of natural selection, and then, that intelligence was primarily applied to the most significant selection pressure, which was other groups of human beings, in order to drive the history of warfare whose successfulness was based upon deceits, and then drove the development of political economy based upon ENFORCED FRAUDS. Therefore, human civilization has painted itself into a corner, where all of the most socially successful people are the best available professional liars and immaculate hypocrites. That makes it doubly difficult, to the point of practically impossible, to develop better death control systems, which must be central to everything else.

    Theoretically speaking, we need profound paradigm shifts in the ways that we perceive political problems. I emphasize PROFOUND, in the same sense as that there have already been series of profound paradigm shifts in the history of the development of science. Indeed, theoretically speaking, the needed intellectual scientific revolutions required in political science should surpass those already achieved in physical science. However, from the point of view of practical politics, at the present time, such transformations appear to obviously be quite IMPOSSIBLE! There is now almost nothing but a core of organized crime, surrounded by controlled opposition groups, both of which are based upon operating through systems of organized crime in ways that lie about that to the maximum possible degree.  Those lies are FIRST about that there is that organized crime, and SECOND, those lies are about that there must necessarily be some sort of organized crime.

    We now have the situation that governments are the biggest forms of organized crime, controlled by the best organized gangs of criminals, while they almost totally get away with lying about that, especially since they control their publicly significant opposition groups to also lie about that, and indeed, to lie about that in the most profound ways possible. Not only are the existing money/murder systems based upon FRAUDS ENFORCED, but also, the only publicly significant opposition promotes the most extremely unrealistic "solutions" to those problems, because those sorts of bogus "solutions" stay within the same frame of reference, which does not admit and address the necessarily central features of the death control systems.

    Industrial civilization became based upon DEBT SLAVERY, which was due to triumphant organized crime. That has generated numbers which have become DEBT INSANITIES, which are headed towards provoking DEATH INSANITIES. However, by and large, there continues to be overwhelming attitudes of deliberate ignorance and denial of the deeper reasons for how and why that happened. Human civilization has ended up in a self-created cul de sac, where its artificial selection systems are based on backing up lies with violence, and that tends to apply to the bogus "solutions" just as much as to the deeper reasons for the original problems, namely the PARADOXICAL CONSISTENCY of civilization being controlled by the principles and methods of organized crime.

    That PARADOXICAL CONSISTENCY is the obstacle in the way of developing any better human artificial selection systems. In general, at the present time, natural selection pressures have driven human beings to develop civilizations which have become based on runaway criminal insanities, which manifest both in the ways that the actual organized crime gets away with misrepresenting itself, as well as gets away with doing that so totally because it also controls its apparent opposition, so that the whole system operates in the most absurdly backward ways possible. Progress in physical science has been channeled through social pyramid systems based on backing up lies with violence. That has resulted in the overall civilization becoming increasingly psychotic and criminally insane, although doing that can be seen as having been PARADOXICALLY CONSISTENT.

    The industrial revolutions enabled strip-mining the planet's natural resources at exponential rates, which is now running into various limits of diminishing returns. Theoretically, that requires the development of different human, industrial and natural ecologies. However, the paths we are now on are towards PEAK INSANITIES due to the degree that civilization can not currently reconcile its own energy systems with the industrial and natural energy systems, due to civilization being almost totally dominated by the biggest bullies' bullshit world views, which are as absurdly backward as possible, and which continue to be ENFORCED FRAUDS which automatically become ever more absurdly backwards.

    The only genuine resolutions to our real problems demand the development of better organized crime. However, such developments are obstructed both by the core of organized crime actually operating now, as well as by the layers of controlled opposition that grew up around that core of organized crime. Thus, the basic social pyramid systems of Neolithic styles of civilization are THE PROBLEM. Being able to achieve social success through backing up lies with violence has been pumped up and UP by progress in physical science, while the PARADOXICALLY CONSISTENT CONTRADICTIONS arising from doing that have been growing at an exponential rate … until those problems are finally reaching some of the real environmental limits and diminishing returns with respect to being able to continue to do that.

    In my view, it is almost impossible to exaggerate the degree to which our current kind of civilization deliberately regards itself in the most absurdly backward ways possible. I express that as being that the only genuine solutions to our problems require developing better organized crime, which view is simultaneously based upon facing the social facts that the biggest gangsters are controlling controlling civilization through ENFORCING FRAUDS, as well as facing the deeper reasons for how and why that was NECESSARILY the case. That is my attempt to express something which has no widely understood language to be expressed through, since there is no general understanding of the basic facts that governments are the biggest forms of organized crime, controlled by the best organized gangs of criminals, especially since those few who do approach perceiving those facts still almost always the recommend bogus "solutions" which are NOT possible, based upon somehow stopping human beings from operating as entropic pumps of energy flows.

    Meanwhile, the problems with respect to the globalized Neolithic Civilization working their way in from the bottom and periphery towards the top and center are obviously accelerating, yet, at the same time, those nearer the top and the center have not had to face those facts, but rather, mostly continue to think and behave in the same ways as before. Indeed, since Earth is a big planet, compared to human beings, it will take a while for the strip-mining, even at exponential rates, to reach some significant turning or tipping points that effect the central core and top of the established social pyramid systems' abilities to continue to live through their systems of organized lies operating robberies. The established sets of DUALITIES, along with their false fundamental dichotomies, and related impossible ideals, dominate the currently established social pyramid systems, so that the biggest gangs of criminals, controlled by the best organized gangs of criminals are able to get away with presenting themselves publicly as the opposite of that, while their publicly significant controlled opposition stays within the same frame of reference, in the sense that they promote bogus "solutions" based upon somehow stopping governments operating in those ways. However, the paradigm shifts that I promote are based upon starting to use more UNITARY MECHANISMS, which make more sense from the perspective of all sociopolitical systems operating through the same energy. Ideally, that means we would better reconcile our understanding of natural selection systems with artificial selection systems, EXCEPT, as I outlined above, for the PARADOXICAL CONSISTENCY that the existing artificial selection systems are based upon the maximum possible ENFORCED FRAUDS.

    In the end, my view is that we are already committed to going through severe levels of death insanities. Those are the default "solutions" that social pyramid systems are set up to manifest. In that context, the deeper questions are what sort of new death control systems might survive and emerge through those trials and tribulations ??? What I recommend is that our political science should go through series of intellectual scientific revolutions, whose profound paradigm shifts incorporate and surpass those paradigm shifts which have already been achieved in physical science. We already have globalized systems of electronic monkey money frauds, backed by the threat of force from apes with atomic bombs. Therefore, the potential for debt insanities to provoke death insanities has already been astronomically amplified by many orders of magnitude greater than ever before in known human history.

    Wild oscillations inside of the systems of ENFORCED FRAUDS that manifested more significant levels of DEFLATION would be much more destabilizing that we can fully imagine, since there has been nothing like that happen for a long, long time, and would clearly propel the "new normal" even further into becoming "paranormal." Such DEFLATION would probably be much more significantly knocking over dominoes on the periphery of the system, in ways which could have serious potential to knock on the core. Any such DEFLATION would indicate the ability to ENFORCE FRAUDS was running into real limits, in ways that more FRAUDS ENFORCED would not be able to effectively respond to. In my view, the basic problems are always due to the ways that social success based upon being able to back up lies with violence never is able to thereby stop those lies from still being false. Therefore, I see no ways that the established systems of ENFORCED FRAUDS can be corrected by anything within their own frame of reference, which includes that the various controlled opposition groups that already surround those entrenched systems of ENFORCED FRAUDS also have nothing to really offer which is any better, because those kinds of controlled opposition groups actually stay within the same frame of reference too.

    Our political problems are reaching the point where nothing less than profound paradigm shifts in the basic frame of reference is enough to resolve those problems. Of course, before that happens, we appear to have to go through some series of psychotic breakdowns first, such as what would be caused if there really happened to occur such significant DEFLATION that that wiped out the future “productive” capacity to continue to extract natural resources. We appear already committed to have to go through significant and severe social storms, due to debt insanities provoking death insanities. Indeed, that may well be so severe that there will not be enough time for our technologically based civilization to change its philosophy of science enough to survive through those events? But nevertheless, IF technological civilization survives, that will only be possible if its political science goes through series of profound paradigm shifts, indeed, which are so profound that nobody now can fully imagine that!

  • Etyerepetyere says:

    @Blair T. Longley “the point where nothing less than profound paradigm shifts in the basic frame of reference is enough to resolve those problems”……. Like what kind of paradigm shift ?!….. the dissolution of the timespace continuum !? UFO`s anyone ?!

    • Mostly a creative synthesis of post-modernizing science with ancient mysticism.

      The vast majority of people continue to take for granted the common sense views that time and space are independent absolutes. However, the fact that atomic bombs go boom is proof that time and space are relative. Indeed, those are relative illusions. Time dilates and space contracts, as one approaches pure energy.

      I have been developing that line of thought for several decades. Attempting to develop uses of the English language which can cope with the paradoxes that follow from ideas like "Energy is Spirit" or "Entropy is the Scientific Satan" and so on and so forth. I will not attempt to condense all of that into this little reply.

      However, the basic concepts are SUBTRACTION, and following from that, ROBBERY.

      The biggest bullies bullshit social stories have attempted to reverse the presentation of those insights as much as possible. I repeat, the most abstract of the paradigm shifts are to recognize the deeper meanings of the ways that arbitrary minus signs were inserted into the entropy equations, which reversed the meaning of entropy. Since entropy is the way that energy is distributed in time and space, changing our basic concepts about time and space should have also changed the ways that we perceive entropy. However, the biggest bullies promoted their preferred bullshit world view, which deliberately suppressed genuine spirituality, due to the established social pyramid systems being based on backing up lies with violence, in ways which deliberately kept most other people ignorant and afraid.

      The special theory of relativity, that made atomic bombs possible, is the leading example of the pervasive ways that profound paradigm shifts in physical science have NOT be followed by profound paradigm shifts in political science. I am NOT asserting that entropy itself can be reversed, but that the ways we perceive and think about entropy have already been inverted, and perverted, while we tend to take that for granted, due to the overall degree to which the biggest bullies' bullshit world view dominates pretty well everything almost totally.

      The existence of atomic bombs, actually based on ideas that PROVE our common sense presumptions regarding time and space were WRONG, is the leading edge of the rest of the growing contradictions of progress in physical science, being channeled through social pyramid systems based upon backing up lies with violence. In that context, I am NOT recommending "the dissolution of the timespace continuum," but rather, I am recommending correcting the enormous errors in the old-fashioned philosophy of science that almost everyone practically continues to take for granted.

      I have ZERO first-hand knowledge about "UFOs." I try to remain open-mined about that, although I have actually no direct knowledge about those possibilities. However, I would assert that: "WE HAVE BECOME OUR OWN ALIENS."

      Everywhere one looks progress in science and technology ends up being applied to become better at backing up lies with violence. Almost nowhere does such progress get applied to political science itself! Hence, I REPEAT, the extreme and growing contradictions that things like the special theory of relativity have been PROVEN, by an abundance of experiments, including that atomic bombs go boom, while, at the same time, none of the deeper ideas that the special theory of relativity was based upon have any manifestation within politics, other than the psychotic development of atomic bombs, leading the way towards the similarly psychotic development of atomic energy technologies in general

      Of course, the same could be said about quantum mechanics, which has been experimentally confirmed to astonishing degrees, and which things like electronic technologies depend upon. HOWEVER, at the same time that our politics has developed globalized electronics, those are most importantly used to operate electronically automated, financial frauds!

      I have been collecting radical and revolutionary ideas for several decades, while attempting to synthesize them, and express that kind of megasythesis through the English language. You are superficially correct that I am recommending "the dissolution of the timespace continuum." However, the ways that I am promoting that are the ways that has already happened in physical science, like the special theory of relativity and quantum mechanics. What we have now is the GROWING contradictions of globalized electronic frauds, backed by atomic bombs, while the basic ideas that made that electronic and atomic power possible are found nowhere in the realm of political science, since that continues to almost totally operate in ways which take for granted the biggest bullies' bullshit world view, which is as absurdly backwards as possible!

      "The dissolution of the timespace continuum" ALREADY HAPPENED, when electronic and atomic power were developed upon the basis of profound paradigm shifts in the ways that we thought about time and space. What has NOT happened is any matching, much less surpassing, changes in political science. Rather, politics continues to be almost totally dominated by various old-fashioned religions and ideologies, that adamantly refuse to change their metaphysical presumptions.

      Human artificial selection systems should be understood within the context of natural selection systems. However, everything regarding that continues to be quite deliberately denied and disregarded by the currently existing kinds of political processes, which tend to continue to retell the same old stupid social stories, but while now using more fantastic special effects to tell those stories. Our politics is much like how there are now dozens and dozens of big budget movies, that have taken the juvenile comic books about superheros, and presented those with vastly improved special effects. Overall, there EXIST globalized electronic monkey money frauds, backed by the threat of force from apes with atomic bombs. The profound paradigm shifts that I promote with respect to perceiving political problems are based upon thinking in similar ways to how the previous profound paradigm shifts already happened in the physical sciences that made those technologies possible.

      Of course, meanwhile, we are running out of time for such paradigm shifts to occur, since those often used to take several generations to be accomplished. Instead, we are rushing faster and faster towards debt insanities provoking death insanities. We are NOT adapting in any saner ways to the limits of the environment, due to the ways that civilization is almost totally dominated by ENFORCED FRAUDS, which are based upon deliberately ignoring and denying the most basic laws of nature, as much as possible, and by presenting those basic laws of nature in the most absurdly backward ways possible.

      Therefore, our civilization does NOT take seriously the principle of the conservation of energy, while we have inverted the meaning of entropy. I am NOT suggesting that we overthrow those basic laws of nature. What I am suggesting is that our civilization has already suppressed and/or perverted our understanding of those laws of nature as much as possible. It would correct some of our errors to recognize what those ENORMOUS ERRORS were, when the history of science, as a social enterprise, was historically forced to compromise with the biggest bullies' bullshit world views. It was NOT an accidental mistake that we have ended up living inside of a Wonderland Matrix Bizarro World, where everything is presented in the most absurdly backward ways possible. It was not an accidental mistake that our civilization operates through there being a core of organized crime, which is surrounded by layers of controlled opposition groups, and that those controlled opposition groups stay within the same bullshit frame of reference as was originally promoted by the biggest bullies, and therefore, almost all of the bogus "solutions" to the real problems promoted by the various controlled opposition groups are also absurdly backwards.

      • Etyerepetyere says:

        This looks really substantial first look Thank you i`ll try chew myself thru this the night 

      • Etyerepetyere says:

        bad habits are hard to break . moreof this is beyond habitual it is ingrained due to millennial and historical habituation . This cant wont be changed systemically but collapse brought by its unsustainability which is now in a accelerated phase due to the quickening mostly brought by population increase and its resource demands pollution etc this just might be the nuclear reaction in a sort of slow motion as of this moment still just in its first nanosecond afar  So it looks yet as no biggie . but biggie it is !  It will turn out in 10 years ? Its gonna be a huge explosion  .. In the movie Ed Wood the slaughterhouse guy who financed his movies said .. "No ! I want the movie to end in a huge explosion .". He also wanted to have his idiot son to have some leading role .. That’s the masses of our days  but also in old days not ever any original idea will come of them so social political economical reform is impossible ..forget about it . The only sane person was Ed Woods girlfriend who shouted out loud in the movie`s wrap party;  "You people are insane these movies are terrible "  …. But ; from the prospective of the viewer they are  entertaining …thats where i am at 

  • "… it is ingrained due to millennial and historical habituation."

    Unfortunately, that is also the way I must see things too, Etyerepetyere!

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